The NBA trade deadline is behind us, and despite all the smoke around the Sacramento Kings over the last few weeks, there was very little fire.
Monte McNair’s biggest move was trading Cory Joseph to the Detroit Pistons for Delon Wright. Wright is a combo guard who should be able to take CoJo’s minutes and provide a higher level of production than Joseph did. This move has financial impacts for next summer, as the Kings will have limited cap flexibility to retain Richaun Holmes.
Also of note, the Kings traded Nemanja Bjelica to the Miami Heat for Maurice Harkless and Chris Silva. Harkless has been limited this year, spending time on the injury list and some time in Covid protocols. It’s unclear how much he might bring to the Kings bench unit. Silva is a younger player, but hasn’t shown a lot for Kings fans to get excited about.
The Kings also acquired Terence Davis from the Toronto Raptors for a second round pick. The Kings didn’t give up much, and will have RFA rights on Davis, but Davis arrives with baggage. Davis was the subject of a domestic assault investigation in October 2020. Five of the charges were dropped by the New York District Attorney in February, with two remaining charges set to be resolved if Davis remains out of trouble for one year. But the NBA’s internal investigation is ongoing and could still result in additional fines or suspensions. Davis also made headlines during the Orlando bubble for violating the league’s mask rule, arriving for a game wearing a mask with a hole cut in it. The cost to acquire Davis was low, but with potential league discipline looming, it’s hard to understand why the Kings wanted to acquire him.
All in all, it’s hard to feel anything but disappointment after this deadline. There was speculation that anyone on the team could be traded with the exception of Fox and Haliburton. And yet when the Kings face the Warriors tonight, they’ll look pretty much the same as before. McNair made a minor upgrade at the backup point guard position, and that’s pretty much it. No big dump to improve the Kings lottery odds, no big acquisitions to help the Kings make a run at the playoffs.
The trade deadline often represents a moment of clarification. It’s a time to see which direction your team is heading. And yet the Kings are as rudderless as they’ve been all year.
Personally, I’m not as mad as some Kings fans are about today. I think I’m too far gone to truly care. I should be mad that the Kings didn’t do something notable, but I’m mostly just annoyed that I have to spend the rest of the year watching essentially the same middle-of-the-road team I’ve had to watch all year. There’s nothing for me to be excited about for the second half of the year.
Don’t get me wrong, I like watching Fox and Haliburton, but the Kings are just treading water and appear destined to pick, yet again, in the 8-12 range of the draft. I’ve seen this movie before. I was hoping Monte McNair would show me something new.
Most of all I just wanted to get some insight on Monty’s direction for this team. Instead, we got this. I suppose staying in Desolation Row is a direction?
Maybe the insight is that Monte’s direction is Vivek’s direction.
This! Adding, maybe McNair saw we don’t have the assets to make the moves that jump off the page.
From rumors, we tried for Bey with Bagley and Smart with Barnes. I would have really liked nabbing Bey.
The direction points to them wanting to win on the go as opposed to dumping our players and rebuilding. I think we will eventually have to dump Hield because Barnes seems more of our type of guy (adding value with production).
Fox, Wright, Guy
Haliburton, James, Jeffries, Ramsey
Hield, Davis, Woodard, Harkless
Barnes, Metu, Bagley, Silva
Holmes, Whiteside,
woodard, ramsey, guy, metu are all trash players
You reached that conclusion from the numerous amounts of video we have on them?
How can you really say that about those names except for guy? Even Kyle has small sample size, but I just don’t see him being a NBA regular after a couple of years on NBA fringe.
This comment was trash, have another thumbs down … hard to hit double digits on one post but you did it!
See, based on that depth chart, I see them as looking to go in the opposite direction of wanting to win.
The vision is clear. Reports have said over the past week that they are open to trading anyone not named fox or haliburton but will not sell low in any trade, meaning they are trying to win now and only want a trade if it makes the team better now. The market was pretty dry and there was no trades that helped the kings now or in the future, hence why there was little movement. Not sure why fans had expectations for something big to go down considering all week we heard that teams were selling low on bagley and Barnes and nothing about buddy. And I’m not sure why there’s a belief that you need to trade everything away and draft multiple top 5 picks in order to rebuild correctly as if any current winning team built themselves up that way except for the sixers who tanked for years in a different lottery format. You just need to make smart moves and stop giving contracts to veterans who have no business being here
An article on the Athletic gives the Kings a B- for the moves.
neat
The grade should be whatever’
The competition for minutes should help the bench unit.
If it’s broke, don’t fix it.
Go on…
Seems a few seats available next to the dismissive little chap !
He is sitting right next to everybody that agrees he should have picked Bagley over Luka.
This just popped up on y screen.
Breaking News: Kings get rid of former #2 pick out of Duke
I can’t get anymore info.
Jabari another no2 draft mistake from Duke !
Monte ‘Mini Deal’ McNair, he’s mastered it folks. We have new guys that Walton won’t play in favor of his 5-man rotation, just keep the starters out there all game Luke, it’s working.
I have to go back and watch the film.
This is bad
No, you really don’t.
The team’s moves are only disappointing if predicated on the idea that Barnes or Hield had to go. You cover the team, was there any indication that any plausible trade offers were in play for one or both? I never saw anything like that, but I’m admittedly not an insider.
I don’t believe that these moves were made in attempt to get the Kings to the playoffs. The transactions don’t really push that goal forward in any meaningful way. I see them as the GM not being in a state of panic, and thinking that he has to do something, never mind if it turns out to be idiotic. We picked up a solid backup guard for Cory Joseph, whom people around here just adored. It may not be by much, but the team is better than it was.
The B- I see Eddie posted above seems right to me. The Kings still have tradable assets, and I don’t think that either will play out his contract here. If a decent head coach can be brought in, I don’t think it’s a stretch to suppose that Hield will revert to the mean, and raise his own value.
We didn’t end up with Aaron Gordon, and we didn’t end up with Mo Wagner. I’m not sure that I’d be able to say that under the previous regime.
No, I really do. To be able to cover the team, I have to watch the team. I’m not happy about the product I’ll be watching.
I’m not angry at McNair for failing to make a specific move, because I have no idea what offers were available. I’m disappointed that there wasn’t a big move in one direction or another because that’s what I would have preferred to see happen.
This post is my view on today. I know some people will be more upset than me, some less upset, and that’s fine too.
Assuming the two directions to which you refer are significantly cutting salary and acquiring talent for a playoff run, I’m again left asking, what available big-move scenarios were actually in play that could have helped in achieving one one of these goals? I’m having a hard time tying together the disappointment of there being no big move, and the non-existent scenarios that would have made such a move possible.
What should McNair have done? You read the site, there have been plenty of possible trade ideas, a handful of them actually feasible. My assumption is, without any proof to the contrary, that Monte McNair is not an idiot. He may very well be, but the jury is out. If we were able to come up with workable trades, I’ll guess that he and his team were able to do the same. You make an offer, another GM says no. You negotiate, but terms can’t be reached. You repeat this process over several weeks, as well as listening to offers. You determine that, while some of these trades would qualify as big, none of them allow you to cut significant salary, acquire useful players, or collect a pick or two. They don’t move you closer to your goal of putting a contending team on the court in the near future.
But pull the trigger because it’s “big?” When all you have are bad choices, and you have the option to instead do nothing, doing nothing is the prudent move. I’d loved to have seen something substantial go down, but it didn’t. Unless the assumption is that McNair walked away from good, or at least fair return, there’s nothing on which to grade him. Giving him an “incomplete” is the neutral grade that this deserves.
I’m not grading anything.
I’m not arguing he failed to make a specific move.
I understand that sometimes no move is better than making a move for the sake of making a move.
I’m simply saying it sucks that there wasn’t a good move made. That doesn’t mean McNair sucks or that he failed in some way. It means I’m let down because I was hoping there would be a good move for this team.
I don’t see how that jibes with the assertion that the team is “rudderless.” If that isn’t a criticism of McNair, I can’t imagine who else it’s aimed at.
The team ship is still moving in roughly the same direction, but it hasn’t caught fire, and it isn’t sitting on the ocean floor.
(Arguments can be made that the team is somehow on fire and sitting on the ocean floor, but if so, McNair hasn’t been the guy pouring gasoline or drilling holes in the hull.)
Let me ask you, do you think the team has a clear direction that they are moving? Because I think I pay an above average amount of attention to this team and I still don’t know what they’re trying to accomplish or when. That might be on McNair, it might be on ownership, it could be a combination of two conflicting parties, I have no idea. But that’s why I call this team rudderless. Maybe they have a rudder, but are just running in stealth mode. I don’t know.
Well, there’s the organization, and then there’s the team.
The organization has quite clearly been drifting for the past fifteen years. It’s made stupid decision after stupid decision, and when a smart decision is actually made, it’s quickly corrected by firing the head coach for losing games while his best player had meningitis, or because the team won “only” 39 games instead of forty.
The team will remain rudderless while Walton is running it, because he doesn’t seem to have any kind of actual coaching philosophy. He was never qualified for a position like this, and I will refer you back to my screed regarding the organization making stupid decision after stupid decision.
Hiring McNair certainly seemed like a competent move at the time, and I haven’t yet seen anything to contradict the notion. Sticking with my (now apparently compulsive use of) nautical theme, something this big going in the wrong direction for huge hunks of our lives won’t be quickly turned around any more than one GM can spontaneously jam through useful trades without there being an agreement on the other end.
Disappointment is fine, and completely understandable. I share your disappointment. I’d be more disappointed about losing Hield and/or Barnes for assets that didn’t make the team better now, or who would likely not be able to be bundled to acquire a player or picks of this type.
VD fouled up the cap sheet in spectacular fashion, but McNair will still catch blame for being unable to acquire the kinds of free agents we need over the summer.
He will put his imprint on the organization if given time, but he’s barely gotten fingerprints on it so far. He got stuck with a coach that no sentient GM would want, and having that incompetence trickle down to game play is unavoidable. It won’t be his team until he can hire his own coach, and until he can untie the Gordian knots left for him in the cap sheet.
Being a fan of this fucking team is an abject lesson in disappointment. Reflecting that glare back at our current general manager is misplaced under the current circumstance.
And my issue is that the dude has effectively been at the helm for a year, and not only are we going the exact same direction, I’m not seeing strong evidence anyone’s hands are on the wheel. How long do we drift in the same direction before it’s an issue?
If we permit that six months is a year, and that a year is a really long time, then I guess you’ve made an excellent point.
If I was Monte I’d be looking to make my splash later. Draft well. Clean-up the books and the asset sheet first year. Trading Barnes next season when his contract has one season left at $18 mil. is likely to be high water mark for his value. Look to re-assess, and fine-tune the roster for the playoffs in year three as the seat starts to get hot. Meantime, continue to add young, athletic, defensive-minded players on the cheap, see if any of them carve a niche for themselves.
And that’s what I see him doing. Good plan? We’ve faithfully waited almost 15 years to see our team back in the playoffs. What’s a couple more?
No. Barnes’ high water mark is now and he didn’t clean up the books. Adding Wright made things harder, and he’s not young. He turns 29 next month.
You are not grading anything? Well I kindly suggest you get off the fence.
What fans do is evaluate and offer their subjective views, that is the point of being a fan, short for fanatic.
And you sort of contradict yourself when you say “it sucks that there wasn’t a good move made”. That is a grade of sorts, a subjective evaluation of yesterdays and todays moves and non-moves .
Delon Wright has a near 5:1 assist ratio, hes a great rebounder for a guard. CoJo was a terrible rebounder, played smaller than his size , did nothing to set up his teammates that did not include dribbling the ball to death and near shot clock violation.
So how is that trade NOT a good move? Especially when we have an elite shooter in Buddy suffering through his worst season and needs all the help he can get from a crafty and timely set-up man.
It is great we have Fox, Ty and Wright now to make it easy on their teammates with draw and dishes. It is great! And fans should be able to see this if there are not unduly pessimistic and awash with the conventional doomer mentality.
I think this team is at a high point right now, we are turning the corner, 10th seed here we come!!!
I’m not grading anything because I think grades, especially immediately after a trade, are rather pointless. I’ve clearly provided my opinion on each of the team’s moves. I’m not sitting on any fences. I’ve expressed an opinion on each move, and spoke positively (across more than one post) about Delon Wright. I know you like to be angry at everything, but you’re mad at me for not liking a move that I’ve said I like.
Your issue seems simple: It’s the direction, not the specific move or non move itself that is concerning.
Monte would do well to come out and explain himself once in awhile as Jerry said on the podcast. That would help alot even though the anger won’t subside until this team is consistently good.
With all due respect to Mr. Reynolds (and it’s a lot), McNair is under no obligation to explain himself to anyone other than his boss. Having a fun, chatty GM didn’t exactly pay dividends. Discretion is a huge part of McNair’s job.
In regard to the direction, it’s largely the same as it was yesterday, because McNair doesn’t feel the need to do something simply to satisfy people who are bored and disillusioned. Unless you have contrary information, it appears that the only moves available wouldn’t have been beneficial to the team he runs, so he was bright enough to do nothing rather than make a stupid move.
You aren’t going to dissipate a fifteen-year shitstorm by adding Mo Wagner or Aaron Gordon to your arsenal. Look at Ainge. He made his team demonstrably worse, when he could have had Barnes for relatively little.
There will be no directional change until he hires his own coach, and until he can unfuck the salary sheet. Moving this thing in a new direction was never going to be a one or two-year process.
For what it’s worth, I don’t expect things to be done in one or two years, but I do expect some actual movement, and we’re not seeing that so far. I don’t believe the value of non-Fox or Halliburton players will significantly increase in the near future.
Given everything that we know about what was offered in return for some of the Kings’ more expensive pieces, what movement would you like to have seen? Which deal would you have taken that McNair must have waved off?
Aside from trading off Barnes or Hield, and given that we aren’t aware of any equitable deals being on the table, what movement would you have wanted to see that would have been immediately or eventually beneficial?
Orlando seemed to know how to move things. They just re-made their entire roster and future in the span of 4 hours. They committed to their youth while completely turning their back on any hope of making the playoffs in the East, and they are about just as close to the 10th spot play-in as the Kings are.
That is a team the realized their core players are NOT going to be apart of their future and acted accordingly. The Kings appear to be on a path of not giving a shit.
Orlando had a fire sale, but they got back a pretty decent return. I’m still waiting to read about equitable offers to McNair regarding Barnes and/or Hield.
For the first time ever, everyone seems to be keeping their mouths shut about all of these actual great deals that were in play.
They also had better pieces to send out than we do.
I don’t think McNair needs to be doing a daily/weekly or heck, even monthly presser. But as a potential season ticket/merchandise buyer, I’d love to know a little more about his ongoing philosophy for shaping this roster.
And you seem to know a lot about McNair’s thought process without any inside info. I think it’s fine for people to be skeptical, as it is for you to be optimistic about the guy.
It’s not optimism, and I don’t have any particular insights, unless assuming that McNair doesn’t have his head up his ass must be optimistic.
At this point, all I can divine about his philosophical bent is that he’s content to do nothing rather than do something stupid. This alone is a massive improvement for the franchise.
I like the potential ticket/merchandise buyer angle. It’s like stating that you’re thinking about purchasing stock in a company, and demanding a meeting with the board to tell you what’s going on or you are outta here!
Well, it is optimism, in that you’re assuming “doing something stupid” was the opposite of “doing nothing”. That’s strictly, like, your opinion man.
I’m hopeful that McNair is good at his job. I’m optimistic that he’s a sight better than Vlade Divac. But the league (not just Sacramento) is historically littered with bad GM hires.
I have no idea what to think about McNair at this point.
And my goodness, you are struggling with analogies lately. I wouldn’t demand a meeting with the board, but I bet you dollars to donuts I could gather a copious amount of information on their philosophy and direction.
I know I’m fine with the Wright move, but I can’t wrap my head around the rest, especially now that the Kings have painted themselves into a cap corner. They just made keeping Holmes all that much harder, and that is what I have a problem with.
Just now painted themselves into a cap corner, eh? That’s fair.
You don’t know that. You don’t know what it will take to move some money around to re-sign Richaun Holmes. I’m guessing Monte McNair has an idea, though,
How exactly is that going to work? Good question. But it’s possible to resign Holmes for 15 AAV AND not have to move Hield or Barnes to accomplish it AND still have the #1 overall pick (which is almost 10 million in salary by itself). That’s what I’ll say now.
He has to get a failing grade for failing to define any direction. Just say we were trying to improve our team for the stretch run without sacrificing the future. Just what were they trying to accomplish. There’s nothing in these moves that provides clarity with their objectives. They seem to be wandering in the the wind.
I give him an A grade. Bjelica and CoJo were are two worst players on the team.
The coach no longer has two terrible players at his disposal to lead to a terrible outcome as the result of his terrible discernment.
The GM legitimately tried to trade Marvin, the obvious weak link, for Bey OR as part of a package for John Collins, and resisted low ball offers for HB.
The GM also capitalized on a cap strung team in the Pistons to get a good asset with a 5:1 assist ratio for a player we would waive in the next month or sooner.
That is an A grade in my book.
Delon Wright is going to help Buddy among his other new teammates, currently struggling through his worst season of his career, but playing better the last 2-3 weeks, more so than CoJo ever could. This GM finding a way to bolster a “core piece” in Buddy and others is much appreciated and needed!
And Whiteside, although he has been kind of crummy and sloppy of late, still finds a way to make his mark on the game. Keeping him was the right move.
The same fans harping on the events of the day are the same fans contending Whiteside is trash and played his last game for us.
Even when he had his bad cringe moments, Whiteside was pivotal with 8 points and 12 boards and discouraging easy scores. How is it when he returns to the lineup we seem to be more competitive and win more often than when he is away if he is such a drag on the team?
The same analysts who think Whiteside is hopeless are griping that HB and Buddy are still Kings. They are wrong and they secretly know so.
The only way you are disappointed is if you were hoping for a reset, to blow it up. But all you need to do is look to last nights game for evidence that this is not a team that needs a full reset.
We are a few bench players away from being a legitimate playoff team and we may have acquired them today.
It is actually somewhat shocking we can be so good with NO bench and a very dubious coach. This is what happens with a superstar and some very solid players around him, a la the Utah Jazz Model to a 75% winning percentage!
Andy – Serious question: How long does McNair get to skate by on “incomplete?”
Honestly, I’d give him a B-, with most of the minus being my disappointment that something great didn’t happen today. But that’s on me.
I apologize for repeating myself, but until McNair has his own coach in place and puts out the swamp fire of a cap sheet he was handed, I don’t see how any grade wouldn’t be premature.
The thing that’s disappointing is the lack of communication on what the objectives are. If they really think they are not far away and just a move or two away from a playoff team, say it and make a move or two to confirm it. My mind will be changed if they pick up a buyout player to improve the team for the stretch run. If not the Wright trade makes no sense because by itself this roster has not improved even for the remainder of this season. It appears to me management is conflicted on what they want to do.
You want to talk disappointing. I just got an email from the Kings ticket staff asking me about next year’s packages. I stopped being a STH a few years back and the have the nerve to ask me for money after today. Fuck that.
What have they done to show me they are willing to become winning franchise under Vivek’s leadership?
I must be reading a different website. Seems like Joseph gets more ire here than anyone short of MBIII.
Ultimately, I think it’s really hard to interpret this trade deadline for two reasons – we don’t know what offers McNair may have passed on, and he’s given Kings fans absolutely zero clue as far as his vision for the remainder of this season and the future.
I suspect he did shore up the bench a bit, and the lack of movement on the bigger names would seem to lean towards the team focusing on the play-in game. But there’s just not enough information to determine it either way.
I interpreted the “adored” line as sarcasm.
This is the way.
I don’t think you can talk about Cojo without using sarcasm.
Irony, Otis. Pure irony.
Goddammit, Andy.
I am sorry, sir. I assumed it would be lost on some, but I thought you were in the clear. Ah, well, it’s been a long day.
Oh, Otis is back! I missed you.
I suppose we have to put sarcasm in italics to make it obvious.
There should be a font for that.
Do you really think he improved the bench. Bjelica might have been the best player moved in all the deals.
I tried to prepare the fanbase for the reality HB and Buudy were staying, it was next to obvious. but I guess many were in denial.
There is nothing to be mad about except that we could not find a taker for Marvin , but that was always a 50/50 proposition at best. Our GM did his best trying to salvage a broken player.
I am glad we dumped two scrubs, I am glad we retained Whiteside, and that this team is playing its best basketball of the season w/o Marvin. Thats progress and a revelation that we have done so with NO bench (minus sporadic contributions from Whiteside).
It is also confirmation of what many of us already suspected. Marvin is not a capable starter, the guy is not good at basketball, his ego and left hand dominance betray him, and his teammates are relieved and enthused to have him off the floor and out of the way.
I do disagree I think the GM would like to see the team make a run at the 10th seed, and if we falter he is confident he can secure a comprable talent to Hailburton if we are picking in the same ballpark.
Of course, I would LOVE to have a guy like Jonathon Kuminga or Mobley at the top of the draft, but this is the better path forward, getting closer to respectability ASAP instead of the faint notion getting worse is a path to getting better.
The template going forward is what the Jazz did (32-11). See their blueprint. The template is NOT the Thunder or the Celtics. What is wrong with that approach? Winning 75% of your games and being capable of beating anyone come playoff time works for me.
We need a new coach and 3-4 bench players TBD. But that is within reach without needing a Top 5 draft pick.
Congratulations, you have found a way to give the franchise credit for hanging onto a guy that you say is a terrible basketball player.
This reminds me of when there was talk about what solid team they were becoming during that “magical” 7-1 stretch. Of course that stretch also happened to come in the middle of a collection of roughly two dozen games where we let opponents score what felt like 200 points a night. So….
I think at this point all of this says more about us than it does the franchise.
It’s been a 35 year long Rorschach test for me!
No wonder u cray cray.
If the returns for Buddy and Barnes and Bagley weren’t there hen they weren’t there. It takes two to tango and nobody wanted to go get the butter so here we are, with a slightly better bench and maybe able to make a run at the 10 seed.
I don’t think there was any reason to make a panic sale – hold onto the assets until a worthwhile return. Those guys can be shopped in the offseason in a more measured way. Until then, the team has a relatively soft schedule so enjoy the ride.
What makes people think the return will be much better in half a season?
Return is more than just the players and/or picks you get back. It’s the cap flexibility and/or the chance to truly tank and have a chance at a stud.
We’re stuck in the sinking boat and unwilling to dump the cargo?
What makes you think there were any offers that gave cap flexibility and/or a chance to truly tank (which would, in any case, mean trading Fox)?
That’s sort of where I’m at. Eventually (hopefully) leaks will come out about what may have been offered to the Kings. At that point, we might get a clearer picture of how shitty, or prudent, this front office acted today.
for Buddy. If you look at the Evan Fournierdeal, He is a free agent at the end of the season and got traded for 2 2nd round picks, Basically the same player as Buddy but buddy has a way worse contract. I dont think anyone was offering anything for Buddy.
Honestly, imaging if you are a fan of the other 29 teams. Would you want Buddy? Maybe the Bucks? He has a huge contract and like 1 skill.
Yep, he’s a luxury player whose contract only makes sense in a very, very specific set of circumstances. As of right now, without knowing all the cap details for all the teams, I can’t see unloading Buddy unless you’re also paying picks for somebody to take him on.
Really good point. I thought Buddy was immovable unless we offered something to take him off our hands. Given that I think the prudent thing to do for now is keep him.
I think there are too many other teams dedicated to tanking that even if the Kings played .300 ball from here on out, they’d still end up with a 10-12 pick. So why not try out the new guys, see if they develop some chemistry and try to slide into the 10 seed.
I was thinking try out the new guys (and the young guys) and slide into the 5th pick.
I am ok with that. But also risky. Is the 5th pick going to make us better? I think we have to get into top 3 for me to really promote this strategy.
I think there’s a better shot of the 5th pick making us better than there is of the 10th or 11th pick. Of course, I’m also thinking selfishly. Because I only pay attention to Haliburton and Fox during games right now. I have zero interest in watching the rest of the guys in what was the semi-regular rotation. Running guys like Davis, Silva, Ramsey, and Woodard out there for decent minutes would definitely change that.
We got Bagley at 2 and Haliburton at 12 … the draft order is really irrelevant to us, because largely we suck at drafting.
The problem with tanking is that there are too many teams also doing this. What if you still end up with a pick around 7-10? Is that really better than this team picking at 12-15?
I’d say it is. Having more options to choose from in any draft is better than having less.
But the question is, enough choices to justify losing proven players? I think If we are close to Rockets record, I would 100% go for your strategy. I am ok with picking 7-10, but I am also ok with with staying put at that range.
Unless you trade the 10th pick for the 15th and 20th.
More isn’t always better, as I continually tell my wife.
So take a shitty deal now to preclude a shitty deal later?
I mean, I’m a pessimist without parallel, but that’s impulse-control issues.
Yes, because the shitty deal now gets a better draft pick, where the shitty deal later does not. I believe these players are pretty much worth what they’re worth, now or in the offseason. Delaying has no significant upside, while taking on potential downside.
I’m inferring that you think a shitty deal is one that sends out assets like Barnes or Hield, and what players we get back make the team worse in the short run. Presumably your deal comes with desirable draft picks or at least cap relief. For the record, those scenarios are a lot close to ideal than shitty.
Show me something, anything, to suggest that one of these options was available to McNair, and that he walked away. I’m all about the tank, but there’s nothing to indicate that there was a deal available that would have served the near and long-term objectives.
Make a shitty move now so that you won’t even have the assets later to make a shitty move? Come on.
There’s nothing to indicate anything either way, really. So all we can do is look at the evidence and make our best determination. Because we know McNair isn’t going to tell us.
There does seem to be a lot of smoke that the team is looking to compete right now.
Holding onto an expiring Richaun seems to indicate this – the rumor mill seemed to slow on Barnes as well, who went from (arguably) one of the more coveted pieces on the trade market to a guy who was pretty clearly not going anywhere.
Just looking at how everything played out – I’d be more inclined to believe the Kings weren’t serious about moving these guys without a “make me sell me house” offer, and more willing to add smaller pieces to get to the playoffs now.
But that’s a whole lot of supposition. McNair took over a terrible team with an unqualified head coach, and a cap sheet put together by a chimpanzee. And not one of those clever circus chimpanzees, either.
Without knowing anything, I’ll guess that with McNair’s background in analysis, he’s entirely likely to be able to evaluate talent. Add in that he has no emotional commitment to anyone on the roster other than Fox and Haliburton, to whom he gave contracts, and it remains hard for me to believe that he passes on the opportunity to make his first big splash as head man.
And I still don’t think any of the moves that were executed were in service of trying to make the playoffs this year.
Agreed! On both sides.
I will agree to disagree here.
Maybe, but I see them shoring up the roster enough to be a bit more respectable defensively (or more like, less of an embarrassment), and just hold ground. I think the Kings aren’t likely to move far in either direction w/o major changes. So maybe just trying to make them a bit more watchable, and less dysfunctional for Fox-Haliburton.
Though I disagree I really like that last line. Still got a thumbs up.
I agree with you, no need to trade if the offers aren’t attractive.
In Monte we Trust’
Just keep saying it to yourself the same way we’d say in Vlade we Trust and you’ll eventually start believing it.
Nailed it, Greg. Best piece you’ve written all year. Apathy has set in.
I’d settle for apathy. This is me wantee now.
Crap take, IMO.
I’ll change it when something happens.
I prefer to refer to him as Vlonte McDivac.
Meh… I look at the Dallas roster then look at ours and think that Carlisle would have us playing playing above .500 ball.. I hope we fire Luke… get another solid draft pick, sign Holmes and trade buddy for a more versatile stretch 4.. probably win 44-45 games next year
And you’d rather have the Kings roster than the Mavericks. Come on.
I rather have Luka than the Kings roster. But I rather have the Kings roster over their roster not counting Luka.
For sure…that roster is no bueno.
Yeah, if they don’t get to the WC Finals in the next year or two (and they probably won’t), they’ll be boned for years.
Where did I say I would rather have the Kings Roster? I said that I think Carlisle would have is play8ng above 500.. we are 18-25.. I think we would be 22-21 23-20 with him as coach. Only reason I would trade rosters is because of Luka ..
my point is with a very good coach this roster can get to 44-45 wins with a few small tweaks next year.. but not with Walton
It’s not like Carlisle has that roster over performing.
Honestly? That collection of misfit toys may possibly be overperforming.
I don’t think this is a playoff team. Sorry, I look at the Western Conf. The Kings kind of lucked out this year with the Grizz having no JJJ and the DUbs without Klay. FUnny thing. Both of those teams are still better than the Kings without those key starters.
Next year those 2 and the other 8-9 usual teams are going to be good or great again barring injuries.
Who are the Kings leapfrogging to get into the playoffs? They can add another late draft pick. MLE, and be over the cap signing Holmes. They still won’t be a good team. Some people can’t handle the truth.
Kings are better than the Grizzlies and Dubs. Just had bad games against them. When Kings are playing well, like when they go on those winning 4 out of 5 game streaks, they could beat both lol
The fact they are better without key players brings back the point that they have better coaching. They have an identity and culture. I believe culture is more on ownership though because they have final say on the product they want to see on the floor. The ownership of good teams have a clear intent and vision of what they want in their team that they communicate to their front office. The front office references that intent to acquire players to fit that mold. The Grizzlies are an example of this they are a hard nosed team and it has been that way despite coaching changes and personnel changes. As well as the Spurs, Heat, Jazz, and pretty much any team that has enjoyed long term competitive viability. It’s why they have been able to rebuild like 3 times over while we unsuccessfully chase 8th seed finishes for a decade and a half. Vivek wants to be competitive, but it seems like he is changing his mind constantly. He is one with the wind and has recency bias out the wazoo.
I agree, it’s not a playoff team, and it is incomprehensible that this roster could be a competitive playoff team, say a 4 through 6 seed. Which is why holding on to Barnes makes no sense.
Rather than worrying we should have traded Barnes or buddy, I’m concerned we missed our chance to sell high on Holmes, who could very well be the next high value player we watch walk away for 0.
It’s too late to out tank any of the bottom 5 teams. After that, it’s a crap-shoot, maybe even as far down as 20. So what’s the difference? And, no need remind anyone on this site how pick #12 worked out for us last year. There’s always someone who drops, and this year there will be a whole handful who drop. Scottie Barnes looks custom built for this roster with his ability to stop the ball on defense. Not sure he isn’t better than Kuminga. Lower picks come with cheaper salaries.
I know the last is a lousy excuse but, its factually true. The Kings will continue to benefit from that fact with Haliburton for a few more years.
Take the guy who falls. What matters is not the draft position, but the level of insight in the evaluation of talent. No matter how high it is. Vlade got us Bagley for the #2 pick! There will be a guy available with the talent we need when the Kings pick comes up, just as there has been every year since we’ve been picking in the lottery. Hopefully Monte doesn’t let ’em get away like Vlade did Luka (and many others). Also, Vlade, for all his faults and mistakes, probably wasn’t the worst GM in Sac Kings history. Was he?
Btw Who the hell was it again we got for that pick Vlade foolishly gave away because he didn’t know about the stretch clause yet?
Kuminga is a stud. Love that guy. I wasn’t impressed with Scottie Barnes though i haven’t seen much. I think Zaire Williams could be a good to very good player, but I guess his effeciency was alarming.
Yeah I was really hoping at the start of the season the Kings would dedicate to the tank and have a chance at a top 5 pick. Aside from Cade Cunningham, I’m also a huge Kuminga fan and I ranked him #2 on my personal big board. Unless the basketball gods smile on us once again and we jump into the top 3, I guess we can kiss that hope goodbye. FO is clearly looking to push for the play-in which I think ultimately will be 1 seed short. I expect them to finish 11th (KANGZ!).
Better start watching some of Moses Moody, Scottie Barnes, Jalen Johnson clips since we will be picking in the 8th- 12th range once again.
Scottie Barnes needs to develop as a shooter. Otherwise, I think they’re pretty comparable offensively. Barnes looks better defensively, especially, at the point of attack, where the Kings could really use a ball-stopper.
Heck, since these no impact moves might have saved a few bucks for the rest of this season, might as well make a pitch for one of these buyout guys for the rest of the season.
Does anyone else read this gif as “Again, we suck”?
Yea me neither….
I really would like to read an article exploring the possibility that this is untrue:
If we believe that McNair has a plan, then it’s reasonable to believe that these transactions are part of the plan. Point being, staying the course =/= rudderless simply because one disagrees with the plan. The team is attempting to thread the needle between building around Fox/Haliburton, and fielding a competitive team. IMO its a worthwhile exercise discussing the actual plan in conjunction with criticisms of the plan.
I hope this isn’t getting too semantical here, but it seems to me that folks are saying that “threading the needle” or having one foot on the train with the other on the platform isn’t indicative of a strong commitment to a particular end goal (i.e. a plan).
So, by saying “there is no plan” based on the evidence at hand the speaker is criticizing the substance of Monty’s plan as we have seen it unfold to date (small sample size approved). They are criticizing a plan that appears to serve multiple and generally mutually exclusive masters or end goals at the same time.
I see growth as a curve of sorts. It seems, to me, as though McNair believes he can make incremental changes to bend the curve upward gradually. I’m fully aware that the majority of commenters and writers either believe a) my read on the situation is wrong, or b) my read is accurate, but McNair’s plan is dumb.
Nah, you are probably correct. And I can’t say for sure that his plan is dumb, but I would be concerned that building this thing conservatively means the more aggressive GMs in the West will be hitting doubles, triples and home runs while we’re moving station to station. And then time becomes a factor too, when we have Fox and Haliburton on max deals but don’t have that genuine superstar that a team is more likely to acquire with a top-5 pick than a top-10 or 15.
Part of being aggressive (IMO) would have McNair clearing these big deals off the cap, freeing up longer term dollars and pulling as many draft assets as possible. Now that might not have been an option at this deadline, but those are the two realistic avenues to creating a GREAT team in Sacramento, IMO.
It really does come down to the feasibility of building a championship contender with Fox/Hailburton. That can basically broken into three parts: what’s the backcourt’s actual ceiling? How do you build a team to maximize the probability they hit their ceiling? And, how do they ultimately add the 3rd star that’s required to raise the team’s ceiling to championship levels.
Personally, I think Fox/Haliburton can both be top 20 guards. I also believe it’s important to provide them with competent, complimentary player in the short-term to help them hit their individual ceilings. But, by doing so, the Kings are also limiting their ability to find that third star.
Hmm…
One thing I should add is Fox currently has like the 8th highest ORPM in the NBA. We can do the fun dance about defense, and the accuracy of the various catch all stats, but I still think that’s noteworthy. If the Kings can add competent defenders, and Fox can figure out how to shoot threes/FTs at an acceptable rate, then he’s a legit 1 A/B player. We don’t know the probability that stuff will all happen, but it at least seems feasible.
He’s 8th, Lonzo is 10th, Beal is 7th. All on bad basketball teams, with questionable futures.
I mean, there’s something to be said for that as a starting point, but I feel like we’re going to be playing the “wait until his shot improves” game for a while.
Top 20 guards in a 30 team league? I would hope we’re shooting higher than that.
I mostly agree. And if anyone is finding pessimism in the lack of a game changing deadline, i would ask, which trade was bad?
“Doesn’t matter. None of these trades moves the needle , and the Kings needed to do something.”
Did they? What if other GM’s around the league felt the same and wanted to use that pressure to create an opportunity to leverage Sac into a lop-sided trade? Do it anyway? Because we’re desperate?
I don’t like doing a trade because we feel like we “have to do something.” The contracts we needed moved got moved, except maybe Bags, and that would have been the ultimate sell low. The contracts most people wanted moved, Barnes and Buddy, are both descending and therefore should be easier to move as they mature. I was hoping for something myself. but I’m glad they didn’t go full fire-sale mode because, as Petrie would say “You don’t trade a Mercedes for five Toyotas.”
I see both sides of this, but I think it’s simply a macro vs. micro thing. Greg knows that this team isn’t going to contend for a title making small moves to replace sub-average NBA players with average NBA players.
Now these moves probably did make the Kings a bit better, but improving in small ways in the Western Conference means very little.
I mean, one of Vlade’s best deals as a GM was getting Bjelica to sign here – he was pretty productive for his relatively small salary. But in the grand scheme of things, did it move the franchise forward in any significant manner?
True. Incremental improvements aren’t getting us out of this Groundhog Day, but I think the trades being offered were also likely not for pieces that were gonna do it either. Especially from guys like Danny Ainge who simply isn’t gonna do a trade if he isn’t the clear winner. Even the draft picks weren’t likely high enough, or multitudinous enough to do the trick. And as well, declining in either conference means very little for the Kings this season, since it’s way too late to catch up with the lottery odds of the bottom teams now. and, after that, the top talent doesn’t separate itself much from the rest of the draft field.
This is the thing, you have to take a leap of faith. I can understand why Kings fans might be skeptical.
That’s sort of the rub. Believing in any outcome other than one where the franchise doesn’t make the franchise in this decade ultimately requires a leap of faith.
Why though? The only reason you have to take a leap of faith is because of Vivek. There is no evidence that McNair is anything but a solid GM.
IMO, there is no evidence either way. But it’s really early. Frankly, there was a LOT of this type of talk in the early Pete D era.
Just saying, whether it’s bad luck or design, this franchise seems to always find a way to do things bass-ackwards.
True
It’s worth discussing what McNair has accomplished to meaningfully improve the team in his first year on the job, since that year is effectively up today.
As far as the tank, I am not too upset. Realistically we were never breaking the bottom 6 with our recent string of wins. At the 7th worst record, Kings get top 4 odds of 31.9%. Even after these minor upgrades, I still don’t think we’re going to finish with a better record than NOP or CHI, so that would still put as the 9th worst team, and a 23.1% chance of cracking the top 4. Those 8 percentage points don’t bother me that much.
But the inability to garner any long-term assets is completely inexcusable.
We’re hanging on to Richaun Holmes to what? Finish 11th in the west instead of 13th?
Whiteside? That’s at least two future picks in the range of 20-60 that we just threw away for nothing. FO really thinks we’re surpassing the Warriors to get to the play-in? This level of incompetence is unbelievable.
This team has failed at doing that very thing on and off, but mostly on, for going on 20 years. At what point do we consider that the strategy is the problem, and not the execution?
I think it’s always good to not judge the actions of a current front office based on the results of previous front offices. I know there’s a Vivek through line, but it’s still kinda like saying there’s no point in tanking since we failed at drafting the right players when we had high draft picks previously
To be clear, I think taking non-star players and trying to build a team around them while hovering in the 35 win range is a bad strategy period, not just for the Kings. Maybe I’m missing something, but I don’t feel like this has been a winning strategy for many teams, ever.
This exactly! Past performance is not necessarily indicative of future results.
Especially with a new regime! Thank you
Hamm really disappointed talking about we haven’t made a good trade since Artest, so Why do you think we can do better now? Absolutely defeatist. If you have no faith in your ability to make competent transactions (like Vlade), then step down (like Vlade!).
…
god this is bleak
Cojo is finally gone – this draft was a success. Just kidding of course but I’m not upset. McNair has the offseason to make trades and I expect him to be busy. No need to trade Buddy or Barnes if the offers weren’t attractive, which is my assumption here. Maybe patience will finally pay off….
I wish I had the will to do a Ziller but here I am on the trade deadline, self-applying clown make up after thinking Monte could be the answer
Underwhelming deadline aside, I am excited to watch the team again now that the tank is dead because I can once again cheer for wins since we’re going for it this year.
Cheering for losses was not fun and I am expecting to be disappointed of course but I can go back to watching every game rather than skipping games hoping for an L in the box score.
Say what y’all want, I love watching basketball, especially Kings basketball. We’re used to disappointment anyway, why not root for a magical season? Meaning…….the 10th seed.
If you’re not expecting losses, I can foresee being disappointed quite a bit over the next two months.
I am expecting losses. I am expecting the same product we’ve had for 44 games.
I’m just saying I can just sit back and turn on the game and watch like a regular fan now. Not hoping for a loss to fuel the tank. Celebrate a win, get mad at a loss. There’s only 28 more games of this crap until next November. Celebrate the highs and get angry at the many lows.
To spin it positively, Tyrese and Fox backcourt for the rest of the season BAYBEEEEE
I think this was a “house cleaning” trade deadline for Monte. Many of us wanted CoJo and Bjelly to move on. Our eyes told us that they were no longer significantly productive players for the Kings. Kabengele, whatever. Don’t feel any loss there. Parker, the same. Of the trio of Buddy, Barnes, and Holmes, I suspect the offers for them, if any, weren’t worth getting rid of them. Buddy gives you a baseline of 15 points a night. Barnes is our only legit, playable SF and Holmes has the highest FG % in the league and plays within himself. Fox is a top 5 PG in the league now, IMO, Haliburton is steadily improving. We have a decent set of starters. Our bench was sorry and it got better. Not really move the needle better, but we’ll see how they mesh. We didn’t take on crappy salaries. Monte didn’t get fleeced. I just don’t think he was offered fair value or better on our other players. I’m OK with the trade deadline.
Agree with most of this. We all want change because for God sake this team has sucked for 15 years…as fans we are fed up with it and just want to see something big. Monte has been here 6 months or whatever…he may very well feel that the team isn’t that far off and a couple moves to strengthen bench (Possibly into future on both moves), development etc., advances the cause towards a winning team. I don’t think he “made a move for the playoffs”…that would be a Bulls type move with Vuc. Most of us didn’t want that.
Monte doesn’t need to make moves because fans are tired of past GM’s bullshit moves and thus feel the only way to improve is to blow it up and pray to the draft Gods. We think that (myself included at times in the past) because we have seen nothing to the contrary to suggest any GM running this team could build a team intelligently. So easiest move we can all rationalize is a total blow up. Monte might have more confidence in his ability to build a winner than that strategy. Time will tell.
I have no real idea what Monte has planned or in store for next 6 months…could be great, could be same old shit. What I saw were marginal moves, that made the team marginally better without sacrificing future and flexibility. That’s a start for me.
Probably the best way to look at it, but I’m not convinced he passed up future flexibility.
If he had dealt Barnes, he probably could have chosen to take back less return to clear cap space. If he dealt Buddy, he may have taken salary back, but could have lopped a year off the return salary (maybe – that’s definitely more of a question mark).
So it’s possible he sacrificed some potential flexibility, but it’s not like he can’t try that during the offseason.
I don’t see how these moves didn’t sacrifice future flexibility. CoJo and Bjelly would be gone at season’s end regardless. In their place we have Wright, who’s guaranteed for next year, and noted woman-beater Terrence Davis instead of a 2nd-round pick. That reduces flexibility. I actually think Wright good be a good acquisition, but if the point of these trades was flexibility, this was a failure. The Kings lost 3 draft picks and added guaranteed money beyond this season. Flexibility, I think not.
Wow, a rational assessment based on nondelusional expectations. Thank you, Mike, for going counter to the collective misery pit in here. As if we all aren’t already depressed enough right now. As if Monte has anything to do with the past 15 years. The Morey Rockets didn’t tank. They built slowly, then pounced on a superstar and contended for many years. The Morey Sixers didn’t tank when many demanded a fire sale, they added a coach and some pieces and are contending again. Sure the situations aren’t the same, but give Monte a freaking minute here to follow his mentor’s lead. I know we’re a frustrated and impatient fanbase, and deservedly so, but good grief this place. This is supposed to be fun, right?
I don’t think it’s irrational to be unhappy about this turn of events. My position is :
Given those two assumptions, doing nothing, or even worse, trying to add bench players to reach a sub .500 plateau, is not good work by this front office.
As far as giving Monte a freaking minute, his first year of work for this team is effectively done. What has he accomplished in that time? He’s done precisely one thing that meaningfully improved the team long-term, and that’s draft Tyrese Halliburton, which was probably more luck than skill.
Aside from the MLE, the team as it is comprised, is basically capped out next season. McNair sitting on his hands also cost this team a higher draft pick in a flattened lottery, which seems to me to be far and away the best chance to improve the team today. I’ll admit that deals could happen this offseason that could still improve the team, but even if they do, the higher draft pick is (most likely) gone. If we’re counting on scoring a Halliburton at 12 every year, the odds of becoming good are very, very long.
I’m being asked to believe that Vivek is getting out of the way so McNair can do nothing, and I don’t like it, no matter who is calling the shots. This team will not improve by inaction.
He was hired in Sept, so he’s been on the job for six months. He’s had to assess, clean up, and build in the aftermath of maybe the worst, most obsolete front office in NBA history. He had a terrific draft with little prep time and zero scouting department. He took a flyer on a couple of insignificant vets with tiny, cuttable contracts. He cut bait on the overpaid, suddenly untradable Bogi. He just got rid of arguably our two most overpaid, ineffective players Cojo and Belly for actual, albeit marginal, assets. And it appears he doesn’t want to set up Fox and Hali to fail, or stunt their growth, for a chance in a bingo game at a pick, that more often than not ends up a bust. I’m not saying he’s Jerry West, but yes, give the man a minute.
This was the job, warts and all. And no other team is pumping the brakes.
Come on. So Biden gets six months to clean up Trump’s mess before we start the impeachment proceedings? China and Russia aren’t pumping the brakes.
Oh goodness, bad analogy theater is running wild.
Does it really take six months to get a grasp of this roster/coaching staff/future cap space? He was already working in the field, and should have had a general knowledge of those same areas of each team in the league. He’s not hanging out on a message board part-time talking about the Kings, this is his career.
My point is that the league isn’t going to slow down while he gets his feet wet. And if he needs a year or two to develop his relationships around the league, maybe he wasn’t the right guy to hire.
Six months to look at a roster and a cap sheet, no. Six months to find good deals and turn around 15 years of futility, of which 14 1/2 weren’t his, I’ll give him a pass for awhile.
Nobody is saying he should have turned the entire franchise around at the trade deadline.
And I highly doubt these deals are done six months in advance.
No, I’m pretty sure they aren’t either. Listen, you seem like a decent enough fellow, but I don’t think we connect so well. Would you object to us breaking up and not talking again? I won’t thumbs down you, if you don’t thumbs down me.
McNair has had an offseason and a trade deadline, and he’s made one move in that time to meaningfully improve a bad team. Those bad contracts were falling off anyway, and he added salary in one deal (for a better player). But with that move, he’s put himself in a position where it may be difficult to maintain an asset (Holmes) that he could have moved for some value. At the same time, keeping Holmes completely caps out a .430 team. By not moving assets, he’s also (probably) locked the team into a worse draft pick.
His job is to improve the team. That absolutely can still happen. But outside of one move, it hasn’t.
Hence the give him a minute. That’s what I’m saying. And no, he did not have a full July-Oct offseason. And no, he did not sign Barnes or Buddy or draft Bagley – which are the things that have gotten the team in this position. He also managed to sign the best player the team has had since Chris Webber to a long term extension in an era when nobody wants to play here. Like you said, we’ll see what happens.
Give him a minute? I’ve been waiting 15 fucking years for just average basketball and he has yet to put his finger prints on the team.
For Christ’s sake Sims. It’s about to be the longest playoff drought in league history and I can’t be upset?
What does this deadline have to do with the playoff drought? Those seem to be two separate and very different issues.
For me it’s yet another moment in these 15 years where a significant decision can alter tomorrow. I put it up there with draft night and the first day of free agency. Good teams make good decisions on those days. I’ve seem little evidence of that by the Kings over the last 15+ years.
This is Monte’s first deadline. So he’s being judged against a decade and half of financial woes and front office incompetence and expected to change that in one deadline?
Seems that expectation that this gets turned around at the deadline was always as pie in the sky as hoping for the 1:1 pick in the draft. Nothing wrong with hoping, and I don’t blame you for being frustrated. But…..digging this team out of this hole is going to be about making tough decisions.
Tough decisions are rarely unanimous, if ever. I don’t see why this deadline was ever going to have a ton of consensus outside of the frustration that this team needs to clean up it’s cap sheet and get the best pick in the draft they can.
You can feel however you want to feel, but if you’re directing fifteen years of outrage over the situation at a guy who’s been on the job for 180 days, I would consider that as being extremely poor aim on your part.
Maybe you should find something else to do with your time then. You seem smart, and I like most of your takes, but being upset about a stupid basketball team can really get in the way of a good life.
So you are a member of a basketball blog site and telling folks on on that site to not care about the basketball team that the site represents?
This isn’t the Sac Bee comment section. If you don’t like the hot basketball takes, you are in the wrong place.
Sorry, I intended that more playfully. I should’ve been more clear. My bad. Carry on.
All good. I’m just salty tonight. My apologies as well.
Morey made all the final decisions and Monte was a no. 3 in the front office ! Is he good or the the next Pete D ? Truthfully, we do not know yet ! Will by October !
How is it “house cleaning” when you trade away an expiring and a non-guaranteed deal while giving up 3 second rounders?
That 8 – 12 pick last year netted us Tyrese ****ing Haliburton.
I’m tired of losing. The players are tired of losing.
I, for one, will enjoy watching the remaining games A TON MORE because I will not have to watch Cory Joseph or Bjelica play pitiful defense and get embarrassed out there.
Go Kings!
(The world is difficult enough, let me blindly root for my team!)
**NOTE** I still want Walton gone after this season.
Why do you want Walton gone? Walton being the coach last year netted us Tyrese ****ing Haliburton.
(see how that works? just because something had a good outcome one time doesn’t mean it’s the path you want to keep following every year)
Hey! C’mon now, go easy. Back away from that ledge Greg! I can see your hurting right now, and things are pretty bleak but, there’s still a lot of good in this world. People here care about you, bud.
I’m somewhat with you here. First, I think this path is absolutely the wrong way to go and would have much preferred an Orlando-style blowup. Since that didn’t happen, I guess I might as well pull for them to make the playoffs.
My frustrations with CoJo and Bjelica extended to the offensive side of the ball too. CoJo iso was an eyesore and Bjelica would get ran off the three point line by anyone who took one aggressive step outside of the key.
Buddy should’ve been traded after that air-ball attempt in the last minute yesterday. He forgot how to shoot and never learned how to dribble or pass.
I wonder what Fox thinks about all of this as well
This trade deadline put the meh in Sacramehnto.
Agreed
If they fire Walton sometime between now and the end of the year, I’ll consider this year a success. Otherwise, we’re just treading water.
I will buy that T shirt! or better yet I could put Vivek to the Dolan test with
Vivek put the meh in Sacramehnto
The plan? the plan is not articulated publicly. I assume that these moves are part of the plan or part of the plan thwarted.
There are two general directions for the plan : 1. Tank, like OKC and Houston or 2. Try to get to playoffs or better position in playoffs-like Denver, Bulls etc.
If I try to discern plan from the objective results, it seems that the plan is #2: keep the productive current players and add tiny pieces. The new guys minus the old guys results in a “better team”. But not better enough to really get to the 10th spot. So was the plan thwarted? Tried to pry a star lose for all the future?
A full on tank plan #1- would have included dealing Barnes, Buddy, Bagley or some of that set. That did not happen. Was that plan thwarted by just terrible deal options? Like Bagley for Bey? I suspect no market for Buddy and a tepid one for Barnes. The Celts offerings were poor.
Out – 4 players + 3 second round picks
In 4 players + no picks ( I did not count the LAC pick exchange since neither will convey)
Limbo again. There are 7 teams that the Kings cannot catch for the worst record- Wolves, Detroit, Houston, Orlando, Wiz, Cavs and OKC. Toronto wants to join that tanking group. Then there is NOP, Bulls who project up.
that’s a nice healthy, no man’s ( persons’s) spot at 9. Bulls got way better. NOP were better. Stuck in the middle again and the deadline moves just reinforced that.
Kings had to win the last 4 of 5 games. Vivek probably like we will make the playoffs now. Overall, moves were good to me. We have a BENCH! Something they’ve been lacking all season. Terrence Davis and Delon are both long defenders. Kings are making the playoffs now.
Based on the rules of the off-season, can they still make Barnes/Buddy moves in the offseason to allow them the space to resign Holmes?
Vuc and Gordon were the only players that could have made us a bit better. I am glad we didn’t make either of those moves.
In the offseason, we will trade Buddy and Bagley. Once those two are gone, I think we will be trending upwards.
Glad to know and what are the Kings getting in return ? Great deals coming – yeah ! ð¤£
Probably right
Considering our GM said he was focused on creating financial flexibility and gaining assets, either our owner is meddling again or our GM failed. Neither one is good.
It just goes to show you that Barnes, and/or Buddy are average players at best, and their trade value was way overestimated on the open market. The Kings were never going to get a good return for either of them, nor will they in the off season.
And now we’re stuck with both of them for who knows how long. If I had my choice, I’d keep Buddy. At least he was brought over on a decent trade, and on occasion can be a game changer. Unfortunately the Barnes trade a couple of seasons ago has been a complete and utter disaster. If I was Monte, I would have taken what I can get for Barnes, because he’s not worth what we think he is.
Let’s give some of our young guys some burn, for crying out loud. Barnes is, and never will be our guy. If we keep him, he’s more suited to be second team guy off the bench.
Hello 35 wins next season, in order to remain “competitive”.
Don’t hold your breath waiting around for a player-evaluation consulting job from an NBA team.
I just don’t understand why Detroit Pistons agreed a Wright – CoJo trade, but how come they turned down the Balgey – Bey trade……..
I would give the FO Ａ+ grade if they able to trade away Bagley before the deadline…
but right now, I am pretty disappointed, I will give them a C+ .
My other team by birth is the Pistons. They loooooooove Bey, kind of a 180 about how we feel about Bagley. There is NFW that trade was going to happen.
Everybody is complaining that the moves Monte made demonstrate that he doesn’t have a clear vision for the team. I think that’s false. Monte gave us two insights into his vision. The first was when he was hired and the second was after he drafted Haliburton. When he was hired he said he wanted to maintain flexibility so that when the right offer came the Kings could pounce. After he drafted Haliburton, he said that he doesn’t pass up on talent. I think it is pretty obvious that the moves he made today demonstrates that. It is pretty obvious that Wright is a better player than Joseph and by trading for Wright we still maintain flexibility. Same thing with Davis. Low cost for a potentially decent player. The Bjelica trade is a bit more iffy. But even if we don’t think that what we got back is better than Bjelica, the cost wasn’t much and we still maintain flexibility.
Some people act like these trades mean that we can’t resign Holmes. Sorry that’s false. I’m not going to explain as there are people and podcasts covering the Kings that talk about it. Anyways, when you actually think about the moves without emotion and without your own built in assumptions of what you think are the right moves, it is pretty obvious that Monte is doing a pretty good job and building something great.
How is it you know he is “building something great” ? I think the lack of knowledge about the direction of the team is what is in play. I will agree with Monte didn’t really fuck anything up any worse than it already was. Any arguments ?
Yeah, so I think there are a few components that produce success. One is luck, but the other is discipline. There are probably others, but I’m not focusing on those. Monte demonstrated the ability to act with self-control rather than emotion. When the Bucks deal for Bogdanovic fell through, he didn’t panic and try to make a bad situation (losing Bogdanovic for nothing) into an even worse one (matching the Hawks offer and possibly having to keep Bogdan). He took the hit and moved on. He did what he said he would Maintain flexibility. Same thing with the trade deadline. He got better players than the ones he was trading away. He maintained flexibility. He acts consistently with the things he says he wants. Now maybe the things he says he wants is wrong and so the plan is flawed; but at least he is sticking to some sort of framework for how he wants the Kings.
I do admit that my claim that Monte is building something great is a bit speculative. I just think that he knows how to build a successful team from his time in Houston. If you grant me that, then I think he has the necessary virtues to build a very good team. I don’t think people realize how important of a role self discipline and self control have in generating success. The ability to put your foot where your mouth is and to maintain consistency in the face of adversity.
Yes, I can give Monte credit for being disciplined. Lack of discipline is how we got here. I think some people look forward to change as we are never actually in the hunt for anything than the lottery. A team in a small market needs a great deal of luck for sure.
Let’s be clear … Haliburton fell to us, Vlonte didn’t make some next level chess move to acquire him. A box of petrified cat shit would have had the BBIQ to draft Haliburton.
Well…. I don’t really care whether other people would have also picked Haliburton. You’ve completely missed my point. What I care about is his explanation. The purpose of my comment was to demonstrate that things Monte said in the past are consistent with the moves he is making presently.
My glass half full take for the day:
Based off of how we have been playing we could very well be a few games below .500 two weeks from now. Looking at our remaining schedule I would say there are 5 pretty much guaranteed losses, about 12 toss-ups, and 7 games we should easily win, team health notwithstanding. So to get to .500 we would have to win all 7 games against tanking teams and 8 of the 12 toss-ups. I counted OKC in the toss-ups because they are about equal with us even though they are rebuilding. That is going to take a level of consistency we haven’t seen in eons. So it’s on Fox/Haliburton’s shoulders to get us there.
This is from Wednesday. And it’s ultimately what happened. Except now they have more room to carve out to get under the cap to resign Richaun Holmes assuming he can’t be resigned for Early Bird rights.
But I think we are making a ton of assumptions right now about how this roster will look come summertime. And I think far more revealing things happen this summer than now at the deadline.
If you’re a pessimist, or recent history is weighing on you, or whatever, I get it. I don’t begrudge folks for where they lay on this particular point. But I’ve seen enough good things out of Monte McNair (and with many more things coming that will determine how I truly feel about the job he’s doing) that help me feel confident there’s a possibility that all is not lost.
As Rordog has pointed out, I think the franchise is trying to stay bad enough to stay in the top 10 in the draft and at the same time not bad enough to where you have a 15 win season like what they are getting in Houston. I.E. threading the needle. Ideally, the Kings finish 10th in seeding in the lottery, jump to a top 3 pick, and go from there. But that’s low odds, and I certainly doubt that’s the only path this franchise has moving forward.
I’m willing to be patient. Monte McNair wasn’t the cause for this playoff draught being 15 years, I’m willing to live a few more months to see what he can do to start rebuilding the roster he would prefer and like to see moving ahead before I’m ready to drop the anvil on his head and say he’s donezo for eternity.
You can never be a strong negotiator if you never teach yourself discipline enough to walk away.
Well said Guru.
Yay, I can give up on the Kings for another season.
I’m glad we kept Barnes and Holmes, they are our core four with Fox and Haliburton. Disappointed to see Bjelly sacrificed to keep Pervis around. Have no idea if the new guys move the needle.
I would have loved a big deal that changed the fortunes of the team.
I just think the offers for players were weak.
It is hard to discern Monte’s long-term plan, however, I do think we got a glimpse of the direction the team is headed.
The multiple failed attempts to trade Bagley (if true) show that he is NOT part of the future.
I think this is a good thing.
I also think that Monte was trying to get as much as he could for the players he tried to trade. Look at what Houston got for Olidipo (or Harden, for that matter). I would have hated for that to have happened to the Kings.
Vivek and Vlade screwed up this ship pretty bad. It will take time to right it. We have to pray Vivek keeps his hands out of things.
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