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Royal Roundtable: Rotations, Rotations, Rotations

Who’s in, who’s out?
By | 42 Comments | Oct 18, 2021

Credit: Joe Camporeale-USA TODAY Sports

Welcome back to our between-the-preseason-and-regular-season-gap-that-doesn’t-really-have-a-name Royal Roundtable! Today, we’re taking on all sorts of rotational questions.

 

Who will start for the Kings on opening night? Barring injuries, will that group start the majority of the games for Sacramento this season?

 

Tim: I’ve had the same prediction since the end of free agency: De’Aaron Fox, Tyrese Haliburton, Moe Harkless, Harrison Barnes, and Richaun Holmes. It seems clear that the Kings and Buddy Hield have an understanding that they’ll move him as soon as they’re able, which eliminates the pressure of needing to insert him into the starting lineup, and Marvin Bagley simply hasn’t shown enough on either end of the court to justify slotting him in at the four-spot. The other, obvious option is to start Davion Mitchell and roll with a three-guard lineup right from the jump, but Luke Walton will probably prefer to reserve his energy and pop for more of a bench role.

I don’t believe this will be the starting lineup for the majority of the games. One of Davion Mitchell or Terence Davis is going to squeeze Moe Harkless out of the starting wing spot before we’re 20 games deep into the season.

Rob H: Starters on opening night? I’ll go with Holmes, Barnes, Hield, Haliburton & Fox. I don’t think that this will be the group that closes out the game, but it provides for the least imbalanced bench at the beginning.

Mirann: I think Luke will start the season with Fox, Haliburton, Buddy, Barnes, and Holmes. I wouldn’t be surprised if Harkless replaces Buddy at some point in the season, given how much better Buddy looks coming off of the bench.

Brenden: The indisputable locks are De’Aaron Fox, Harrison Barnes, and Richaun Holmes. I would argue that Tyrese Haliburton falls into that category as well, and after he started every preseason game over Buddy Hield I would say that Luke Walton feels the same. That leaves one spot left that could go toward Hield, Maurice Harkless, Davion Mitchell, Robert Woodard, or Marvin Bagley. My prediction is Harkless gets the nod as a player who has defensive capabilities and simply plays his role on offense.

I think at some point in the season the Kings will fully buy into the three-guard lineup and start either Buddy Hield or even Davion Mitchell alongside the aforementioned four.

Greg: Game one started I think it will be Fox, Haliburton, Hield, Barnes, and Holmes. But I do think we’ll see Walton continue to tinker with the starting lineup based on matchups. I think the main four will likely remain the same but Buddy Hield might swap out with Harkless, Bagley, or even Tristan Thompson depending on the opponent and how each player has been playing.

Which player will receive more minutes than everyone expects?

 

Tim: Terence Davis is going to play a larger role than most expect this year, especially if Monte McNair ever figures out a Buddy Hield trade that doesn’t get canceled at the last minute. Davis can shoot the ball, as evidenced by his career 38% three-point percentage, and he’s a solid defender on the perimeter as well. After averaging just over 11 points per game off of the bench for the Kings last year, I expect Luke Walton to expand his role even further moving forward.

Rob H: General fan consensus? It would not surprise me to see Mo Harkless average better than 20 min. a night at the 3-4. Other than Harrison Barnes or playing small, there are not a ton of options here.

My personal consensus? Tristan Thompson is going to play more minutes than I ever would have thought. Or hoped.

Mirann: Tristan Thompson. The last preseason game against the Lakers showed the Kings’ need for size and strength on the glass. I expect Thompson to be Holmes’ primary reliever, especially against bigger squads.

Brenden: The two that come to mind for me are Tristan Thompson and Maurice Harkless, but I’ll go with Thompson. Holmes did not look like his usually spry self in preseason, and Tristan Thompson very well may be the best defensive big on Sacramento’s roster. For a team that has plenty of offensive weapons with their slew of guards, a defensive-focused big could prove to be essential.

Richaun Holmes is phenomenal and his recently signed deal may be one of the best center values in the league if he can repeat his level of production. It’s just that the worst defense in the league last year could significantly benefit from a big man who is defensively focused. I would not be totally shocked to see Thompson receive some significant fourth quarter minutes this season.

Greg: Chimezie Metu. He feels like a bit of an afterthought on this roster right now, but through lineup tinkering, injuries, or just trying to find anything that works, I won’t be surprised if we see more of Metu than anyone is currently expecting.

Which player will receive fewer minutes than everyone expects?

 

Tim: I wouldn’t be totally shocked if Marvin Bagley averages fewer than 20 minutes per game off of the bench for the Kings. Luke Walton is going to run a lot of three and four guard lineups between De’Aaron Fox, Tyrese Haliburton, Davion Mitchell, Buddy Hield, and Terence Davis, and Bagley’s inability to defend the rim effectively is going to take him out of many of those lineups. Add in the fact that Monte McNair upgraded the backup big man positions in Alex Len and Tristan Thompson, and Bagley may find himself somewhat on the outside looking in.

Rob H: I agree with my long-necked friend. Between the inability to stay healthy and his odd fit up front, I could see the #2 pick from the 2018 draft fall out of the core rotation.

Mirann: Aside from Marvin being the first that comes to mind, I am curious to see how Buddy’s minutes may be affected. I wouldn’t be surprised if Terence Davis eats up some of Buddy’s usual ticks since Davis can provide more defensive reliability and can easily go on scoring heaters.

Brenden: This is easily Marvin Bagley for me. I feel bad being the one to say this, but if Bagley continues at the level of play we have seen from him recently then he is a negative on the floor. There have been random quarters of impressive offense, but there is no way to know what he is going to provide on any given night and the Kings are not in a position where they can be gifting minutes to negative impact players for the sake of development.

I have said it a few times now, but I would not be totally shocked if Marvin Bagley receives some ten minute nights or even DNP-CDs this year because the team cannot continue to wait for this hypothetical growth that has yet to be shown.

Greg: Bagley is the clear answer for the reasons everyone else has listed here. But the other answer for me is Richaun Holmes. Not because Holmes will lose his spot or be a worse player, but that the improved depth behind Holmes may allow him to play a few minutes less per night. Holmes played 29 minutes a game last season. It wouldn’t shock me if he was still the starter and still the closer but averaged closer to 25-27 minutes a game this season.

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andy_sims
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October 18, 2021 10:44 am

So much talk about shallowness of wing depth, and nothing about Lou King? What would you project his minutes to look like?

aplumley
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October 18, 2021 10:52 am
Reply to  andy_sims

I think because he’s on a 2-way and will be spending time in Stockton. But I’m with you. If the lack of wing depth becomes an issue, I’d love to see King be pulled up in lieu of trying to make another player fit out of position.

andy_sims
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October 18, 2021 11:07 am
Reply to  aplumley

Good call there, I don’t think that I factored in his contract situation, and kind of assumed that he’d be on the roster opening night. I suppose that given that he can be in Sacramento on two hours’ notice, it makes more sense to let him run in Stockton until playing time in Sacramento is realistic.

Adamsite
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Nostradumbass 14
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October 18, 2021 12:30 pm
Reply to  andy_sims

Same goes for Woodard, but I’d figure if King and Woodard are getting significant minutes it would mean Harkless and/or Barnes are injured, and not because they deserve a spot in the rotation.

BestHyperboleEver
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October 18, 2021 1:29 pm
Reply to  Adamsite

If King or Woodard are getting significant minutes for any meaningful stretch of games, this season is likely over and Harkless and Barnes either have been traded or should be on the block.

Kosta
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October 18, 2021 10:46 am

Starters:

Tim
Rob H
Mirann
Brenden
Greg

Last edited 2 years ago by Kosta
Klam
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October 18, 2021 11:36 am
Reply to  Kosta

Put Rob would need to put on pants to play for the starting five, no?

RobHessing
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October 18, 2021 11:44 am
Reply to  Klam

comment image

Kosta
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October 18, 2021 11:46 am
Reply to  RobHessing

“sac”

aplumley
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October 18, 2021 10:48 am

If the Kings don’t extend Bagley the QO today, he will get multiple DNP-CDs. There will be very little upside to giving him any run whatsoever.

catterj
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October 18, 2021 10:52 am
Reply to  aplumley

The qualifying offer comes at the end of the season. I think they should play Bagley to hopefully boost his trade value. If he shows that he can be good, maybe a sign and trade at the end of the season. I don’t think he should stay on the team. It’s time for both sides and the fans to move on.

aplumley
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October 18, 2021 10:54 am
Reply to  catterj

I thought they had to offer QOs today. I guess that’s just for rookie scale contract extensions.

aplumley
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October 18, 2021 10:56 am
Reply to  catterj

I misunderstood the deadlines.

catterj
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October 18, 2021 10:49 am

Starters – Looks like Fox, Haliburton, Barnes, Holmes, and Harkless. Bagley doesn’t have Walton’s trust if he wasn’t going to play him at all when available in the last preseason game. I don’t see him going small to start so Hield or the other two guards are out too. Hopefully, McNair can move Hield/Bagley + something for a starting level wing/4 in December and that person can start instead of Harkless for the majority of the games. 

More minutes – Harkless for the reason Rob said. There are really only two rotational players who you would logically consider small forwards without stretching it – Barnes and Harkless. Barnes led the team in minutes last year. Harkless will get more than expected this year. 

Less minutes – Lots of people don’t expect Bagley to get a ton of minutes so I’m not going with him. I’ll go out there a little and say Mitchell. He will get minutes just less than everyone expects with 5 guards deserving of minutes. If Hield is moved early on then Mitchell will get minutes as expected. In that case, Holmes for the reasons Greg gave.

AmateurNerd
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October 18, 2021 10:56 am

The “We’re pushing for the play-in!” lineup (season opener):

  • Fox, Haliburton, Harkless, Barnes, Holmes

The “We’re mixing things up because we’re a .333 team right now” lineup (early December):

  • Fox, Davis, Barnes, Thompson, Len

The “We’re playing with renewed focus” lineup (early January, after a 3-game win streak against injury-decimated teams):

  • Fox, Haliburton, Davis, Barnes, Holmes

The “The coach is about to get fired and is desperate” lineup (late January, after a 6-game losing streak against Eastern lottery teams):

  • Fox, Mitchell, Haliburton, Bagley, Thompson

The “Coach Gentry wants to see what the kids can do” lineup (mid-February thru end):

  • Mitchell, Ramsay, Woodard, Metu, Queta
Bbmuteman
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October 18, 2021 11:17 am

Does anyone like the idea of the kings taking a flyer on dembouya or samanic on a waiver wire pickup? They are wings.

catterj
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October 18, 2021 11:29 am
Reply to  Bbmuteman

I googled them, and I think they’re both on two-ways and unable to be signed by the Kings rn.

Bbmuteman
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October 18, 2021 11:41 am
Reply to  catterj

They got signed already? Wow, that was fast.

PlayoffModeT
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October 18, 2021 11:37 am
Reply to  Bbmuteman

Al Farouq Aminu was just released by the Spurs. I think that would be someone to look at for the four. He has been injured a lot lately though.

Bbmuteman
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October 18, 2021 12:17 pm
Reply to  PlayoffModeT

I like aminu, but I feel like he’s a bit too old for the young king’s timeline.

andy_sims
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October 18, 2021 12:32 pm
Reply to  Bbmuteman

He’d just be a live body to help out while things are thin. Barring some kind of revival, he’d be a strictly temporary signing.

Bbmuteman
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October 18, 2021 1:20 pm
Reply to  andy_sims

Marginal wins like that over the course of the season might help the kings get into the play in tournament. No need to sign him long term. Good point.

Adamsite
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Nostradumbass 14
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October 18, 2021 12:28 pm
Reply to  Bbmuteman

I think if the Kings feel they can find rotational players from other teams trash bins, then might as well call it a season and let’s start talking about 2022 draft prospects.

andy_sims
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October 18, 2021 12:33 pm
Reply to  Adamsite

Because there have never been players cut by teams that ended up having NBA careers?

Adamsite
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October 18, 2021 12:37 pm
Reply to  andy_sims

They might have NBA careers, but I don’t think they’d help the Kings in the W/L column, unless you are looking to lose.

andy_sims
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October 18, 2021 1:25 pm
Reply to  Adamsite

I suppose I’d liken it to second-round draft selections, who, while not expected to become great players, do sometimes pay off in a big way. So much depends on the specifics of the situation.

Adamsite
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October 18, 2021 1:36 pm
Reply to  andy_sims

I get that. I guess the difference for me is that these guys being cut have been on NBA teams, have experience, and have been evaluated. A 2nd round pick who has yet to see the floor is worth more a shot, IMO.

Bbmuteman
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October 18, 2021 1:40 pm
Reply to  Adamsite

You could be right about samanic since he looks like he lacks fire and loses effort when things don’t seem to go his way in games. I just think discards from bad teams could be diamonds. Not saying that’s necessarily the case with the spurs here.

BestHyperboleEver
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October 18, 2021 1:32 pm
Reply to  Adamsite

I sure hope that the Kings are making decisions based on bigger goals than the 2021-22 W-L column.

But that hope is probably false.

Bbmuteman
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October 18, 2021 1:18 pm
Reply to  Adamsite

I love looking at draft prospects. It’s the only joy I get near the 2/3rd mark of the King’s season. 😉

Amonk81
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October 18, 2021 11:52 am

Amazing that Bagely got minutes last year because he didn’t earn any then either. It even harder now to trade Bags. Shoulda done it last year. Shoulda never drafted him.

I do hope Walton sees that Haliburton-Mitchell together is a super pairing and gets lots of time.

Adamsite
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October 18, 2021 12:34 pm

OT: I’d guess this means Indy is out of the Ben Simmons sweepstakes.

Bbmuteman
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October 18, 2021 1:21 pm
Reply to  Adamsite

Wouldn’t that just mean caris lavert would be the headliner instead of brogdon?

Adamsite
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October 18, 2021 2:29 pm
Reply to  Bbmuteman

I thought Brogdon was the headliner all along. I feel he has more value than LaVert.

Bbmuteman
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October 18, 2021 3:24 pm
Reply to  Adamsite

He probably does for what the sixers need. I just figured if the pacers still want Ben, caris and more would now be their offer. As in, they’d be ponying up even more draft capital and other players or would need to rope in a third or fourth team that has what the sixers want.

ArcoThunder
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October 18, 2021 1:27 pm
Reply to  Adamsite

Pretty sure Monte ain’t trading off night, Burt or Swipa. Doubt Simmons comes here. Offering 2 firsts, buddy and Bagley is all there is for Philly to get from the kings. If they don’t like it they can get bent. I believe this is Monte’s feelings, can’t imagine he’d let his old boss get the better of him in a trade. He should know better.

I think this Kings GM has a plan to wait until the off season to sign a big free agent that he thinks is the missing piece while keeping all his future draft picks. If he can change the “no big free agent ever signs in Sac” history then we might have something really cool to get excited about 12 months from now.

one can hope.

jwalker1395
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October 18, 2021 6:44 pm
Reply to  ArcoThunder

If Monte ends up letting time demolish his old boss’s leverage to the point that Buddy is the headliner of a Ben Simmons return I will officially anoint him The Savior.

lazlohollyfeld
October 18, 2021 1:58 pm

Saw that Jaren Jackson just signed a 4-year extension for $105 million. He went 4th in the 2018 draft. Does anyone think MB3 will be able to sign for anything other than a MLE next year (if that)? It just shows what a miss he was in that draft where if you were to redraft it, Bagley may be taken as far back as 9th in that draft. Another thing that goes unmentioned is why the Kings didn’t move back that year. They could have made a deal with Dallas and Atlanta and either still drafted Bagley or Jackson. We’d probably all feel better about Bagley if he was drafted 5th and we got some other picks or players to go with moving down. It still wouldn’t make up for losing out on two generational talents, but we’d all feel a little better.

andy_sims
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October 18, 2021 2:34 pm
Reply to  lazlohollyfeld

We all know the reason: The Sacramento Kings had VD.

Sacto_J
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October 19, 2021 7:54 am

Fox
Tyrese
Barnes
Holmes
on offense AND defense

Buddy / Bagley on all-time offense, always just above the 3 point line.

4 on 5 Viveketball for the win(s)
No looking back. Especially the guys on all-time offense…

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