The morning after losing to the Sacramento Kings, Boston Celtics’ general manager Danny Ainge spoke about using the traded player exception that was created from signing-and-trading Gordon Hayward to the Charlotte Hornets.
Ainge revealed the team’s biggest need as “shooting with size” during his interview on Toucher & Rich.
“I would say that we could use shooting, we could use passing,” Ainge specified. “But you always need defense and our team is built on defense… It’s just hard to find a shooter that can guard anybody. We’re looking for complete players.”
The most recent matchup between the Celtics and Kings showcased Harrison Barnes as the perfect candidate to check all of the boxes Ainge listed on Thursday morning.
Barnes is currently converting on a career-high 41.3 percent of his 4.4 attempts from beyond the arc in the 2020-21 season. Yet, this is far from an outlier as the Sacramento forward has not shot below 38 percent since 2017-18. Standing at 6’8″, there is no question he fits into the “shooting with size” mold presented.
Harrison Barnes may be most ideal as a four in the modern NBA, but the Brad Stevens-led Celtics have an affinity for versatile wing defenders who can switch across multiple positions.
There are very few moments where Barnes is slow to rotate, caught flat-footed, or simply overpowered. While he is not blessed with overwhelming lateral quickness or a wingspan that swallows opposing players, he remains positive on that end with solid fundamentals, an understanding of the game, and unwavering effort.
Look at the defensive effort from Harrison Barnes on this posession. pic.twitter.com/eEu7yWnH2r
— Brenden Nunes (@BrendenNunesNBA) January 30, 2021
A wing trio of Jaylen Brown, Jayson Tatum, and Harrison Barnes leaves no weaknesses to attack and allows unlimited switching between them.
Really throughout Barnes’ entire game, it is difficult to pinpoint a worrying flaw. He has taken a leap in playmaking this season, can put the ball on the floor and attack the rim, gets to the free-throw line and knocks them down, and rarely commits turnovers.
Additionally, he is often regarded as an exceptional teammate and brings championship experience from his early years in Golden State.
Maybe it isn’t so hard to find a shooter that can guard across multiple positions who fits into the roughly $19.6-million of the usable TPE.
While the entire exception is $28.5-million, the Boston Celtics became hard-capped after signing Tristan Thompson to the non-taxpayer mid-level exception and limited its use.
After doing a lot of work on it (H/T to all who helped!), I have the Boston Celtics at $19,600,985 under the tax apron/hard cap line. This is inclusive of:
-Team salary
-Javonte Green counting at the 2 YOS minimum salary
-Jaylen Brown's unlikely bonuses— Keith Smith (@KeithSmithNBA) January 6, 2021
Therefore, the Celtics would need to send back at least $2.6-million in order to take in Barnes’ $22.2-million salary that decreases with each passing year.
The idea of Sacramento moving on from one of their most consistent players this season would revolve around obtaining long-term prospects that better fit the timeline of franchise cornerstones De’Aaron Fox and rookie Tyrese Haliburton.
Aaron Nesmith ($3.4M) and Romeo Langford ($3.6M) are both on their rookie deals and either would be enough to individually make the salary work.
Nesmith, who was the 14th overall pick in the 2020 NBA Draft, was on Sacramento’s radar with the 12th pick as the Vanderbilt sharpshooter confirmed in an interview and is 21 years olds. With Buddy Hield likely on the trade block as well, Nesmith could fill the role of deadly off-ball threat from beyond the arc for years to come.
During his two seasons at Vanderbilt, the 6’6″ wing shot 41 percent from three on 290 total attempts – some even labeled him as the best shooter in the draft. Brad Stevens has a short leash on his rookies, and Nesmith has not been given much opportunity so far into his debut NBA campaign.
Romeo Langford, who was actually selected with Sacramento’s 2019 1st rounder that was passed onto the Boston Celtics from the Philadelphia 76ers, could be another intriguing option. The lottery talent dealt with a thumb injury during his time in Indiana and has only seen 370 minutes on the floor after being sidelined for the entirety of his rookie year.
While Langford will reach restricted free agency one year prior to Nesmith, he is only six days older and gained the trust of Brad Stevens enough to get some minutes in bubble playoffs against the 76ers.
Nesmith is likely the more intriguing of the two, but it is certainly too early to label Langford a bust. He fits the prototype of a slashing playmaker who can be positive on the defensive end of the floor, although the three-point shot remains concerning.
With how Harrison Barnes has performed this season, there is potential that he could draw a young prospect along with a first-rounder that is likely to place in the early to mid-twenties.
Two reasonable deals include:
- Boston Receives: Harrison Barnes + MEM 2021 2nd
- Sacramento Receives: Aaron Nesmith + BOS 2021 1st
- Boston receives: Harrison Barnes
- Sacramento receives: Romeo Langford + BOS 2021 1st + BOS 2021 2nd
Sacramento would surely get worse in the immediate with these returns, but their time to shine is not now, despite the current win streak. Making the team worse this season, which would secure higher lottery odds, while also acquiring younger talent in exchange for Harrison Barnes is good business.
Barnes, who has roughly $60-million remaining over three seasons, is 28 years old and not likely to be around for the prime of Fox and Haliburton. The current situation that Boston finds themselves in with the TPE being their only option to add difference-making talent gives Harrison Barnes what may be an outlier level of value at the upcoming deadline.
Monte McNair has preached future flexibility, as evident by deciding to not match the Bogdan Bogdanovic offer sheet, and getting Barnes’ salary off the books does just that.
Harrison Barnes is sure to be continuously linked to the Boston Celtics from now until the March 25th trade deadline.
I would hate to lose Barnes, but I understand the justification and could get behind a trade like this.
I would hate to lose Barnes w/o a steady rotational Vet to keep these guys on track. Not sure I would do this, but it ain’t my call anyhoo!
If you get an offer with future upside, you take it. This team right now is fun fool’s gold. Sell high and prepare for two years from now.
Listening to No Dunks yesterday and they pointed out that each of the last 4 or 5 seasons the Kings have had a stretch where they won 5 of 6. This could definitely be fool’s gold right now.
I’d put money on this current stretch being fool’s gold. I feel the next 3 games will give us a clearer picture of what this team really is.
Yeah, we’ve seen too many times in the past where the Kings willl win like 5 games in a row, you think they turn it around, and then they lose the next like 9 out of 10. I have to see long term consistency before I’m ready to say the team has taken a step in the right direction.
That’s very true. If you look at last season, and seasons past, the Kings will usually go into several stretches where they hit the skids.
Let’s hope this season is different with the emergence of Fox and his recent heroics.
YES. This these are exactly the kind of trade that needs to be made for Barnes. Give me Nesmith. He was in my top 10 in the last draft and had hoped to get him had Hali not fallen to the Kings. If the Kings somehow get Hali and Nesmith, I’ll learn to do back flips.
I’ll add there are more teams that are going to want a player like Barnes. In the Ringer this morning there was an article about how Utah needs a big defensive wing if they want to make a run.
Dallas is another team that is in need of help. James Johnson and rookie Josh Green for Barnes works. I’d do that just to have Bagley go up against Johnson in practice and learn a thing or two.
Barnes is certainly increasing his value and should be well sought after. It’ll be interesting to see how Monte plays this.
I just really don’t want him to get hung up on a possible playoff dream, or worse yet, pressured into it by ownership. They all need to get it into their heads that the playoffs are an incredible longshot that would take help from other teams for the Kings to make it.
They play the games for a reason and if Fox and the rest of these guys keep up their recent play, who’s to say they’ll need help from other teams? Fox just closed out one of the better teams in the east (Boston) and was giving it to the reigning runner up and fell short by 1 point. Yeah it’s a small sample but if Fox specifically keeps this up, there’s no telling what this team’s ceiling is.
We’re 10-11 right now- 1.5 games or whatever out of 5th (and about the same for near bottom of the conference), why not just let them ride it for another few weeks and see what happens? If we make the playoffs it probably means Fox and Haliburton are taking the league by storm. And by no means is that a bad thing. I mean if we stumble into the playoffs with mediocre play that’s a different story but I can’t see us getting there without Fox and Haliburton LEADING us there. And I’m pretty confident after watching McNair’s press conferences that he won’t mortgage the future for a run at the 8 seed.
I get that the Kings have beaten some good teams recently, but the good teams were also without multiple key players. Boston, for example, was missing 3 key rotational players in Walker, Smart, and Pritchard. Don’t get me wrong, I love Fox, but he doesn’t have that 4th quarter performance with Smart guarding him.
This recent stretch of wins have ALL been against teams not only missing starters but significant role players as well. At the same time, the Kings have been at full strength and have played damn near flawlessly, which is not sustainable.
You might call me a pessimist, but I think I’m more a realist right now.
I get that they had injuries, but they were still the more talented team and they have one if not two guys widely considered better than Fox and he took it to those guys. The way Fox was playing I don’t think it mattered if Fox was guarded by Smart or me or you- he was getting where he wanted.
I’m not calling you a pessimist as in the end you’re probably right and this team won’t come anywhere near the playoffs. But their chemistry appears to be the best it has been since The Scores, Fox is playing out of his mind and at the moment I am a believer. I’m just not sure what you want McNair to do. If he sends off Barnes for a pick and an underperforming young player, what message does that send to the locker room who’s currently got high hopes for this season?
I would hope that McNair wouldn’t change whatever course he’s planning on taking because of a 6 game stretch in the early season.
Well, Adamsite seems to believe otherwise
No, I’m just not sure what course he is on.
Listen, the roster makeup is virtually the same as last season. Hali replaced Bogi in minutes and production, Whiteside replaced Len, and GR3 replaced Bazemore. Bagley has taken the role of Nemanja, but that is only because Nemanja was last year’s placeholder for an injured bagley
So should we expect anything different than last season?
His only big decision so far was extending Fox, which really was a no-brainer
The only things that leads to think the McNair is thinking beyond this season is that he signed role players to 1 year deals (good!) and he sent the other rookies to the G-League bubble. Those make me think it is not about this season and makes me hope he has a plan to build around Fox and Hali as opposed to a playoff pipedream for this season.
Well it seems like every thread you find a way to mention how you hope McNair doesn’t sell his soul to get into the playoffs this year (or forced into that by Vivek). To me McNair’s plan looks fairly clear- He inherited a roster with a handful of bad contracts and he’s letting guys like Buddy and Barnes raise their value so he can trade them for something decent at some point. And he’ll sit on contracts like Bjelica and Cojo until they expire or somebody calls trying to get them. There’s no reason to rush into an offer for Buddy or Barnes if it’s not something he likes or if he thinks they will play themselves into something equally as good or better. Like he said in his first presser here, he wants to be aggressive but he also has to be patient.
Guys like Woodard and Ramsey may not be ready for the big stage just yet, so they’re patiently trying to develop them. They seem to be developing those guys the same way they are Marvin- you gotta earn your minutes whether you like it or not.
And I don’t think he’s actively worried about making the playoffs but if Fox/Hali/Barnes/Buddy/Holmes help lead them there what’s the harm?
I think there is a lot of space between making the playoffs, not making the playoffs, and getting a good pick. I’m just tired of lottery purgatory.
To your point, there is no harm in making the playoffs, but there is harm when you make moves and roster decisions to attempt the playoffs when it actuality you have near zero chance of accomplishing that. Kings have been operating in that later mindset for far too long.
Well when McNair starts making moves that jeopardizes our future, then I’ll get worried.
This year I would rather have had Bazemore and Len.
They’re still playing against the best players in the world. I wouldn’t downplay it too much.
Yeah, this is where things get dangerous. It happens all the time. A mediocre team goes on a run and fans start throwing the big picture plan out the window for the chance at a momentary glimpse of the playoffs. Which I get. We’re all desperate for it. But the question remains how this team can raise its ceiling to become a true competitor. Personally, I don’t think it’s going to happen solely based on developmental leaps and mid-1sts. I mean, it might. They might draft a Kawhi or a Giannis or even a Mitchell. But I like my team to be more proactive. At some point they’re going to have to figure out how to acquire at least one more elite talent. The most likely way to do that is by making moves based on maximizing the value of your assets.
I think part of what people are debating here is what is the value of those proposed assets? A future 1st, okay we can put a value on it and try to draft someone good. That gets my attention. But no one is putting value on Romeo. And then what about Nesmith? Does Nesmith have any value now? Suppose hypothetically you were to put Nesmith on the trading block. What could you get for him? Anything? That’s an honest question. I want to know what you think.
I’m the wrong guy to ask. I never rated Nesmith that highly. But however one rated Nesmith, I don’t think anything has happened this year to change that rating. A mid-1st pick not getting minutes early in their rookie season for a top contender is hardly news of any sort. In fact, that’s pretty much the expectation. Especially for a team who’s best players occupy the same position(s). So yeah, I think he probably has value around the league. Taking what I think was the industry consensus on his value in the draft (rather than my lower value) and discounting it for draft class quality, I’d say he’s probably worth something like a late-1st.
so hypothetically, we could involve a third team and get two future first rounders for Barnes?
If one were to believe that we could get Nesmith + a late 1st, then yes, I’d say you could theoretically get two late 1sts for him.
I think another thing we’re debating is the value of Barnes. I don’t think this is like the Mike Dunleavy situation the Warriors had (which by the way got Stephen Jackson who might skunk Nesmith in a one-on-one game, like 100 to 0). Barnes is good while helping the young guys develop. The Celtics have a young duo of Tatum and Brown yet are trying to get Barnes. The Kings have a young duo of Fox and Haliburton and some people are acting like Barnes is a hot potato. At what point do you tell yourself this is more of a team sport than baseball and therefore let’s try to put 5 guys on the court who play well together?
Getting the playoff monkey off of their backs would make it a lot easier for the FO to engage in long-term team-building without pressure from the fanbase. I, uh, have experience with this.
Also, if Barnes keeps playing well the declining value of his contract is going to make him a much more valuable trade asset next season than he is this season.
That was the rational with Rudy Gay, but then he hurt himself and Kings couldn’t trade him so he walked in free agency. Kings got nothing.
I say strike while the iron is hot because anything can happen. If the intent is to move him now or later, why wait?
This is a little off topic but has anybody checked in on Bogi lately? He was playing really poorly and then had a pretty significant injury so that contract looks pretty bad at the moment. I was on team “Let Bogi Walk” because if he’s not a part of the future, there is not a guarantee he’ll be a solid asset moving forward. If the Hawks tried to trade Bogi right now I’m not sure what they’d be able to get.
I just read he is back to physical activity on the court, but no contact yet. I think he’ll be back before season’s end and help the Hawks to the playoffs.
The basketball-lottery-gods has been good to us lately, and I feel we need to let it ride. Invest to a future timeline and may the balls fall to our favor. We are fucking due for something big – make us fucking future contenders McNair!
At least its not Vlade making the trade, just giving the player whatever they want for no return.
I like the idea of Hali and Nesmith too.
The trade would keep us around the 5-11 range with a potential Boston pick. Maybe we could use our pick plus Boston’s to move up (or our next years). Getting into range of Barnes, Kuminga, or even Cunningham would be pretty amazing and should take priority over playoffs.
Talking about Haliburton, is this real?
https://twitter.com/CambiBrown/status/1357572566722826240?s=20
Did his legal team actually send a cease and desist letter to TKH as the replies below suggest? That would be horrible.
I mean they are profiting from his name and likeness w/out contacting him. Seems straightforward tbh
Yep. Though he seems like the type that might happily let THK sell it if they all work together and send a percentage of the proceeds to a charity of his choosing.
Yeah, contacting TKH to work together would be a much better look. This is kind of a turnoff.
It’s really TKH that should have contacted him first. Either way, maybe they can work something out.
especially since he bought one then went into a post-game and said he had to buy one before his lawyers got involved to shut it down. It’s like come on bro, there’s a better way to handle that. It’s like going to a party and grabbing a beer then calling the cops for a noise complaint once you want to go to bed.
What likeness? Does he have a trademark on part of his name? I know things in the US are possibly different but in the Netherlands he would not have much of a case.
But I guess a party with deep pockets flexing legal muscles against a small fans website is enough.
The Merc has been pulled “This campaign is no longer available due to content issues. “
Could be a good thing while they work things out. TH/TKH Merc endorsement could go National 🙂
IF they are working this out.
Just as likely they just got a cease and desist and no willingness to talk, and then it’s over.
I get the impression Tyrese is a very savvy businessman, knows exactly how to win the hearts of the local fans and markets with his old school Kings shirts and buying the TKH hoodie, but then also turning around to protect “his brand” with no compunction.
I agree with his legal team. Reese’s pieces might be fun for toddlers but Oscar Robertson ain’t no mascot for hot dogs.
James Johnson? Ew. ð¡
Here’s the “RORDOG trade targets” list:
Malik Monk
Derrick Jones Jr.
Josh Richardson
Lauri Markkanen
Dario Saric
David Nwaba
Jae’Sean Tate
Kelly Oubre
This is a beautiful trade list
Markanen!
He’d pair well with Holmes and Bagley. But he wants the max. I haven’t watched enough bulls games to know if he’s worth that.
He has played better as of late, but I certainly wouldn’t want to pay him anything close to the max.
I mentioned the other day, the Warriors could really use Barnes and Oubre would be a nice expiring for the Kings. This issue would be the Warriors taking on a long term deal, but 1) they can afford it and 2) Oubre is fitted into a TPE so if they want to extend that cap limit, they’d need a long term deal, otherwise they lose his space this summer. Basically they won’t be able fit an Oubre type deal come next summer if they let him walk.
Trade Barnes for Nesmith and the 1st. Then send Buddy to Charlotte for a Monk package. He actually fits their timeline with the signing of Hayward
At first it sounds like a Buddy is old joke that he fits the Hornets and Hayward’s timeline..then you realize it’s actually a fact lol.
I’m not sure CHA is a real fit for Hield. Of course, I’m not especially interested in Monk either, so…
hater…you’re just mad I swooped him up in the TKH fantasy league.
Hopefully, you swooped before his big game instead of after. In a similar mold, I think Nassir Little is still sitting on the waiver wire.
Blazers bench is coming up big for TKH fantasy right now. It’s unfortunate CJ and Nurk got injured, though.
I blew that one. As I was sitting there looking at the screen deciding between Trent Jr. and Simon, someone else swooped in a took Trent.
That was me.
If it’s any consolation, I grabbed Trent because I’ve got CJ and Nurk and my team has been in the tank ever since.
it doesn’t help that you’re playing a juggernaut this week.
It most certainly does not.
I must admit I was skeptical of your roster at the start, but you could definitely win it all. Looks like we also have a couple tanking teams.
Powell was another guy I was minutes too slow on. Right now, I’m just happy I re-upped my Boogie handcuff.
By the way, looks like Rozier is back. So Monk may be heading back to the 10min/DNPCD range.
At least we know Monk is a fit with Fox
We do?
Looked pretty good at UK from what I recall.
They looked like a good enough fit for college when they had a huge talent advantage over other teams. In the NBA they’re a recipe for making a historically bad defense even worse. And, of course, Monk has struggled to impact the NBA offensively as well.
We could finally beat Vanderbilt!
I think it would be a fun experiment to see him on this team before he enters restricted free agency assuming the acquisition cost isn’t more than Bjelly, or Parker plus a non-premium SRP.
YES, we do.
See Kentucky 2016-2017. Perfect pairing.
Dammit, you’re cool too. But you get a STAMP for that.
I get it, Monk hasn’t shown a lot and is undersized. They have to pay him or Graham so I think this would be a good opportunity to buy low. I also think acquiring him and bringing him off the bench can put Hali in the starters slot.
Need more Hali!
Plus if we really wanted him, he is a RFA ð¤·ð½ï¸
But Monk sure is good the ten percent of the time where he’s healthy.
I don’t think he’s been held back by injuries.
Bro. Monk is “The Microwave 2.0″…we can use him.
Makes too much sense!
I would like to add TJ Warren to this list. Thank you.
I think that boat has sailed. When he’s healthy he’s a key starter for them and a primary scorer. He would have been a GREAT option two years ago instead of re-signing Barnes though.
and the Pacers actually got a draft pick to take on his contract. I don’t know if the Kings could’ve actually made that trade though. If I remember correctly, the Suns were trying to clear cap space to trade for Saric.
Was it that, or trying. to clear space to sign Rubio?
I’m pretty sure Warren was traded to Indy on draft night, then they made the trade with the Wolves to move down in the draft.
Here’s the RORDOG trade targets list:
Malik Monk
Derrick Jones Jr.Josh Richardson
Lauri Markkanen
Dario SaricDavid NwabaJae’Sean Tate…ð¤ (questionable)
Kelly Oubre – GOLD
Fox, Hali, Someone
Hali/Richardson, Monk (I like Monk as The Microwave 2.0)
Oubre, other people
Markkanen, other people
Holmes, other people
Our starting lineup would go nuts on the opponents. I would miss Barnes as a great player and overall leader, but Fox is growing into that role. Oubre brings the same to the game as Barnes, but Oubre is nasty with it.
That lineup is insane. There will be talk about numbers, contracts, and such…and yes that info is prematurely DENIED. Monte, please make moves similar to the listed provided.
We are trending up. Keep the upward trajectory. Don’t destroy what’s becoming a winning attitude, which would eventually lead to a winning culture.
I drank the koolaid in 1998. Still the same taste, meaning I always have hope in the Kings. I see something slightly different about this team right now though. They are pulling together, we just need to plug in better complimentary players that helps us go from mediocre to contender, to a perennial powerhouse.
Dammit I believe. Premature STAMP IT on the Denver game. Denver will play immensely better, but I still believe we’re gonna kick their ass.
GO KINGS.
This aged well…ð¤£ð¤£ð¤£ð¤£
Oubre, yes please.
Actually I was kind of hoping Barnes is a Darryl Morey kind of guy.
I have a feeling many teams will be calling about Barnes
I do too, but many are going to want to dump equal salary. It may come down to a wash in contracts but the Kings my get a pick out of the deal.
Yea on the court they’d need to give up Harris and that doesn’t seem like rebuilding for Sacramento.
Give me Harris, Danny Green, and Thybulle or Maxey for Buddy and Barnes and you have a deal.
Harris, Green, and Thybulle.
DEAL!
Cool, where do we sign?
I don’t sign in for a couple days and people start talking about taking on Harris’s contract? C’mon, folks.
I know it is bad, but would you consider it if you can move Buddy and Barnes, plus get a player on a rookie deal like Thybulle or Maxey? Green is just a nice expiring.
Nah, I’d need much more than that. I’m not an especially big fan of Maxey or Thybulle. Don’t get me wrong, they’re both fine. But I think both probably max out at around 6-8 in the rotation. I don’t think either of them are anywhere near being worth taking on what, IMO, is a top 3 worst contract in the NBA. Ultimately, I just don’t want Harris’s contract. So it would take an absolute godfather offer to get me to consider it. And I don’t consider Green + Thybulle/Maxey to be that.
Yeah, you’re right. Now that I really think about it, that Harris deal is just too bad.
TOO LATE BOGI YOU SIGNED!
The Barnes for Nesmith and a first deal would be lovely.
I think Dallas will have a strong interest in both Barnes and Buddy given their needs. Unfortuanetly, they don’t have much to offer and their picks are pretty tied up.
If they’re really down on KP that would be intriguing.
Dallas could do a Hardaway & Josh Green trade for Buddy. Gives Kings an expiring and a young asset
No way Dallas does that !
interesting to see a post almost exactly like my comment that I got half dragged for haha.
I think Barnes to Boston for either Nesmith +1st or Nesmith + Langford (expect a buddy trade to follow) makes a ton of sense for both teams.
I’d rather take the 1st than Langford. Expecting that pick to be around 20. There are a number of guys likely to be available in the late-1st I’d rather have than Langford. I’m not necessarily a huge fan of Nesmith, but it does make a lot of sense on both sides.
I think its funny that the Mavs traded Barnes to clear space for the Porzingis trade. The Mavs may end up sending a 2021 top 5 pick to the Knicks. Porzingis is good, but I wouldn’t trade a 2021 top 5 pick for him.
Just another example of Vlade using his Art of War tactics to weaken his opponent.
I wonder if when they made that trade for Zinger if they knew the quality of the 2021 draft. I mean, do scouts have any idea of players coming up in their early teens to determine future draft pick trading?
I’d be surprised if they didn’t. Even if you don’t have your eye on a specific player, teams generally have a sense of the future pipeline and which years are considered to be strong or weak classes.
People have been talking up the 2021 draft since, like, 2017. The scouting for the top prospects begins when they are around 13 or 14 and start playing AAU ball and attending the big-time basketball camps.
I’m sure they did. I think they just didn’t want to wait 3-5 years to start being competitive.
Oh, yeah. Peja used to be all over that stuff.
I feel like Robert Arcter in A Scanner Darkly living 2 realities… Come on Kings! Win games! Play good! Make it into the playoffs!
#FadeForCade
But seriously, I love this trade because it makes us losing games more about development, and not about our core players not being good enough. I mean, they might not be yet, but it’s paving the way to more quality core pieces. And now to get Buddy outta here…
great comment
Oh yeah, Ainge? Well, Betty White is just the sugar momma I’m looking for.
We don’t always get what we want, pal!
If we were going to do something like this, I’d want to swap Whiteside for Robert Williams too. Williams is young enough to grow with us but also more ready than a late 1st or 2nd round pick. Whiteside probably has a little more win-now value for them and Williams isn’t going to get a ton of playing time anyway once they’re healthy. In limited minutes his net rating is outrageously good, so he could benefit a lot from the chance to be our third big.
I don’t see why they would do that. Williams is better than Whiteside, along with being younger and more suited to their system. And his playing time isn’t being impacted by the injuries. All their injuries are in the backcourt.
They’d do it because they want Harrison Barnes. This wouldn’t be a 1-for-1 trade.
Williams already has Theis and Kanter ahead of him at Center. Barnes, Ojeleye, Grant Williams at PF and Walker, Smart, Brown, Tatum, Pritchard eating all the minutes at 1-3. Most of their team is multi-positional but any way you move them around he’s the 10th or 11th man there when healthy. He would be the 7th man for us and the first or only big off the bench.
Kanter is in Portland. They have Tristan Thompson though. But I’d argue they need Williams more than they need Barnes.
Oops – thanks for the correction on Thompson / Kanter.
On their need for Williams over Barnes, Williams has only played 15 minutes or more 6 times this season. So if they’re going after Barnes at 3/$60M at all, they’re definitely doing it with the intention of putting him higher in the rotation.
I think the issue is that they’re starting two centers right now. They can get away with it on offense because Theis stretches the floor, but on defense it’s going to be a struggle for Thompson / Theis to guard Durant, Giannis, and/or Tobias Harris in a playoff series. Obviously those are tough covers for anyone, but Barnes stands a better chance and adds more value on offense than either of their current starting bigs (or Williams).
I mean, Tatum is the guy that would primarily take those assignments. He’s bigger and a better defender than Barnes. Williams has at least as much lateral quickness as Barnes with more length and rim protection, though isn’t as experienced as Barnes. Having Barnes as another option would certainly help though.
I think their ideal lineup is: Kemba, Brown, Tatum, “shooter with size who can guard”, Thompson. This allows Brown and Tatum to be mismatches against smaller guys and keeps them from getting roughed up by more physical all star PFs. Another shooter with enough size to guard PFs also spaces the floor and keeps a guy like Giannis from being able to pack the paint and disrupt penetration. Barnes fits into that mold, while Williams is redundant with Thompson and Theis, since he doesn’t create or stretch the floor on offense.
Would love the Barnes for Nesmith and a future first. Would also love to trade Buddy and Bags for Markannen if possible, If not, Buddy for Thybulle would be more realistic.
Loser mentality
If Boston offers Nesmith and their 2021 FRP for Barnes I’ll do it. Yes it sucks losing Barnes especially the way he is playing right now but we have to think big picture. I still think its a long shot for us to make the playoffs and getting rid of Barnes contract is going to help with the flexibility that Mcnair continues to preach. Getting Nesmith and a 2021 FRP in a loaded draft seems a good deal in the long run.
IMO its a win-win for the Kings. They get rid of Barnes contract in exchange for a rookie that the Kings are probably high on in Nesmith AND getting a coveted 2021 FRP plus MB3 might finally have a chance to develop and play significant minutes in the 4th even if it means losing more games. But hey that means a higher draft pick in 2021 so its all fine with me.
I really don’t understand the thought of trading Barnes (who is under the King’s control for two more years) for a player who will likely never reach Barnes’ level of production, or a draft pick who again may never reach Barnes level of production. There’s a reason the Celtics would want Barnes. He’s a good player that can start for a championship contender. If you look at the Kings this year, they have performed above what the most vocal members of this community thought. The have done that with Barnes (28), Heild (27), Fox (23), Holmes (27), Haliburton (20), and Bagley (21) leading in minutes. All of these guys except Holmes are under the Kings control for at least two more years and as it has been pointed out previously, the starters have performed exceptionally well as a unit, and Haliburton is Haliburton. The drop off is significant when the rest of the bench players come in and one could argue that the Kings are really in need of a supporting cast and should be buyers for role players at the deadline and offseason not giving away good players. No one is untradeable, but giving up a really good player for players like Nesmith or Langford seems asinine IMO. Even if the Kings are targeting 22-23 season to make a splash, it makes sense to keep players that will contribute that year.
Agree, not certain Nesmith will ever be more than GR 111 ! The draft is not a sure thing but Barnes is proven player and former 7th pick with his best seasons ahead ! Also, Langford may be a career G league level player ( failed Lottery pick ) !
Would very much like to hear more about GRs IV-CXI.
Then the Kings will forever be stuck in late lottery purgatory. This proposed trade is less about the Barnes and more about age and contract. True Barnes is a good player, the best player in that trade, and is currently in his prime, the problem is the Kings are not. Buddy and Barnes will very likely not be on the next good Kings team so it comes down to asset management.
When you are not a playoff team, and nowhere close to be one, you cash in when other contending teams are buyers. OKC and Memphis are a perfect example of this. They realized their window was done, even though they were somewhat still competitive, and sold off their good players for loads of future assets. They committed to their youth and both look poised to leap frog the Kings in their rebuilds.
OKC got out of Westbrook’s deal by trading for Paul then moved Paul are a bucket load of assets. They did the same with PG13 and Adams.
Memphis moved Conley and Gasol when the time was right to commit to their youth.
IMO, the Kings need to follow this example. They have nice young pieces in Fox, Hali and hopefully Bagley. They need a future star from this upcoming draft to take the next step and additional young talent to round out the roster. Players like Buddy and Barnes are still good enough to help with the current win column but will not help in that fashion two years from now when Fox and Hali will need the help.
This needs to go Purple
Theoretically your argument has merit and I agree but practically you would have to identify Nesmith as a high quality starter and potential star or else you are taking a step back.
You would almost have to have ranked him in the same tier as Ty and it was coin flip you ended up taking Haliburton. And project he is ready to play 20-25 MPG now. What are the odds of this?
You are also operating on presumption the Kings going to go into tank mode in this hypothetical trade will lead to acquiring the superior player. That is theoretical with new lottery odds and countless examples of the better player lasting longer than the inferior one.
We got a superstar at #5 in Fox while #2 pick Lonzo Bust will probably be on his third team soon. Our #12 pick is on his way to ROY finalist while the #1 pick in the draft (Anthony Edwards) is shooting 37%.
I would entertain the idea of trading Barnes, but you better be getting a star back, or a guy that you absolutely love. It is not enough to say we need to acquire young prospects that fit our timeline. That means nothing unless you get your top target back.
The reason the OKC trade worked is they got SGA, who has better stats than Fox!
It was not the philosophy that worked it was targeting the right guy! The only way a trade like this one proposed would be if the Front Office had Nesmith ranked nearly as high or as high as Hailburton. That is the overriding issue.
Buddy has not helped is at all wins this season and there is NO reason to think Barnes will not be equally as good two years from now. That is just nonsense.
Barnes is a pros pro dedicated to fitness and refining his game and can sustain his high level of play for 3-4 years, NO problem at all!
Exactly. They got proven value back. Not unproven assets.
They had PG3 to trade. Not Harrison Barnes.
For the record, you are either misrembering or misrepresenting what happened. George trade value was limited at the time with his public declaration he would only play in LA and the Thunder getting bounced in the 1st round for the second consecutive year and George bricking the way out.
The Thunder GM leveraged two LA teams against one another although after the fact it was discovered George never seriously considered the Fakers. The Clips paid so high on PG bc his acquisition was tied to getting Kawhi. There were able to score a bonanza, five 1st rounders and SGA bc LAC were effectively trading for Paul George AND Kawhi.
Paul George did not retrieve 5 1sts and SGA all on his own, it included getting arguably the best player in the game.
But I am actually glad you mention Paul George because he refutes the idea a player peaks at 26 or 27 years and it is all downhill from there. He has played his best basketball into his early 30s as he put that leg injury behind him.
With the new training methodology and equipment, the actually peak years for a player may be closer to 28-32 years of age, meaning that HBs best years are yet to come!
Man, you read A LOT into my 8-word statement about PG being a better trade asset than Barnes. And even if you think PG is playing his best basketball now (as a 30-year-old), that wouldn’t actually refute the idea of the general NBA peak. He’s a single data point. As I mentioned, outliers exist. There is a chance Barnes is also an outlier. It isn’t the most likely outcome. But there’s a chance.
Also, for posterity, the average age of the All-NBA players last season? 27.2.
It is just a fact the reason OKC got a ton of assets back for George is because of the extenuating circumstances that I outlined. You implied the Thunder got what they did because of who George is as a player when in fact they would not have got the BEST player in the NBA if they did not overpay for George. Am I wrong, let me know!
The reason OKC got a lot of assets is that George is an excellent basketball player. The reason they got even more than the typical market may have born for an elite player is the extenuating circumstance. Even without those circumstances PG is/was a much better trade asset than Barnes.
The Clippers gave up the motherload after Paul George’s team got bounced in 5 games in the 1st round in which he was 15-47 from 3s over 5 games, a scintillating 31%, ha-ha-ha!
The guy was still shaking off his snapped leg, yeah I am sure the main motivation for the Clips was give up the Moon for this bricklayer with a bum wheel and questionable prima donna attiude! Kawhi was the Prize (coming off an NBA title with TOR), Paul George was the Pill to get the Prize.
Now I do think George is a very good to great player. He’s smooth and fundamentally superior. I remember wanting the Kings to get him when he was at Fresno State. I think he went 10th a few slots before our pick. He is a very nice player, but his career took that turn for the worse after the injury and the expectations with OKC.
He was a choke artist malcontent incompatible with Westbrook who narrowed the free agency market by saying he would sign with only two teams. OKC would have got less than half of what they got for him if Kawhi was not attached.
So when we talk about what HB could fetch in a trade vs George, it is not as simplistic as you make it out to be. I would say HB has more value than George back if you remove the extentuating circumstances. No team knew PG would get back to full health including LAC when they acquired him, but getting Kawhi in the process was worth the risk. That was a very atypical situation, so to ignore that is to ignore or overlook the reality at the time.
HB is playing better now than Paul George was back then. The stats support that. PG was high volume and low effeciency. You dont trade 5 1st rounders and an elite prospect for that unless you are getting the NBA finals MVP in the process.
Yeah, I think you’re going to have a really hard time finding people that agree with this:
and this:
First, he was 4+ seasons removed from his broken leg and coming off his best individual season of his career.
Here’s a comparison of George’s last season in OKC and Barnes season so far.
Literally, the only thing Barnes is doing better than PG did is scoring efficiency. Of course, a 58 TS% (which isn’t inefficient by any measure) on 29 USG is more positively impactful than 64% on an 18 USG.
It’s also funny to put a bunch of emphasis on George’s playoff shooting that season when A) George shot with the same efficiency in the playoffs that he did in the regular season (58 TS%) and B) Barnes is famous among Warrior fans his shot disappearing in the playoffs (career 50 TS% over 4 seasons.)
I respect that you have strong opinions and obviously think them through, but at some point you have to stop presenting personal conjecture and verifiably false stats as if they are fact.
Good point. That scenario reminds me of the Cousins trade, where they loved Buddy Hield. The Pelicans got the better player at the time and we got a player we were high on in that draft.
It seems like the biggest asset you want out of the Barnes trade is losses. Nesmith and Langley are not really assets at all at this point. Like I said, no one is untradeable and I’m not opposed to trading Barnes for a younger player with upside, but that player better have proved something in the league before I make that leap. Not draft picks and not those chumps. Maybe a Michael Porter Jr. or a Tyler Herro type that are early in their development and have some question marks (injury history/consistency/efficiency) but at least you know they are NBA players. Finally, the Kings have to be thinking about building a team for the 22-23 season. Beyond that, they pretty much only have Fox.
This is silly. While I was never especially high on either, they were both lottery picks within the past 2 seasons. Non-top picks NOT getting minutes early in their careers for a contender is the norm. Not a strike against them. Langford got some time last season and showed some promise. The injury issues definitely knock his value down a bit, but to say they aren’t assets is just baseless.
And you aren’t getting anywhere near guys like Herro and Porter with Barnes.
This is how I feel. The Bucks/Bogdan trade is something I would hope for with Barnes. If McNair likes Nesmith, go get him.
I want to stay closer to pick 6 than pick 12 in the upcoming draft.
You’re right that the Thunder/Grizzlies went young and that they both may leap frog us, but they were trading away guys that made them a playoff team. We want Fox to be the guy for years to come and want to set him up to be able to do that. Completely different situations imo.
I’m not as high on Nesmith as maybe others, but even if you are, I think you could easily hold off and look at this team closer to the deadline and see where they are. If we continue to play well and are in the mix, trading Barnes could be a significant blow to morale and could impact Fox’s desire to stay in Sac. Meaning if he’s trying to make the playoffs and we trade away a key piece that could get us there this year, it could have further repercussions down the line. Especially if whoever we trade for doesn’t have an impact.
However, if this is fools gold, then we’ll likely start dropping in the standings even with Barnes and then you make the trade with Fox and co. knowing that Barnes wasn’t going to be enough of a difference maker anyways.
Another way to look at this is with Paul,l and the Thunder. They let him get their young guys to the playoffs so they know what it feels like to win. Then, you trade him to get assets. Barnes isn’t Paul, but if he can help get Fox/Haliburton to the playoffs, you let him do that first. Then trade him.
You make a good point. You don’t have to move anyone right now (unless a ridiculously good offer came in) because the team is playing well and moral is up. A move right now really could piss of someone like Fox and that would be horrible.
If, however, the Kings are still games out of the playoff picture a move that doesn’t make immediate improvement may be an easier pill to swallow for the locker room.
The players have to buy into management decisions a lot more than fans do.
Well said. How many years were the Kings looking for a SF before Barnes came along? This “build for the future” by trading for some “prospect” and the rights to another “prospect” gets old.
Of course it does because the Kings front office was a joke for years.
But…the Kings have never done that and look where it has gotten them.
When was the last time the Kings traded away a good player for prospects or picks? All I can think of is DMC for Buddy and pick.
I’d argue they have never “built for the future” in the Vivek era. It’s just a bunch of middling rosters, with fingers crossed for the playoffs, that get late lottery picks.
Yep, we’re just seeing the hamster wheel continue to turn here. The issue hasn’t been that they’re constantly moving good players for potential. The issue has been they’re constantly over-paying and over-rating players and sitting on assets until they have no choice but to sell low or watch them walk for nothing.
I think this comment thread is what happens to a lot of fans of a team that hasn’t made the playoffs in 15 years. That 8th seed is pretty intoxicating if you never make the playoffs if the team has a couple good weeks and kinda sorta looks like they might have an outside shot at the playoffs. But as BHE said, we are on the hamster wheel and the only way to get off of it is to get a lot more talented. Harrison Barnes is having a GREAT season for him and I think he is going to be in demand as we get closer to the trade deadline and this is the exact perfect time to cash in on our good fortune. Barnes should definitely be traded for decent value and to me, Nesmith and Boston’s first is a solid deal for this team. I hope that Monte understands this (I think he probably does) and has the power to execute his vision.
Agreed, I just really hope nothing happens to players like Buddy or Barnes that would prevent the Kings from cashing in on their services, much like the Rudy Gay situation. I’m fine to wait until the deadline to make moves, but wouldn’t it be horrible if their games fell off a cliff or, God forbid, they get injured, and the opportunity is lost.
I think the best way to get out of mediocrity is to use our above average assets to compile more assets. The DMC trade was the best return for our players that we have had since Richmond, Jason Williams, and Peja.
The bigger issue with the DMC trade is that Vlade failed to see the talent at number 10. (Bam, Mitchell, John Collins, Jarrett Allen to name a few)
Looking at our past trades was a miserable experience! (I highly recommend a drink in hand.. lol) We traded our highest quality players for some really bad replacements.
We acknowledge Fox and Hali as the guys. Why not trade others to bring in assets then use those assets to land a bigger target or more talent.
There are a lot of guys on this team I really like and respect (especially Harrison) but the vital keepers to me are:
Fox
Hali
Holmes (Sign him or so help me Slampson)
Everyone else in my mind is a potential candidate for a good deal: picks, cash, promising rooks or bench players who can play meaningful minutes. I could maybe argue to keep Bags since his value isn’t where it could be yet.
So the Celtics need a switchable defender who can shoot 3s, yet Nesmith can’t get playing time? All their point guards are bandaged up, yet Romeo is not on the depth chart? Hmm. Plenty of bust whispers coming out of Boston. And it’s not as if they don’t give rookies a chance (see Tatum, Brown, Semi, Pritchard, etc). Barnes ain’t a hot potato. I’d rather target players we really want than take what Ainge has thrown in the trash.
I do think this is a giant red flag – trading with Danny Ainge is like buying something from Warren Buffet. I think it is usually best to just pull a “New phone, who ‘dis?” when Ainge calls.
And then he said I’m a future first rounder and we talked.
According to the Scounting Video, anything more than 2 dribbles, “handles is poor”. Nesmith is #24. #24 with poor handles, remind you of anyone you know, lmao
But this kid is a good prospect, has a 6’10” wingspan. I can see why Ainge would like him bc he does have some resemblance to Jaylen Brown though not quite the athlete.
The Celtics do not want HB though. I do not see it. He is too duplicative of Brown and Tatum. Unless they are going to play Barnes at PF??? That could be a possibility.
The way they are thinking is who can we get to check Giannis and KD and even a guy like Ben Simmons in the playoffs, and maybe they view Barnes has someone who can help there.
With Smart, Brown, Barnes, Tatum, Thies, you would have a lot of switchable defenders, that is a very formiddable team with Kemba running all over the place.
I would feel better about trading Barnes if Woodward showed us something, but the guy was totally lost and clueless in preseason!
Woodward was the guy I was pinning my hopes on being a perimeter and interior garbage pail type player who could blend in with anyone, but his lateral mobility was lacking and his shot is trash.
Until proven otherwise Woodward is an undersized PF with no ability to play the wing. His limitations makes losing Barnes more prohibitive.
Barnes has a skillset no one our roster comes close to matching and a very rare skillset across the league, but yeah lets just peddle him off ASAP (/s).
Three question marks following your question about whether Barnes would play PF in Boston.
Do you mean in the same as he has here, and at his previous stops?
In spot minutes, and closing games, true . But if Celtics were to add him it would have to be with the intention of playing Barnes full time PF with Tatum getting the minutes at SF. Barnes has never played PF full- time, though I think it would work. In fact, I proposed to make him our starting PF before the season began!
But who do you think is playing PF when Bagley isn’t in the game, if not Harrison Barnes? And when Bagley is in the game with Barnes while Holmes is out, and HW isn’t on the floor, practically speaking, Bagley is your five, and Barnes is your four. These aren’t insignificant hunks of time.
I don’t think MB3’s played much at C lately (which is probably wise given his defensive struggles at C).
I know Barnes plays PF for us sometime. I proposed it and endorsed it. It opens the floor for Fox, our Closer, just like it would for Kemba, one of their closers.
This coach no longer plays Bagley at the 5. We talked about that failed experiment. The point is Barnes has never played full-time PF, with the Mavs, with the Warriors or with us.
All I am saying is this hypothetical trade would only go down if the Celtics envision Barnes as a full-time PF, which would be a new role for him.
Barnes literally played PF in the Warriors “death lineup” that won them the title.
What year(s) are you referring to?
The year Barnes won the title with the Warriors. Their go to lineup was Curry, Klay, Iggy, Barnes and Green. It’s what got Barnes his fat deal from Dallas.
Fair point but that was the year Bogut started at Center and Green at PF and Barnes spending most of his time at SF, so my original point stands.
In 2015-16 (HBs last year with the Warriors), Green started 81 games. Bogut started 66 games. Barnes started 59 games so it is fair to say most of his time was spent at SF, my original assertion.
I never said Barnes did not play PF, I said it was never his primary role!
Bogut played 20 minutes a game that year and Barnes spent the majority of his minutes at PF while playing 600 more minutes than Bogut, but whatever…
I guess it only matter matters that Bogut started, despite being 6th in minutes per game.
If you don’t recall the heavy minutes of the “death lineup” on that 73 win team, then I don’t know what to tell you.
He’s played the majority of his minutes at PF in 6 of his 9 seasons.
What position has he played for us since we acquired him? Bjelica was the PF a year ago, not Barnes. Bagley is the PF now, not Barnes. He was SF on the Warriors and Mavs too. Let’s not play games.
Basketball Reference and other resources do list Barnes as a PF but that is for the fans who take the information at face value instead of doing their due diligence.
Now I do think Barnes can play PF, in fact I advocated for it! But the main point is that if the Celtics were to acquire him it would be the intention of playing him at PF almost exclusively, something he has never done, but can.
I think Tatum plays more a PF than Barnes does. A lineup with Brown, Barnes, and Tatum is lethal not matter who plays where. They could switch onto anyone.
Barnes has more muscle than Taum to defend the post, but there is a lot of interchangeability there, if that is a word. 😛
Interchangeability/positionless, it’s all the same.
Just for reference, Tatum not only played but started at PF almost exclusively last season. He also earned an all-star not for doing it.
Brown, Barnes, and Tatum would virtually be the new version of Brown, Hayward, and Tatum, but cheaper.
IMO, Ainge would be viewed as a genius for using the TPE he created in not maxing Hayward to get Barnes for nothing but a late pick and a rookie who is not part of the rotation. That is how good GM’s play for titles.
Hopefully McNair can get there someday.
Tatum is not a PF, but call him what you will. He is more of a combo stretch forward in my mind at 6’8 210 pounds and face up game.
Dont you think to be an exclusive PF you have to want to operate out of the low post to a fair degree? That is not his game. He is not a low post player and he does not want battle in the paint.
He is a finesse face-up guy who patterned his game after Kobe. They trained together, Was Kobe a PF too?
The starting lineup you are referring to was:
Wing Tatum
Wing Brown
Wing Hayward
PG – Walker
C – Theis
If you want to contend of this lineup Tatum was the exclusive PF be my guest, but Brown and Hayward are more physical players likely to be assigned to the more physical wings. And if Barnes was added to the team, he would spend more time guarding the post because he has more bulk to fill that role.
There is interchangeability there, but when I think of Tatum I think of almost a PURE SF, just like Barnes most natural position is SF but more of an ability to play in the post.
who cares.
WTF are you going on about?
Wait…how come it doesn’t say they are wings?
You can say that Bagley doesn’t play center, but if he and Barnes are in the game, and Holmes or Whiteside aren’t, who do think, from a practical standpoint, spends more time defending, and being defended by the other team’s center?
If we learned nothing else last year, just saying a guy is a point guard doesn’t necessarily make him a point guard. Saying Bagley never plays center doesn’t mean that he isn’t frequently carrying the responsibilities of that position a decent amount of the time.
To answer your question, Bagley would defend the center, but I don’t see that happening.
You think we are going to play Bagley and Barnes on the frontline with Whiteside and Holmes on the bench? I don’t think that is going to happen ever again because when we tried it failed miserably and we abandoned it 2-3 weeks ago.
I think that anytime Bagley is on the floor for the rest of the year, it will be with Holmes or Whiteside, or even Metu, because Bagley has NO ability to play defensive center, and this coach finally and correctly reached this belated conclusion.
I think you are misreading the situation if you think Bagley has any future as a center. Our defense is porous enough with Buddy and Marvin and Joseph getting significant minutes, we do not need to compound the problem by asking Marvin to be the primary rim protector.
I didn’t say that Bagley necessarily has a future as a center. What I said was that, for all intents and purposes, he spends a lot of his court time as the team’s de facto center.
I don’t understand how you keep misinterpreting my comments, but if I can clarify anything, let me know. I’m sure I can think of a fifth or sixth way to say the same thing.
Compelling argument but I don’t like the return proposed. Barnes is just coming into his prime and is the reason we won as many games as we have. He’s very professional and a great teammate for our young Kings. I prefer we keep him.
Technically, Barnes is leaving his prime. NBA players, in general peak around 26-27, decline slowly to 30-ish, then start to fall more quickly. Obviously, there are outliers.
He’s definitely a great teammate.
With Barnes, I feel like he’s moved into his “old man game” stage. What I’ve noticed is that he’s just more crafty now. He uses his strength to exploit the mouse in the house. It feels like he almost always tricks the defender to go for a block then does a reverse layup on drives. He’s making a ton of smart, productive passes. I don’t know what “crafty, old-man strength Barnes” is worth over the next two seasons, but I think it’s probably more valuable than previous iterations of Barnes we’ve seen over the last few years.
Maybe. But the smart money simply isn’t on the sustainability of a 700 minute-based breakout at 28-years-old. That isn’t to say it isn’t possible. But you generally don’t want to be betting on that. And even if it is, he’s still just playing up to his contract. Not providing the excess value that makes a team good.
Improving his agility and mobility from a seasons ago “feels like an old man game” to you? Uh, sorry but that is just 100% incorrect assessment IMO.
If anything he turned back the clock and rediscovered the fountain of youth. He’s the Benjamin Button of the NBA 😛
Barnes had a hard time shaking his man breaking down his defender one-on-one last year. I was critical of him all the time in this regard. Thats not the case this year. He’s a rejuvenated player. He’s never had a serious injury and he loves playing off Fox and Ty. It is a great partnership.
It is okay if we want to explore trading him, I am open to a no-brainer deal, but lets not pretend HB is a creaky old man wielding his YMCA tricks when he looks as spry and dynamic as ever!
And you don’t even need to take my word for it because if Barnes had lost a half of a step instead of gaining half of a step he would not have a career high Free Throw Rate of 40%, well above his average of 26%.
But if you want to talk about “old man game” it is Buddy Yield who qualifies!
Buddy has an old man game if I have ever seen one. He added muscle, lost quickness, and has resorted to launching bricks with two inches of space bc he lacks the juke moves to get cleaner looks. So you may have your players confused!
Or you may not understand what I’m saying! Who’s to know?!
Barnes has been playing at least to his contract but call me dubious on those returns. He has moved from drastically overpaid to a justifiable expense. I think his contract is still a marginal negative even in his present form, and thus a trade is likely dependent on taking on some bad money in exchange for things we actually want with most teams.
Boston with its trade exception does offer an interesting foil where the money is likely not as big of a deterrent. That said I think the Celtics would market that as a benefit/asset to the Kings oppose to simply the mechanism being able to create a deal. Fact is the outright space created is more valuable than an expiring or bad contract which is the likely other option in dealing Barnes with a different suitor.
I think a trade with them is plausible. the Ainge comments and above points allude to that. But a 1st and Nesmith/Langford I would say is very unlikely. One or the other with the exception is still worthy business. You are creating immediate room next offseason with an asset aligned with the core. Moving this size contract with whats basically an immediate expiring is fairly unprecedented. Especially for a player whose contract has appeared inflated for the majority of its duration to this point. Both a 1st space and player in my opinion is too rich to speculate. But one of space and player/ space and pick are more than worthy of a trade.
Whatever happens kudos to Barnes’s form offering speculation that seemed very unlikely even a few months ago. He’s looked great, a deal I think could happen this season which I didnt expect.
I love Harrison Barnes the person and Harrison Barnes the player. The Kings should do any trade like these in a heartbeat.
Any?
“Any trade like these,” meaning similar to the ones proposed in the article.
But any?
VD ain’t in charge any more. I don’t think we ought do any trade like these in a heartbeat, if at all.
Consider? Sure, why not? But “do any trade like these?” That seems reckless.
Any like these would imply a ’19 or ’20 top 15 pick and a 1st, so that sounds pretty safe for a return
A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush. If we’re trading Barnes and Buddy for a player, I’d hope that player come with more than just potential. If we trade for a pick, I’d hope it’s at least a lottery pick. Otherwise, find a different way to plug holes. I understand it takes star talent to win championships. I don’t see a scenario by which Barnes or Buddy can be traded for that. Maybe we should model after 14-15 hawks before going sink or swim.
The Kings small ball lineup of Fox, Hield, Halliburton, Barnes and Holmes has blitzed opponents by 24 points per 100 possessions (and closed several wins). Among lineups that have logged 90 min together only the Clippers starting 5 has a better margin – from Lowe.
Kings have to get fair value for fair value. There is no pressing need for a fire sale of Harrison Barnes if the return value isn’t there.
https://twitter.com/kirkgoldsberry/status/1357689733372145667?s=21
THE KINGS ARE MOVING CLOSER TO THE LINE!!!
(I hope they can move into that little area to the right of the Pelicans. Great offense, not worst defense basically)
A couple Barnes trade returns I like for both teams:
Nesmith + 2022 1st
Gary Harris, RJ Hampton, 2023 2nd
Oubre Jr, Poole, Wanamaker and a pick
Myles Turner + McDermott for Barnes + Holmes + 2nd
Derrick Jones Jr + Covington for Barnes + James
I like the Heat as a partner:
Barnes/Bjelica
for
Expiring Olynk/Iggy
Plus Kendrick Nunn/Gabe Vincent
Kings get a younger possible replacement for Hield. Plus, a backup for Fox.
Olynyk being on the team might mean he gets resigned…. no thanks.
He’s on an expiring. I don’t think Vlade is here anymore. That would free up 27 mil in cap room for the Kings next season. Iggy/Olynk
I personally don’t love Kendrick Nunn. I don’t think he’ll ever be more than a mediocre backup PG and having that as the main return for a player of Barnes caliber seems to be one of those trades that we’re all smacking our faces over a couple years from now. Every return I listed in the OP I think has a reliable player below Barnes level (Nesmith, Harris, Oubre, Covington) + a developmental piece that could grow into something more if given the time (Picks, Hampton, Poole, Jones Jr). Turner is the only trade where you’re packaging assets to get a more valuable player.
No. HELL no. We’re not making the Celtics better. Fuck that. Any trade from them has to include Jaylen Brown. Nesmith is an unknown right now. Can’t tell if his game is solid at this level. He’s not getting much time on the court. I honestly had to look up Romeo Langford because I thought he was Master P’s son.
Hell no. Danny you want Barnes so bad, then pay up.
We don’t even know if Danny wants Barnes at all. I’ll bet my left toe he doesn’t want Barnes bad enough to give up Brown.
Give the toe up.
Why would we trade him? Best season of his career and the team is on the cusp of the playoffs. Plus the deals you mentioned are just laughably sad. He’s also our leader in the locker room.
Cusp of the playoffs?
Playoffs, you said playoffs??
The author can’t say with certainty that the Kings would get worse if they jettison Barnes. That would have to play out over time.
But overall, now is the time to strike while the iron is hot, and trade Barnes while in a position of strength.
This sounds like a typical Boston sports story. The rest of the league should just give us their best players. Hey Boston fans, are you watching Tom Brady in the Super Bowl tomorrow?
Badge Legend