Turning the clock forward three or four weeks later, a dystopian change has overcome some of the loudest voices in the room. Fox was never good enough – but the roster around him was just fine. Fox isn’t as good as Zach LaVine, nor is he as healthy, despite the fact that LaVine has missed a third of his career games. The Kings were never going anywhere with Fox at the helm. Fox is a snake akin to the fan-hated awfulness that was the unprofessional joke, George Karl.
Whatever version of Fox existed days prior quite literally vanished in the muck of post-Sacramento turnabout.
It’s disappointing. It’s embarrassing. It’s predictable.
Instead of appreciating that De’Aaron Fox stuck through this mess of an organization for eight years, the team and some members of the local, Kings-dependent media have strived to throw as much mud his way as possible. Instead of blaming Vivek Ranadive for his incompetence, Matina Kolokotronis for manipulating people and processes to gain power and influence, and Monte McNair for his complete inability to build a competent roster, Fox will shoulder the blame for Sacramento missing the playoffs in 11 of the 12 years of Vivek Ranadive’s ownership.
He’s the problem, not us, they’ll tell you.
This is the same game plan of distract and dissuade that was executed when Mike Malone was fired, when Mike Brown was (deservedly) fired, when Isaiah Thomas was traded, when DeMarcus Cousins was traded, when Rudy Gay was traded, and now when De’Aaron Fox was traded. Anger and vitriol are directed at the person leaving this armpit of an organization, rather than at the individuals responsible for severing relationships and building awful rosters.
De’Aaron Fox didn’t draft Nik Stauskas or Willie Cauley-Stein or Marvin Bagley or Justin James or Harry Giles or Davion Mitchell or Devin Carter. He didn’t trade countless second rounders for cash, for future second rounders, or for Chris Duarte. He didn’t hire Pete D’Alessandro or Vlade Divac or Luke Walton or Monte McNair. He didn’t allow shadow personnel to run the organization and allow in-fighting and political power moves to dictate incredibly important decisions. He didn’t allow his daughter to run Sacramento’s G League team. He didn’t hold onto veteran after veteran after veteran until they lost all value in the hopes that a miracle playoff run would occur.
He didn’t even ask to be traded.
He just played basketball to the best of his ability, mostly with unqualified teammates around him.
De’Aaron Fox isn’t perfect. He’s not a perfect person. He’s not a perfect leader. He’s not a perfect player. Hell, he’s probably not even a “superstar”.
He just deserves better than what the Kings, and their messengers, can offer.
And if he really, really didn’t want to re-sign here, can you blame him?
.
1000% agree and what I keep posting. Vivek is a piece of shit.
Fox was really good. It is a bad thing he’s gone. The Kings just lost their best player and it’s ALL on Vivek.
No Hali. No Fox. No clue ego owner get lost
No Haliburton but we have Sabonis. See what Bulls site has to say about ZL and mediocrity:
https://pippenainteasy.com/kings-about-learn-zach-lavine-lesson-bulls-know
The only think that article makes me think of is the fact that with Fox most of us agreed that this team is probably a 9-10 seed. So we basically are the same….
Regardless of how he’s run the organization, these are the Seattle Kings without Vivek.
Bonership.
Looks like he could use a nice bacon avocado scramble.
ooohhh sorry Mr. Karl.. thats not covered on the menu.
All those former players really speak poorly of the franchise (but seemingly not the city/fans). Have any players spoke positively about the org that weren’t part of that glory days era? I have to believe that many players are probably not wrong.
Don’t forget former coaches too!
I appreciate Fox. Hell, I have a card autographed by him, and his jerseys.
Do I get why he wanted out? Sure.
Do I blame him for the organization’s incompetence? Not at all.
Am I salty with how he handled the breakup and leaving? Sure.
Here you go, Fox. Here’s a model of what you can say to save credibility. I can save you the Klutch Sports intern that charged you whatever to write that meaningless goodbye.
Not so much the letter…it’s the unqualified pot shots at the Kings after the fact. I’m already peeved that we gave up possibly better trades because it looks like he was angling out for the last year or so.
Good- Fox should take pot shots. Just like Mike Malone still does.
Because Vivek deserves it. And it shows you how fucked yo he is- that ex players and coaches wpuld
talk shit.
He’s that bad of an owner. He’s even worse to his employees and those who deal with him. He’s cheap. He’s gross. I wish he was gone.
We are fucked until he leaves
I vehemently disagree with the notion that the mediocre haul for Fox his fault. Maybe it’s partly on Klutch for leaking and damping the leverage. But it’s 90% Vivek and his long-time desire for Lavine.
If Fox has been angling to get out for the past year then it sounds like he’s the only one in this relationship that possesses any level of competence.
I’ll actually retract my prior statements. Looks like Fox reached out to CD and had some of that very important context and details.
All on ownership.
Where did he misstep even if he didn’t make the statement you suggest?
His misstep is not moving on and doing national interviews/tweeting potshots at the Kings.
He got everything he ever wanted; grow up, move on, keep your legacy intact. At some point, it turns into an attack on Sacramento, not ownership, unless me makes that clear.
The clarification is needed because you have fuckwits like Draymond and Gilbert “Guns-Felon” Arenas shooting off their mouths about why anyone would go to Sacramento, as a place.
He is responding to the commentary coming out of Sac. If the idiots inside the org. weren’t attempting to save public face, Fox would have nothing to respond to.
He doesn’t need to respond. Just go about his business and focus on being in SA.
Responding makes it seem like he has something to hide. Enjoy playing with the tall French guy and a good organization. Time in Sac is over, move on.
And the FO doesn’t need to start it, as they have done here. Had they kept their mouths shut Fox would have had nothing to respond to.
This is the trademark of the Ranadive error. But sure, it’s Fox’s fault.
Fox is at fault. The org is at fault. They all have a hand in this. I hate soap operas, and we are seeing one play out right in front of our eyes.
Be nice to just focus on basketball again.
Maybe, just maybe this should be the mantra of the organization?
Should be the focus of everyone involved.
100% He is well within his right to defend his honor and character when it is attacked. Fox isn’t perfect, but the significant faults of this team are not his.
Wouldn’t not responding be more indicative of something to hide?
Yup. “He’s not denying it, so it must be true!” would become the narrative.
Then IMO, I would love an actual response of what was wrong besides “y’all know Sac – dysfunction.”
Funny, but that’s all the response that I need. That and the history of the basketball ops under Ranadive.
“issues with ownership and management” – so there’s more to the story?
That’s what it sounds like, I’d rather he call a spade a spade and tell us the problem that was so glaring he didn’t want to finish his career here.
might as well be honest.
well, it’s potentially different from what we’ve heard before. After last season’s play-in loss, during the postgame interview, he complained about “the way we’re built”. then, after not signing an extension, he talked about wanting to see indications that the team would improve and continue to improve. Then he went on the Draymond Green podcast and you know the rest. The words “issues with ownership and management” suggest there’s more.
the most honest answer might simply be that there was an opportunity to play with Wemby and he’d be a fool not to team up with him.
When I heard that Fox didn’t intend to resign my internal response was, “I can’t blame him. I wouldn’t either were I in his shoes.” This franchise is sadly a joke. Hopefully someday Vivek will sell and we get lucky enough to get a competent head of the organization. I fear it will take a scandal to get him out a la Dan Snyder. Start a city wide petition asking him to sell? Vote of no confidence in his leadership? As far fetched as those options are, they somehow seem more probable than improved leadership from Vivek and Monte
Exactly! I am a Washington fan. And seeing that piece of shot human being known is Dan Snyder leave was unbelievably lucky.
Now, look at them. Real owner. Hires real GM and lets them run it. Fantastic QB. Back in contention.
Just like that. And that’s all it takes. An owner without a huge ego who can give power to a GM. And spend a little money. Try to win.
This is why I hate Vivek so much. I seen what a horrible owner does to a franchise/a city. Kills it.
I wish we could get rid of him. I fear years of this
At least Washington fans universally hated Snyder. For some reason a large part of this fanbase is now bent on excusing this FO’s moves and blaming former players. We were at that point already but making the playoffs one year gave the fanbase another half-decade(?) of false hope.
love Daniels! Happy for you guys!
I’m sure Vivek is still the savior of the team in the eyes of many, which is somewhat fair. Who knows if the Kings had any other path to staying is Sac were it not for Vivek. But he’s a horrendous operator of a professional basketball team.
Vivek is a trash owner.
I love Fox. He will always be one of my favorite Kings and wish both sides could have worked through their differences. I wanted him to stay. Taking the emotions out of it and looking at the facts, Monte wanted to extend him but he wanted out. He admitted that publicly months ago (before Mike Brown being fired) and in an interview a couple days said he needed a new start. I don’t blame the guy. In the interview it’s pretty obvious this wasn’t a sudden feeling but something he has wanted for months. I’m sure the Mike Brown firing was the nail in the coffin, and Monte not holding a press conference was the funeral service.
Totally understand why Foxy wanted out. As far as franchise cornerstones and all-time stat leaders wanting to be traded goes, he handled it really well (here’s looking at you Jimmy Buckets). Regardless of the outcome, he is an all time King on and off the court.
And that escalated…
https://bsky.app/profile/caderedkey.bsky.social/post/3lhk7aisyec2m
While KHTK isn’t a beacon of broadcasting excellence, 1320 is a clown car towing a dumpster fire. Barling should be ashamed of himself for how he’s acting (if he had any self-awareness).
I don’t see why people have a problem with Fox calling out the owner/org. They are dysfunctional! Fuck em.
And glad you’re using blue sky
I deleted my Twitter account a few weeks ago, and I’m glad I did. Don’t miss it one bit.
I’m glad more NBA folks are on there.
Sell the Team!!!
I wish. Maybe at some point we’ll have to break out the billboard protest.
Fox will be missed for sure. One of my favorite all time Kings and the organization could have done a lot more to help him out. Do I sound like a broken record yet?
My question is who’s next? Do we have a clear face of the franchise moving forward?
This guy
Thank you Swipa. If you end up beating us in the Playins, fuck it I’ll still be wishing you all the best and hoping you eventually win a a title with Wemby.
I thought Fox’s social media statement was pretty respectful of the fans and the city. Obviously the last few weeks have probably been stressful for him and the team. The common denominator in this organization’s lack of success is quite obvious. That said, I don’t think it’s a good look for him to be tweeting back and forth with Sacramento media members, or bad-mouthing the organization. He’s in San Antonio now.
Unfortunately for fans, if you want to be a fan of the Sacramento Kings, you are stuck with this shitshow owner. Media members have their own incentives, and some are incentivized to shovel crap and create controversy.
It’s pretty gross at this point that it’s become SOP for (some) Sac media to trash former players/staff in order to defend all of Vivek’s ineptitudes.
100%
“didn’t ask to be traded”
Seems we’d be arguing semantics here. None the less, he was fun while he was here, now he’s not. Time to close the book on the Fox Era.
As an aside, Karl was also the victim of severe organizational/FO dysfunction, with a huge assist from a locker room cancer. I harbor zero ill feelings towards him.
To your point, how do you hire a coach that is hellbent on trading Cousins when the front office is hellbent on not trading Cousins?
I would say looking back, Trading cousins was a poor move.
Fox and Cousins together would have been amazing.
What a load of shit. The kings gave Fox generational wealth and made sure to keep his buddy Monk here(who fox had no problem leaving in the dust).
Publicly saying that he needed help because the roster wasn’t good enough.
Pretty sure the locker room was awkward as hell after all that. He has to go play with dudes who were just told they weren’t good enough by their “star player”. Then they see him be aloof on the court for half the season.
He handled his sh!t so poorly. You want upgrades, fine. But that’s a conversation to be had with management, not made public.
He lacks a lot of leadership qualities, which became abundantly apparent the past 2 seasons.
I’m going to guess that Sabonis & DDR nodded affirmatively (though silently) over Fox’s pleas for a better roster.
Did they make it know that they didn’t want the guys in the locker room because they weren’t good enough? There’s a difference. Fox was the only person we heard from about the players. He handled it poorly.
This is SOP in the NBA. Curry, LeBron, Giannis…the list goes on and on and on of players stating that their respective rosters need more talent. And if anyone at this level gets butthurt over that, they are in the wrong profession.
Just because the top level guys do it, doesn’t make it okay. It’s a bad look, and I hate when I hear players say that. Those guys are out their battling to win games too, and then get pooped on by a teammate.
We don’t have to agree, and that’s fine. I just didn’t like how Fox handled himself the past 1.5 years. He’s not absent of blame for his actions.
Didn’t DDR say something about rethinking his future with Sac with Fox on the way out? Think he took it back after LaVine was the trade return.
That’s different, imo. He didn’t say his teammates weren’t good. He said a big reason he came was to play with Fox. When he got traded, the state of the team was unknown. Rebuild, re-tool, stay competitive, blow it all up.
Yup couldn’t agree more
I’m sure it never came up in discussions with the front office and leadership ????
It probably did, and should have stayed there.
Fox is right. The team’s win/loss record doesn’t lie. The Kings
weren’taren’t good enough and the front office didn’t doenoughanything to address it.Publicly saying the team lacks size and rim protection is quite different than saying your teammates aren’t good enough.
Fox earned his contract and played beyond it by any reasonable metric. Saying that the Kings “gave” him generational wealth smacks of the plantation, imho.
And the Kings were not Monk’s highest offer. Monk made the decision to stay. The Kings did not outbid the market.
Lmfao what a stretch that is
Everyone involved in this situation has dirty hands. FO, Vivek, Fox, Rich Paul.
Missteps along the way by each and every one of them. Can’t place sole blame on one single party.
The dysfunction won’t change until the one in charge is gone, and that ain’t happening.
I don’t like the way Fox left. I didn’t like the video of him saying he text Castle about how much he wanted to play with him and hopes that he wasn’t traded before the deal was ever made. I don’t like this social media spat happening.
I don’t like what the FO and Vivek have done or handled things either.
At some point, they all need to act like adults and just handle their business.
What exactly is the reason for being vague and preserving anonymity here?
Through the years, Rob has been excellent at pointing out how facile it is for commenters to address the alleged opinions and actions of unnamed people. I give him a rec whenever I see him do that. Why not identify (at least some of) those media members who have supposedly done Fox and fans such disservices?
I agree for many reasons.
Pull up the big boy pants and talk about what’s real.
He and Recee named their son Reign. That says something about commitment to team and city. Vivek did not earn that commitment; he squandered it.
I don’t give Fox one ounce of blame in yhis situation. If I were him I’d move heaven and earth to get out this organization. I don’t get how anyone could possibly blame Fox.
The Kings haven’t had competent ownership in my lifetime (I’m 40). Vivek is somehow worst of the bunch. At least the Maloofs actually hired a good GM and got out of the way for a few years. Vivek can’t even do that.
I actively want every single former coach, player or executive to trash this organization at every opportunity because they deserve it. And maybe one day, Vivek will be so embarrassed he’ll sell the team.
Hear, hear!!!
Well, but he also drove his value down through his agent, made himself pretty untradeable to anybody but the spurs, and forced their hand for this season… he could have waited till the offseason.
he turns it on when he wants and, from what I can see, took a bad situation and made it worse in the locker room. (That was said on KHTK this midday).
anyway, watched him all 8 years, wish he woulda went out better. I know the front office fumbled this, but he could have kept his side of the street cleaner, too.
anyway, light the beam, go Kings, etc etc..
I’ve said this a few times already but I’m going to keep repeating: it’s not Fox’s fault that Vivek decided to lock in on Lavine. As we saw in the last 24hrs any one of Hunter, BI, Butler, Kuzma, Collins, etc could have been targets in a multi team trade.
To be fair, none of those guys would have made any real difference except possibly Butler, who would not have fit with DDR, and would have blown up the team sooner or later. Ingram is always on the shelf and Kyle Kuzma is a net negative.
Not that getting LaVine is any better. Lateral move at best and he locks the team into mediocrity for the length of his deal.
They should have been looking for a Tyrese for Sabonis type deal for Fox, or worked to acquire better draft picks. They picked the dumbest path, which should surprise no one.
Sure I’ll concede that none of those options is an absolute game changer that vaults us into a top-6 team. But I’d prefer any of them to Lavine, except maybe Kuzma, or any one of Spurs’ young players. The overall point I am trying to make is that it’s not true that Fox painted us into a corner and we had no choice but to swallow Lavine and some meh picks. This is what they were literally saying on the broadcast after the trade that it was “the best deal possible”. So I will call BS on that.
A whole bunch of other teams managed to make swing for the fences trades without giving up a Fox-level player. Not that we should be swinging for the fences either but if the goal is to keep as competitive as possible there’s way better moves that were probably achievable.
edit: Hunter would have been real nice though. But maybe the least achievable? Crazy that Cle got him without giving up top 4 player. Insane starting 5.
100% agree.
i disagree fully.
Fox 100% painted this team into a corner and then shit in the corner on the way out.
you could argue the FO deserved it, but i’d still point out it was shitty thing to do.
Viwreck bought the team for $530m its now worth $3.7b, not bad for a dysfunctional organization. I think he’ll stick with same win-now formula, i.e. 1st or 2nd round exit forever. The rich gets richer.
There are also a lot of minority owners that have a stake in all of this. It’s not like Vivek is the sole owner of the team like Steve Ballmer or someone of that wealth.
Got lot’s of respect for Fox, overall would rate him as one of the most stand up Stars we’ve had during the post 2000s team. That being said, feel like a lot of this article is a bit rushed/premature.
A little early to say Devin Carter is a bust isn’t it? Dude had shoulder surgery and missed half the season. I don’t see 49ers fans calling Pearsall a bust after his mediocre first season. Devin shows flashes of promise, and there is someone named De’Aaron fox who when he was a rookie had ball handling issues and took him awhile to get a good mid range and 3 pt shot.
Same thing for Monte, I like what he did at the trade deadline. On paper, Levine should be a decent (no perfect replacement for someone as good as Fox). We also filled a big need at the big man position, and got a 3 and D wing who may develop into a rotational player. Also think Doug Christie is doing a good job as interim coach. He also got us out of a playoff drought.
I don’t blame Fox for being upset about ownership, however who is to say that is the reason he left? Who is also to say that he didn’t want to leave?
Fox was a great player on our team, but he wasn’t a leader IMO. He’s an amazing talent that will flourish just under the spotlight of Wemby. Our organization made key decisions assuming he’d step up into that leadership role, and he never did.
Way rushed and so palpably emotional that it doesn’t come off as a remotely competent piece, even if I do agree with plenty of it.
Incompetent franchise just continues to do the incompetent. the Fox situation is not some outlier over the past 12 years, it’s just another example of how the front office(s) cannot function in a normal way.
I don’t blame Fox one bit for this situation. He put in 7.5 seasons enduring multiple coaching and management changes to go along with subpar teammates and roster construction. If the eras and players were reversed we’d have experienced the same drama thing with Mitch Richmond. Thank god 90’s Kings didn’t have the social media 24 hour rumor mill. I often miss the newspaper boxscore and beat reporter recaps of yester year for that reason.
The NBA is drama and the Vivek regime play the villains. How long before Monte is fired, Sabonis is traded, Monk demands out, and Keegan is a filler in trade for an aging star?
The arena isn’t even all that nice anymore. Fuck the leg room.
Are you not entertained…sigh.
Yes, this all seems inevitable. I think Monte is gone sooner than later and they’ll flounder around for a couple years after that, and then the rest of it is inevitable.
Short of hitting another Tyrese Haliburton in the mid-first round, there is very little hope this team gets any better in over the next several years.
What’s the thinking behind Monte being fired? I mean, if Vivek is as involved as he seems to be, I think McNair is doing a pretty good job of doing his biddings.
I am honestly happy for fox. Missed out on All Star teams and all NBA teams playing for us. Plus a lot of you guys think sabonis is the best player lol
Two things can both be true. Vivek is the problem and he is to blame for all of the futility and distinction since he took over.
Fox is not a franchise player on a championship team. I’m not convinced he is the second best player on a championship team. I’m not sure how you compete for a championship if you are paying him max salary.
*distraction
**dysfunction
This is true, but it doesn’t excuse the handling of the situation by the FO. If you don’t believe Fox can lead you, then put those on the team who can, but by all means don’t fumble the situation time and time again like Vivek and co. have.
Totally agree.
Call it out man.
I loved Fox and I continue to love him to this day. At the same time, I’m not thrilled about how he hamstrung the team and forced them into having to make a trade with one team and one team only.
Vivek appears to be a bumbling idiot who can’t stop meddling affairs that should be the exclusive territory of the FO. It seems he backed Fox into a corner where he wanted to go elsewhere.
Vivek saved the team from going to Seattle and drastically transformed downtown Sacramento for the better.
————————————
All of those things are true for me simultaneously. And we all have a lot of strong emotions about the Fox situation right now. You guys at the Kings Herald have your opinions and I have mine. But you guys don’t get to tell me how to fan any more than I get to tell you.
I’m going to be a little salty about Fox’s departure. Will I root for him to be successful and on a personal level? Yes. Do I want to see him win a championship? At this moment, no. I want Sacramento to win one goddamn championship before I die.
This bullshit about acting like fans don’t appreciate Fox is just stupid. Most of the comments on this site have been about appreciating Fox’s contributions to the Kings. I’ll cheer him when he comes back through town just like most Kings fans will.
Chastising articles like this are just dumb, imo. Thanks for creating another 1,000 posts about one of the most boring fucking topics on this site – how much everyone hates Vivek. I am getting tired of having to scroll past the same posts repeatedly. It’s a waste of my fucking time. I’d rather read about basketball than that.
In fairness, I skimmed this article because it was pretty poorly written overall. After reading some of the comments, I re-read it a little closer and I understand that it wasn’t directed at fans.
Still the same sentiment remains. This was a clickbait article designed to generate a ton of comments about how the ownership is shit. I fucking KNOW it’s shit, okay? I read it in these comments dozens of times a day. Some people on this site only seem to ever post about how much they hate ownership – and they do it constantly. It’s tedious.
We dislike Vivek for the most basic reason. He treats us like we’re on a ‘need to know’ basis. If he tells Monte what to do, he should say so. If he refuses to pay the tax, he should say so. If he thinks Fox is great but not worth the max, he should say so. If he thinks this franchise is doing everything it can afford, and has a good explanation for it, then say so. Show some damn respect for us! I walked past the arena yesterday, and it is a great accomplishment and we still owe hm for that. But he owns us honesty. If 9th is our ceiling, and he’s cool with that as long as he doesn’t pay the tax, say so. If he thinks lanky defenders are for the birds, and The Old Chicago Wings are gonna put us in the Western Finals, then say so. Now that would create some good reading!
I can agree with all of that without wanting to read the same posts on the subject 1,000x.
The one thing I disagree with is the idea that he owes us anything. As a private business owner whose product is nothing more than entertainment, he doesn’t owe me or you a thing. He can run his business as poorly as he wants. It’s not like he’s a county commissioner or mayor.
To be clear, he should do some of those things. But it’s his prerogative not to. It’s also my (and your) prerogative to turn the TV off and not pay for games unless the product is worth the time and money.
You don’t have to read the comments here. People are entitled to their opinions on the ownership and to express those opinions. If you’re so tired of hearing it here maybe go elsewhere?
Yes, that’s an option.
Lemme know where I mentioned fans a single time or told them how they should feel – thanks!
I acknowledged that I made a mistake in my response to my own post.
Wasn’t the article directed toward Kings fans? It seems like the point was that you think Kings fans should not blame Fox for not wanting to re-sign here–they should instead blame the Kings incompetent ownership group and front office. No?
I guess you might say you were only telling fans what to think rather than feel–but you were definitely telling them something.
What you said, BuiltToSpill. I wanted to write something similar but could not do it as succinctly as you.
Fox, Monte, Vivek and the Trade
I don’t understand why multiple takes on a situation like this cannot all be true.
I don’t like Vivek and I do not believe he is good for the team. There is a lot of evidence to back this up (I’m not going to lay all that out now).
The FO has failed to improve the team and has squandered resources, limiting its ability to make moves. I do believe Vivek’s hard-on for Lavine also limited Monte’s ability to make a deal.
Both Vivek and the FO poisoned the relationship with Fox.
I understand how Fox could have gotten fed up and wanted out. No issues with that.
I do believe Fox and his agent hamstrung the Kings in trade talks.
In my mind, the texting between Fox and Spurs players is borderline tampering. I remember when people complained about Lebron meeting with Wade before deciding to go to Miami.
Some will say, “That’s the way the game is played.” And that is undeniably true.
It was a big FU to Vivek, Monte and company. That is undeniably true.
But, despite all Fox’s good will toward Sac, the city takes on the collateral damage of that FU. Trading Fox should have brought back more in assets. I think that is undeniably true.
(For the record, I didn’t think Fox was the guy and thought he should have been traded last summer. I also thought he was a decent fellow until all the shit about texting Spurs players and picking out a house in SA and ads dropping immediately after the trade. This is kind of a gut punch and tarnishes what I thought of the guy, but “that’s the way the game is played,” right?)
Plenty of blame to go around. I don’t understand why that idea is so heterodox.
The Orthodoxy
But then I do understand. There is so much orthodoxy on this site that raising some points of view rings the bells for the high priests to shame you down. “HOW DARE YOU SAY THAT!” they shout, while ending their screed with “imho.” Humble, my ass.
I appreciate disagreements. It’s all just points of view, right? Perspectives on something we have ABSOLUTELY NO CONTROL OVER.
I hold certain perspectives on various players, but I love it when someone makes an argument as to why a player I thought would fit perfectly on this team might not be what the team needs. John Collins is a great example. For every call for the Kings to get him, I read other takes here and on other websites that suggest he’s fool’s gold.
It makes me consider many sides. In the end I have to step back and recognize that I just don’t know for certain.
Argue away, debate and bring up facts and statistics, but PLEASE take off your priestly garments and quit shaming people. Quit shaming people. It is often said on this site, “Don’t tell me how to fan.” Disliking the behavior of a player is fandom. I think Fox undermined the team. I think he sucks for that. I think Vivek sucks a million times more, but I will never look back fondly on Fox after this. He made his own legacy. For fans, that’s the way the game is played. Dropping statistics won’t change that. Neither will your public shaming.
This looks like a new account, but only because I could not access my old account. I used to post occasionally, but don’t really have the desire to do so much anymore. I did want to sound off on the trade, so I opened this new one.
I genuinely appreciate the backing, KiD. We’re all fans of the same team. Some people hate Vivek, some appreciate what he’s done for the city, maybe there’s someone who really likes him, I don’t know. All opinions are welcome, imo.
The one thing I don’t really care for is the constant drumbeat of hatred for Vivek. Say it occasionally, that’s all good. But please, for the love of Nancy, stop beating me over the head with it. I’m in agreement already and I’m really more interested in what people have to say about the game of basketball. I’ve learned a lot from this site and really enjoyed following it closely from the Beam Team on (I used to check in infrequently before that).
But the luster is wearing off, and it’s only in part because the Kings org sucks. It’s also because, like many people here I have to hear complaints from my customers constantly, even though my company is really pretty awesome. I come to this site as a distraction and I am tired of reading about politics. I simply enjoy basketball. But when the talk is just a constant droning about ownership, it makes me question why I read it. I’d rather read Adamsite and RobHessing jabber on and on about possible trades and in-depth analyses of players’ defensive abilities.
I’m going to continue following the Kings probably no matter what, because I love basketball, Sacramento, and the endless unknown possibility of new young players. Does that mean I love Vivek? No. I don’t give a shit about him.
I said my peace. I’m not trying to be a dick, I just get bored with the same dumb comments is all.
Let’s make a deal! When Vivek stops making dumb moves I’ll stop making dumb comments about him!
I’d be delighted with that trade off! 🙂
lol
Haha, listen Henry, you make good posts pretty regularly. It’s really okay to hate on Vivek, I get it. Just be interesting with it! And I’ll take the trade off any day!
people change jobs all the time. the opportunity to play with Wemby is a valid reason to change teams.
He handled it like the dude in Half Baked.
F-you, F-you, you’re cool, F-you, I’m out.
I might have to see that movie.
break ups are difficult. we got dumped. time to move on, call up some ex’s, create a profile on a dating site, get drunk with friends.
Oh dude, Half Baked is hilarious! You gotta check it.
We, the fans, deserve better.
Thing is, the fans feel these potshots way more than the intended target, and that’s my problem with this junior high approach.
Great point.
Still love Fox as a player and still wearin’ his shoes. I want him to do well over there in SA, with my other favorite (currently non-Kings) player HB.
I do think that one thing sucks though about this trade – and it’s not really a huge deal, since it’s, at the end of the day, just someone’s opinion, but I was looking at ‘trade grades’ on Bleacher Report and, of course, the Fox trade was a big fat D for Sac. (Ironic, isn’t it, since D is what kinda changed in this trade.) I agree that in a vacuum, the trade was a D, but if you factor in the ‘Fox was going to not be a King for much longer’ part of the story, it was a better trade than a D. The Kings needed to get value for Fox, and in that sense, we didn’t do horrible, as it landed us LaVine, JV, and (I think?) some trade material in the LaRavia trade. If looked at in that light, and with the narrative that Fox had to go somewhere, I don’t think it’s nearly as bad as that D BR gave us.
not “somewhere”. To the Spurs with Wemby. He named the place where he wanted to go, and no other place. that limited potential trade partners. It also tends to support the theory that this move was more about partnering with Wemby than getting away from the Kings. there’s no malice in that. it’s logical. he’s an opportunistic scorer after all.
Sure it’s nice to think about Vivek selling the team (because he truly does suck as an owner), but I honestly believe whoever bought the team would have their eye on Seattle, Las Vegas, Nashville, etc… I really don’t believe the NBA has much love for the Sacramento area, and would be happy to approve a relocation to a more “desirable” market.
The shit part is we probably could have gotten Zach LaVine without even trading Fox. All the Bulls wanted was a contract dump plus their pick back. Trading off Fox was a complete cop out to say that we got something in return for Fox.
another guard?
no thanks.
More like offer a better package than Zach Collins or whatever it was for Zach and then flip Fox for draft assets/Sochan or something. It’s not like Monte didn’t know the Bulls were going to pull that trade. He was literally on the phone with them discussing it. If I was the GM, I would have pulled the Bulls to the side, offered them something better and gotten a better return for Fox than a salary dump. What Monte did was pay the price of a Corvette for a used car.
Monte traded Kevin H for Zack. thats basically what happened.
Fox got us all the draft picks.
I preface this with 2 things.
1 I love Fox and wish he’d have stayed a King for life ( in a role better suited for him)
2 I never believed fox was going to be the answer for this Team.
With that out of the way, my BIGGEST issue with Fox is the way he’s treated leaving.
He has been checked out for the better part of 2 months. It also seems based on his teamates statements, he hadn’t ever really communicated with them prior to his leaving. He DID request a trade, theres almost no doubt about that given what we know of the timeline of him leaving.
signing with Klutch, not signing his extension while giving lame platitudes to the fans about wanting to retire a King. but the most damning is after he left. Hearing he talked to spurs players prior to be traded, even cutting commercials already..
all that to be said, its just GROSS.
I know he’s happy to be with the Spurs. It’s where he wanted to be, clearly. I think he snaked his way out and used a piss poor front office to cover his tracks. This entire thing stinks to high hell and im tired of it.
Haven’t seen it reported much but SI said we traded for Jack LaRavia from Memphis and I see him listed on our roster on ESPN.
I wanted to draft Monk… Fox got us Monk?
This graphic was just shown on the Kings broadcast. The pettiness is just sad at this point.
Yeah, that was pretty blatant and Kayte and Kyle didn’t even address it.
The narrative that Fox somehow did the city and organization a favor by staying for 8 years is BS. He was given a rookie max extension to stay, even when everyone outside of Sacramento thought it was a huge overpay. As soon as he was given the bag he started to mail it in. He no longer slashed to the basket and finish through contact because he didn’t want to get hurt. He started nonchalantly trotting up the court and went away from his one elite quality. Then when he decided he was done, he made sure the kings couldn’t get equal value for him by demanding a trade only to San Antonio. Lost a lot of respect for him the way he handled the whole situation.
Vivek has definitely struggled and so has Monte but there’s no need to crucify these people in the landscape of pro sports. Fox is okay, he has shown his true colors at the end here that he’s not all class either. The Kings will continue to try and may someday figure it out, Vivek wants the Kings to do well just like the rest of us. The situation of Sac in the NBA has been playing out long before Vivek or Monte, just like Charlotte and other markets where it’s tough to build a winner and there are no championship banners. Being a Kings fan is tough, player also, the organization has not achieved a lot. But I’m not going to do the whole good guy, bad guy, finger pointing stuff for an entertainment business. It’s not that serious.
Id agree that Vivek wants the Kings to do well. He also seems to need to be seen as the main reason for any success. If he would hire the best people and let them do their jobs the organization would be much better off, but I don’t know that he’s capable of doing that.
After spending 8 years trying to build a team around Fox as their centerpiece he decided to walk out and be someone else’s role player. Albeit he still wants the expensive contract. Three seasons with a competent cast and produced a fringe playoff team, he was never going to deliver.
Yes can blame the Kings but reading the comments the remedy is all wrong. It’s the opposite, he was coddled way to much. Lesson is they need to be much shrewder. He wasn’t worth wasting all those years and all those roster moves they made in favor of him.
Really appreciate that you wrote this.
Sadly breakups like this are never easy or clean. The same with the decisions behind it, there are going to be hurt feelings as well fans will fan and that’s understandable
People process things differently, I think Fox is not a rah rah say the right things kind of guy, I really appreciated what he said and think his record/reputation while he was here would speak to his sincerity
I hope he does well and has success in San Antonio, I also can’t wait for some of the hacks in the national media to then completely change there mind and realize that Fox is this great talent, when they have been sh!tting on him forever. Its like the all star voting, when the Kings exploded to 3rd, the Kings won’t get picked as well its to soon and other guys records justify being picked. This year well lets reward the Rockets for their record
He asked for the roster to improve, before he would sign an extention. Lord knows why they could not or would not, and he pushed his way out. I don’t doubt that’s a messy situation but other teams and players have done the same thing and been less gracious about it. See Draymond Greene. Lebron James et al
Sac media is funny as you can see the spin. I get it to win in the league you need elite Talent, Fox was the closest we got to that, and while Levine is a relative replacement for points and position, its locked the teams future for the forseeable future.
That fans don’t grasp what agents do and get upset is bemusing to me, they act on behalf of their clients, its not ironic that Fox a Klutch client left as he wanted to play in a better situtation and is replaced by another Lavine who also wanted to leave his old situation isn’t seen by fans. Yeh thats all Fox’s doing
I was amused watching James Ham discussing whose to blame with his colleagues on 1320 the other day, Ham I suspect was saying what a sh!t show this was, and the other guys were blaming Fox
Gonna add my take even here. I usually lurk here when things get tough for the franchise and even in the past would go through Sactown Royalty before the buy out or whatever occurred. I never made an account until now.
I agree that the treatment he has been getting from the loudest fans mostly X, that the hate he is receiving is unwarranted. I am not a Fox guy myself but it has gotten out of hand. I also agree that primarily, the front office deserves the blame. Even if those disagree, the organization drafted him in the first place. That can be seen as a mistake.
That being all said, I am not going to put Fox on par with the likes of other Sacramento Era Kings legends. Not even DeMarcus Cousins. Now that I can assess his tenure as being a King even aside from the sheer incompetence of the front office since Geoff Petrie has left, what exactly has Fox done? Quite honestly, when you look at plus minus, the constant blown assignments, the possibility he may have been a mouth piece to want Bagley, his lack of caring as evident by Mike Brown’s final coached game and even 2022 around the time Hali was traded, I really cannot stand his aura.
I was hoping he can gain something out of this. DeMarcus Cousins, despite his antics in some way gave us something. It was actually for the most part, more enjoyable in my opinion. The Fox era is just mishaps of falling short, wasted seasons, and so much disappointment. Compared to Theus, Mitch RIchmond, DeMarcus, those guys had far worse circumstances and yet impacted the franchise far more. Theus was a reason for many to care about the team with his flashy passes. Mitch Richmond, managed to give the team some level of respect within the league. A lot of his teams sucked but they tried. Same with Cousins’ teams. Cousins was very problematic but you cannot deny that he cared. I bring these 3 other players because they all had similarities regarding incompetence within the organization and still produced far more than Fox. That playoff drought was mostly Monk and Sabonis doing the heavy lifting.
I cannot say the same with Fox. Countless times, I have seen him abandoning defensive assignments. Going full Buddy Hield since last year from 3, and now kinda pulling a Buddy again with the Spurs. That 60 point game of his, especially the post game, really rubbed me the wrong way. I am glad, he is gone.
What really irritates me is, I wanted Monk in that draft class. He is already a more enjoyable player and is an actual point guard with playmaking. Another thing I really cannot stand is Monte’s decision to extend him during 2020 when they drafted Hali that same year. Fox was arguably at peak value. Despite that horrible contract, Monte could have traded him in 2021 off season but he didn’t.
That Hali trade is looking terrible now. I didn’t even have Hali as the guy I wanted drafted that year. Maxey, is proving to be the better player. Year after that, I wanted Sengun but they drafted Davion. Now, I love Davion and truly believed that if Mike Brown put him on Curry, they would have gotten past the second round. Still, he got traded for literally nothing. They drafted Murray, I wanted Ivey. Ivey is arguably looking like the better pick. The KIngs could have traded up to draft Edey, but instead they drafted yet ANOTHER GUARD!
It is honestly messed up how bad Monte has been. I do not watch college ball. I don’t dive deep into scouting. As I type this, I came upon the realization that if I were GM instead wasting years in the Army I would have assembled this:
Fire Luke Walton.
Hire Kenny Atkinson for the simple fact he did the impossible rebuild of the Nets (and that year I was watching the Nets mostly because that Luka passing was middle finger material).
Draft Maxey.
Trade Fox for 4 firsts. He was at peak value at the time. Do not max him.
Draft Sengun.
Draft Ivey.
Draft Edey by trading up.
These were all decisions I demanded and the Kings did not do any of that. A joke.
TL,DR: Sorry for wall of text. My point is, I do agree with you overall. Monte and Vivek are at fault primarily because Fox should have been traded long ago.
However there is a silver lining to this and one thing I will add. The Fox trade is the first trade in the Sacramento era and maybe for the entire history of the franchise, that they got 2 first round picks in a trade. 2027 could work out if Fox continues his bad habits with Spurs. The real asset from the trade is that 2031 1st round pick. As it stands, that is by far the most valuable asset on the team. Hopefully a real GM gets hired in the summer, rebuilds the same way as the Thunder and Rockets did. If playoffs do not happen and I say this as a LaVine stan, just blow it up. What is sad is that even with ending the playoff drought nearly 2 years ago, I knew deep down the Rockets and Thunder had a far better future and upside. Their GMs knows how to accumulate assets, be flexible with assets, and recognizing the pieces you need to win in the NBA. You do not win with these terrible, bloated contracts. Just look at the stars of the league and the deadline. The new CBA makes it more apparent.
Death, taxes, and basketball Hell in Sacramento are guaranteed in this world.
This entire organization, especially Vivek and Monte, is a joke.
Most players of Fox’s quality would have demanded out sooner and more publicly.
If your spouse is mentally ill, it’s ok to leave if they are unwilling or unable to change.
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