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Joe Dumars isn’t a candidate for Kings GM role, per Sam Amick

The Athletic's Sam Amick shared clarifying information on Dumars' role in the GM search and his future with the team.

There's been a sense of deja vu among Kings fans since Vlade Divac resigned and Joe Dumars stepped in as interim General Manager. It seemed a case of history repeating itself as a Hall of Fame player became an advisor to Vivek Ranadivé, earned Vivek's trust, and then Vivek attempted to install the advisor above the existing GM. It was the same way Vlade got the GM role to begin with. So despite the team's statements that the Kings would do an extensive search, there was cause for concern that it would all be a song a dance that led to Dumars selecting himself as General Manager.

But according to The Athletic's Sam Amick, this won't be the case. Amick reports that the new GM will report to Vivek, not to Dumars, and that while Dumars is likely to be involved in the search process, including conducting interviews with Vivek, Dumars has "no interest in being the long-term head of basketball operations, and will not be a candidate in the search".

That said, Amick also reports that there is no timeline for the search. Dumars and Ken Catanella could remain in charge through the draft and free agency, both of which are currently scheduled for mid-October. This is both encouraging, as the process shouldn't be rushed, and concerning because that would mean Dumars making decisions with very little support staff. Catanella is a cap and contracts guru, not a scout or player evaluator.

Amick also notes the candidacy of former Kings assistant GM Scott Perry:

Yet while the list of likely candidates is long and sure to get longer with the involvement of Forde, sources say there has been a swell of support — both internally among some of the team’s minority owners and externally — for former Kings vice president of basketball operations and current New York Knicks general manager Scott Perry. It remains to be seen if that will help Perry or hurt him when it comes to Ranadive’s view, as the owner who headed the group that bought the team in 2013 has a tendency to be a contrarian upon occasion. But Ranadive and Perry, sources say, are known to be on very good terms and have kept in touch since their time together came to an abrupt end nearly three years ago.

This is concerning for several reasons. First, the continuing bickering among differing ownership factions is never welcome news. Second, this again raises the concerns about whether this search will be anything more than a song and dance. Perry is on good terms with Ranadivé, Perry worked for Joe Dumars in Detroit, and worked alongside Ken Catanella. With so many connections to the decision-makers in this process, one has to wonder if the process will be more than a farce.

The one hope is that the process is truly being led by Mike Forde of Sportology. Shams Charania and Amick reported yesterday that the Kings would be bringing in Forde to lead the search.

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Christopher Hauck
2 months ago

I have to say, I am feeling cautiously optimistic about the Kings’ search. We seem to be taking all of the right steps and at most it looks like Dumars’ will stay as a West-like consultant, which I think is a good role for him.

But we are using an outside search firm. We are linked to top names.

And I know some of Kings’ Twitter is iffy on Perry, while I have had some questions about Perry in the past and he might not be my first choice is I was picking a name from my living room – he’s been on the “next hot GM” lists before and has some very clear, definable skills that are valuable if he can surround himself with the right assistants.

If Perry is our “worst case” scenario – that’s a strong position to be in. Whether or not this pick works out, it does look like we are at least going to hire someone qualified for the position and let them run the FO instead of continuing to give power to a rotating batch of under-qualified advisors (i.e., Vlade and Williams).

Is it weird that as a Kings fan, I have almost forgotten how to post and discussing Kings’ basketball when I am hopeful?

Adam Dieter
2 months ago
Reply to  SPTSJUNKIE

My issue with Perry is that he signed 3 PFs in Julius Randle, Taj Gibson, and Bobby Portis in the very same offseason, but he did draft Mitchell Robinson in the second round. The fact remains, however, I’m not sure the Knicks are any better today than when he took over as GM 3 years ago.

Parker Wells
2 months ago
Reply to  Adamsite

and the bigger issue with that is he signed those PFs, who are taking the minutes Mitchell Robinson needs to blossom.

Doug Scott
2 months ago
Reply to  Adamsite

I think it’s tough for anyone to succeed in NY right now, no matter who it is.

Perry is far from my first choice, but I don’t hold NY against him.

Eric W
2 months ago
Reply to  Dougscott

Dolan surely sucks. But I think we have assume people are responsible for the duties of their position.

K W
2 months ago

In most cases, I’d agree. But then again, we know all too well what a meddling, over-involved owner can do. A good GM can be set up for failure if the person above them (the owner) vetoes their decisions and tries to steer the ship themselves. Stauskas? (Not that Pete D was anything other than trash, but you see the point.)

Last edited 2 months ago by AmateurNerd
Eric W
2 months ago
Reply to  AmateurNerd

Sure, but since all we can do is speculate, any opinions about Perry’s capability we build on that will be nothing but a guess.

Doug Scott
2 months ago

Was Perry the sole decision maker? I seem to remember there being another guy with him, but cant remember his name

Maxwell Huss
2 months ago

And our owner sucks too. So we need to find a GM that can deal with a sucky owner and not suck right alongside him.

Jeromy Simonoff
2 months ago
Reply to  Dougscott

I believe its going to be tough for anyone to succeed in SAC right now, no matter who it is.

Doug Scott
2 months ago
Reply to  Sacto_J

True

K W
2 months ago
Reply to  Adamsite

This concerns me, too. His reputation seems outsized compared to his performance as a GM. But it is New York, the one team with an owner who is unquestionably worse at owner-ing than Vivek.

Whoever they hire, it better not be the only hire. The FO needs to be bigger, with more talent and depth across the board. It’s been a skeleton crew for years, with predictable results. The Kings FO could have worked out of Divacs’ garage for the past few seasons. That needs to change.

Christopher Hauck
2 months ago
Reply to  Adamsite

I think that is 100% a fair criticism. However, it is worth noting that Mills is the VP in NY and it’s unclear what the division is between Dolar-Mills-Perry.

I am not trying to excuse him or exonerate him. Just saying that there is at least a reason to believe that Perry – who is very well connected and who seems good at relationships / ops – could bring in an Assistant who is an A+ scout / personnel expert and another who is a capologist.

Worth noting that after Mills was fired, when Perry was made interim VP – his first (and only) move was trading Marcus Morris to the Clippers for Harkless, 2 first round picks, a 2nd round pick, and an overseas draft stash as part of a 3 team trade. That’s an A+ trade to me.

Basically, I am not here advocating for him. More just saying that if we do a complete interview process and he gets the job – that’s not a hopeless or bad outcome per se.

Adam Dieter
2 months ago
Reply to  SPTSJUNKIE

I totally forgot about that trade. That was solid.

Wait, does that mean the Knicks signed 4 PF’s last summer? Gibson, Randle, Portis AND Morris?

Christopher Hauck
2 months ago
Reply to  Adamsite

Yes. Some people believe you can never have too many mediocre PFs 🙂

Eric W
2 months ago
Reply to  SPTSJUNKIE

Yeah, that was a nice trade. Though I think it was one 1st round pick and swap rights. I like Sanon too. He isn’t likely to be great, but he’s an interesting guy to have right to.

Christopher Hauck
2 months ago

Ah – just double checked and you are right – one is a swap.

Maxwell Huss
2 months ago
Reply to  SPTSJUNKIE

I believe Perry was also in Orlando (as an assistant) for the Ibaka trade in which they gave up Oladipo AND Sabonis.

So he’s been a part of three front offices in a row that made highly questionable (even disastrous) decisions. Plus 4 years in his second stint with Detroit in 2008 to 2012 with Dumars in which that franchise further imploded.

Some nice moves sprinkled in there, but the overall body of work is not good. (Kinda like Vlade).

Much prefer the resume of Hinkie, in which he tore down a mediocre Philly team and rebuilt them to a legitimate contender… or any of the up and comers who are waiting in the wings with highly successful organizations.

Christopher Hauck
2 months ago
Reply to  AirmaxPG

All very fair. I think there’s a good case to be made for other candidates.

I just think he’s a legitimate and qualified candidate. But with the caveat that he needs to surround himself with the right assistants.

But he is very well connected and has great relationships with agents, which is at least a definable value-prop if he surrounded himself with AGMs who were strong at talent evaluation and cap management.

Maxwell Huss
2 months ago
Reply to  SPTSJUNKIE

All big “ifs” for me. Another red flag would be the fact that the Knicks appear to be open to him leaving after only 3 years there.

He hasn’t turned any of those connections or relationships into on-court success.

He’d be at the very bottom of my list, maybe slightly ahead of Dumars.

I mean if there were one organization that rivals the dysfunction of the Kings… it would be the Knicks. And Perry really hasn’t done much to change that. So it would seem completely ridiculous if we hired a cast-off from our rival in dysfunction when there are 28 other organizations with much better track records to hire from.

We’ll see what happens. But I’m not optimistic if Perry is the hire. I think he’s a known quantity. And what we know is that he ain’t that good.

Jerry Reynolds
2 months ago
Reply to  AirmaxPG

15 wins a year for five years and fired by the league so the team could begin to actually compete is not much of a resume and why he will never be hired again ! Hinkie the Dinkie is the answer to no question !

Tim Go
2 months ago
Reply to  SPTSJUNKIE

Perry in my opinion is a clear upgrade to Vlade. But how much of an upgrade is he? Frankly, I don’t think he’s suited as a GM. More of a Assistant GM like Shareef would work best for him.

Eric W
2 months ago
Reply to  Timmy_13

Oh, he’s absolutely a clear upgrade on Vlade. Of course, so is setting the draft to autopick and throwing any cap space directly down the drain (I mean, at least that’s only a one year commitment).

Tim Go
2 months ago

Exactly this. It’s like someone asking for a chicken sandwich and you buy them a shit sandwich. But then you look back and thought damn, this chicken sandwich is shit. So you buy an actual chicken sandwich but instead of getting one of the best, you say eh, it’s still chicken so you buy the cheapest from the store. That’s how I feel.

Last edited 2 months ago by Timmy_13
andy sims
2 months ago
Reply to  Timmy_13

I’ve decided not to have lunch with you, today or ever.

Maxwell Huss
2 months ago

Yeah I really wish we as fans would stop using our previous horrific decisions to justify potentially “less bad” decisions. It’s the way we got Vlade in the first place. “Hey, he’s better than Pete.”

Really all I think anyone wants is an honest thorough search, and for that search to result in hiring the best candidate. And the best candidate should be left alone to work.

Parker Wells
2 months ago

With this news, I’m wondering what Dumars is even doing here now if Forde is leading the search for a GM and President of BBall Ops. I kind of assumed Joe would settle into the President role and hire a GM, then the both of them hire a couple Assistant GMs to round out a properly staffed front office (for once!).

Maybe Vivek finally doesn’t trust himself to make this decision?

I don’t like the idea of Perry coming back. He would probably be fine as a GM, but it shows absolutely zero initiative from Vivek to hire the first name to come across his desk. Forde will hopefully throw some new names for him to consider, a couple guys from playoff teams who know how a successful franchise is supposed to be run.

Eric W
2 months ago
Reply to  Wonderchild

It’s always hard to judge, but I’m not impressed by the FO performance of Perry’s last 3 stops. His work for the Knicks so far has been pretty nonsensical. A lot like the decisions made while he was in ORL actually.

Rory Cornell
2 months ago
Reply to  Wonderchild

I think part of the problem is the the way recent press release was written:

“My role as interim Executive Vice President of Basketball Operations is to immediately assume General Manager duties during this transition period and assist Vivek in developing a long-term strategy for the basketball operations department,” Dumars said in a written statement provided to The Bee. “As part of that process, I will support a thorough national search for a permanent General Manager over the coming months. The search will be run by an outside firm and Vivek will have the final decision making authority.”

If Dumars is technically the interim EVP of Basketball operations, then that implies there’s a position above GM in the bball ops hierarchy. I know the role of the GM differs from one team to another, but in this instance who can blame perspective GM candidates for being confused? They’re hiring for one position (GM), but what about the position that seems higher up on the totem pole that’s only being filled currently on an interim basis? Is that just a temporary position that will be eliminated once the GM position is filled? If so, why not just say Dumars is the interim GM only? Less than a week ago Vivek literally told Vlade he would have to give up final decision making authority to the EVP of Bball Ops if he wanted to keep his GM job moving forward.

On the other hand, I assume this Forde guy will be able to provide actual clarity regarding the job description to the candidates for the position. I think we’ll have a better idea of the power this new person will wield when we find out the types of candidates who are actually willing to sit down for an interview.

Christopher Hauck
2 months ago
Reply to  RORDOG

Bingo. And as someone who briefly worked as an Executive Recruiter (starting in September of 2008 – what a great to time get into that business out of school) – I think you are spot on about the role.

Forde is not running the search. The search firm is connected to and can quietly gauge the interest and concerns of candidates – instead of having a messy public process. It can also be easier for Forde to get concerns from a variety of candidates and let the team know so they can clarify and negotiate.

As in, Webster or Simon might be wary about interviewing due to the role Dumars would be playing. They might not call Vivek and say that and they may not want their name attached to that statement – but if Forde hears that from 2-3 candidates, he can tell Vivek is is a roadblock. In fact, it’s entirely possible that today’s clarification via Amick on Dumars’ role was a direct result of feedback from Forde.

That said, he is not running the process, that is still Vivek and Vivek will still be making the decision (which I assume you know, but there does seem to be some confusion about Sportsology’s role among some people).

Parker Wells
2 months ago
Reply to  SPTSJUNKIE

If this is what Forde is doing in the hiring process, I like it. It’s sort of like a mediator between Vivek and the candidates. Forde has enough respect in the industry to tell Vivek what he needs to clean up, and has connections to the top candidates to get them interviews.

Rory Cornell
2 months ago
Reply to  SPTSJUNKIE

I wonder as well though if Dumars is at least being kept around in the event none of the top guys are ultimately interested in the position. I could see a scenario in which they go to plan B and hire a guy/gal Dumars can groom to take over once he or she is ready to be the person with final decision making authority.

I only say this because the timeline is a little confusing. One would assume the Zarrens, Websters and Simons of the world would probably want their new FO up and running in advance of the draft/FA. The fact that they’ve already gone on record that the process will be thorough and could take months indicates to me they may have several tiers of candidates based on their ability to take on complete control on day 1.

Parker Wells
2 months ago
Reply to  RORDOG

I interpret the “this could take months” comment as a reassurance there won’t be a knee-jerk hire, which has been the case with pretty much every GM and coach in the Vivek era.

Last edited 2 months ago by Wonderchild
Adam Dieter
2 months ago
Reply to  Wonderchild

I hope it’s done sooner rather than later. I’d assume any GM with his weight would want a say in this year’s draft and free agency. Who’d want to take over a team after those choices have already been made?

Parker Wells
2 months ago
Reply to  Adamsite

I agree. I’m just not putting much stock in their theoretical timetable. I’d assume a decision is made by then. I mean there’s only 3 days between Game 7 of the Finals and the draft. It would be a bad idea to wait to interview an executive just because they’re on a playoff team.

Eric W
2 months ago
Reply to  Wonderchild

I feel like that generally doesn’t happen that way anyway. I feel like execs from successful teams are constantly interviewing for positions while their team is still playing.

Adam Dieter
2 months ago

I’d also feel that any exec from a successful team is already knee deep in scouting for the draft, especially with it being so soon. What else are playoff GM’s doing right now? Hire a GM candidate that has already been well informed by his current scouting crew, because he won’t have one once he gets here.

Eric W
2 months ago
Reply to  Adamsite

Yeah, they’d obviously have to adjust for the Kings personnel, needs and context, but they’d already be out to date on the prospects and league scuttlebutt.

Eric W
2 months ago

Oops. * Up-to-date. Not out-to-date.

K W
2 months ago
Reply to  Wonderchild

They’d better make a decision by then. How stupid to let Dumars make the pick when he’s not even going to be around for long afterward. The other teams will have zero incentive to deal fairly with him on draft day or immediately before/after. Kangz.

Christopher Hauck
2 months ago
Reply to  Wonderchild

Agree – I agree with everything RORDOG said and is considering. But my potentially Pollyanna interpretation here is that they are going to take the time to get the hire right and if they don’t get their first choice, they are not going to rush into a bad hire.

I assume (or hope) that if someone like Webster or Zarren was interested and the interview went well – they could wrap this up in a couple of weeks.

Given they and some of the other top candidates are still in the playoffs and might not be considering opportunities yet maybe another reason why Vivek did not want to commit to an accelerated timeline with a guaranteed fast hire.

Doug Scott
2 months ago
Reply to  SPTSJUNKIE

Great insight

K W
2 months ago
Reply to  Wonderchild

on CD’s radio show this morning, both CD and Amick talked about how strange and Kangzy Vlade’s resignation was. Vivek apparently wanted Dumars to assume a prime decision-making role. Vlade left b/c he interpreted this (correctly) as a way to push him out the door. But now that Vlade is gone, the word is that Dumars is not going to be in a prime decision-making role after all. Why not? If Vivek wanted Dumars to be “the man,” why would it matter if Vlade was here or not? This whole thing stinks of KANGZ. Vivek clearly used Dumars to get Vlade to quit so he wouldn’t have to fire him directly. Office politics at its absolute shittiest. Vivek is still a conniving, meddling little “chap,” and we are still the joke of the league.

Eric W
2 months ago
Reply to  AmateurNerd

I assume Dumars has no interest in doing the day-to-day hard work of a GM. He was brought in to be a Jerry West-style consultant. Basically, just hang out in the owners suite and give opinions on moves the FO is considering.

K W
2 months ago

But if that were really the case, it wouldn’t have made sense for Vlade to peace out. It really does seem like Dumars was presented to Vlade the same way Vlade was presented to Pete D a few years back: “This is Joe, he’s going to be ‘helping us out’ by doing a lot of the things you are officially supposed to be doing.”

Richie J
2 months ago
Reply to  AmateurNerd

Lying to Vlade to get him to resign isn’t ideal, but he was so awful as GM that I’m not going to complain if that’s what happened.

Parker Wells
2 months ago
Reply to  AmateurNerd

Or Dumars realized late what he was being used for and wants nothing of it.

John Parker
2 months ago
Reply to  Wonderchild

Funny, I don’t trust Vivek either.

Rik Smits
2 months ago

Whatever. I know that people put much stock in having the right process and I can see the value in that. But ultimately I just want them to pick the right guy, whoever that is.
(Hint, it isn’t Perry).

Eric W
2 months ago
Reply to  RikSmits

Theoretically, you’re WAY more likely to end up with the right person if you have a good process.

Rik Smits
2 months ago

Depends on how good the theory is and by which process that theory came about.

Eric W
2 months ago
Reply to  RikSmits

That’s why I said “a good process.” Otherwise you’re just counting on getting lucky.

Rik Smits
2 months ago

Warning; old man’s rant.

I think one of the many things wrong in today’s world is how we moved away from people and accountability, to vague and anonymous things like “processes” and “systems”.

In today’s world, I have a problem and I talk to people (which is not easy to begin with), almost nobody takes responsibility. Most people are leaning on and/or hiding behind the processes and the system, not showing any initiative, not taking any responsibility.
Sorry, I can’t change that for you; that’s the system.” or “We have done everything according to the protocols. I can’t deviate from that.

Things like customer support lose their meaning; people are more concerned with sticking to the protocol than actually helping customers.

A process is a helping aid, it is a tool. It should support, augment the decision-making by actual people, who should feel (and be held) accountable for these decision. It should never replace the decision-making by actual people, nor curb or pigeonhole it.

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Last edited 2 months ago by RikSmits
Eric W
2 months ago
Reply to  RikSmits

I mean, yeah. As with anything, if applied poorly they don’t work.

andy sims
2 months ago
Reply to  RikSmits

*cough*

Rik Smits
2 months ago
Reply to  andy_sims

Process for shouting at cloud:

  1. Check birth certificate.
  2. Pick a cloud. Any cloud. But once you picked one, stick with it.
  3. Drink some water.
  4. Have at it.
  5. If the cloud complains, say that you followed the proper process.
  6. Profit?
Last edited 2 months ago by RikSmits
Tim Go
2 months ago
Reply to  RikSmits

Depends. Do you drink water one handed or two handed?

Rik Smits
2 months ago
Reply to  Timmy_13

Two handed. But the pace is excellent.

K W
2 months ago
Reply to  RikSmits

I agree. To push back just a bit, though, a good process is one that puts people in a position to help others and do their job effectively. What you are describing are bad processes, not just “processes.” This isn’t a question of processes vs. people, it’s a question of good processes (which put good people in position to achieve good results) vs. bad processes (which lead to consistently bad results, even if good people are involved). The Kings have used bad processes for years. Instituting good processes will allow the team to be successful even as individuals, good and bad, come and go over time.

Rik Smits
2 months ago
Reply to  AmateurNerd

I agree somewhat, but I am gonna push back harder.

It’s not about whether it is a good or bad process, it is that people hide behind a process. That happens with initially good processes as well. They may look good on paper, but it is ultimately up to the execution, which is usually done by people.

T I
2 months ago
Reply to  RikSmits

But hiding behind a process is bad process!
comment image

T I
2 months ago
Reply to  RikSmits

Sorry, I can’t change that for you; that’s the system.” or “We have done everything according to the protocols. I can’t deviate from that.

This is poor process Rik, simply. As is, nobody taking responsibility for a problem – since good process would include having no fear of taking responsibility and fixing a problem.

Last edited 2 months ago by Otis
Adam Granger
2 months ago
Reply to  RikSmits

That actually depends on your goals. If your goal is to create a process where if followed exactly will generate a very quantifiable goal like minimizing expenses or creating profit, the system, or process, or algorithm will likely be able to achieve that more efficiently.

If your goal is customer satisfaction, then human decision making, which can account for other less quantifiable outside-the-box variables better than the process can, could very well yield a better result.

Most of society, as you correctly point out is heading toward the first goal, because quantity of money has been viewed as the best determinant of value. But it comes at the expense of personal satisfaction, because money is a very flawed measure of value and those flaws are not being addressed.

Maxwell Huss
2 months ago

Yeah, no thanks on Perry. We were talking about this yesterday, but he was here when we signed Z-bo and Hill. Fox fell into his lap (and to his credit he drafted him), but then we traded back to get JJ and Giles with Mitchell on the board.

And in New York, no big free agent signings despite huge amounts of cap space. Traded Porzingis, and likely will end up with only a couple later first round picks.

I mean, yeah pretty much anyone will be better than Vlade. But why are people within the Kings organization already clamoring for a guy because they know him… when there could be several really sought-after candidates who might want this job (if given full autonomy)?

It’s like they just can’t get out of their own way. Do the search, pick the best candidate, and let them do their damn job.

Parker Wells
2 months ago
Reply to  AirmaxPG

I don’t think any big name free agents will sign for the Knicks as long as Dolan owns the team. If Perry wants to leave “his dream job” as he put it when he left the Kings, he knows that now.

Eric W
2 months ago
Reply to  Wonderchild

I don’t think it has anything to do with Nolan. If they were winning they’d have no trouble signing FAs. Now, I guess you can argue they may not be winning because of Nolan.

Maxwell Huss
2 months ago
Reply to  Wonderchild

Which doesn’t bode well for his ability to sign anyone here. Not that anyone could sign big free agents here… but that’s supposed to be a strength of Perry. Which doesn’t make him a good fit in Sac.

Parker Wells
2 months ago
Reply to  AirmaxPG

True. I’m also not intrigued by his PF spending spree last offseason.

Eric W
2 months ago
Reply to  Wonderchild

Off the top of my head, the only thing in the pro column from his time in NY is drafting Robinson.

Eric W
2 months ago
Reply to  AirmaxPG

I just want the next GM to know that, and not rely on Free Agency to acquire impact talent.

Rory Cornell
2 months ago
Reply to  AirmaxPG

In a perfect world Perry could utilize his connections to land rookies/FAs that fit the needs of the team based off the recommendations of a top notch scouting and analytics department. Based of Amick’s interview with CD, it doesn’t sound like the Kings are willing to have a blank check approach of assembling a Front Office A Team like what Forde seemed to help facilitate in LA.

K W
2 months ago
Reply to  RORDOG

I’m much more concerned about the apparent unwillingness to fully/properly staff the FO than I am about hiring Perry to lead the FO.

Kevin Lam
2 months ago

Heh, imagine hiring an outside firm and having many people interested in the job, only to go backwards and hire Perry because of “good relationships.” How has that worked for this team in the past?

Kevin Salvadori
2 months ago

1. I have no problem with Dumars helping lead our search, and interviewing candidates.

2. I have several problems with his role being undefined, but have a theory on this.

3. I think it is a good sign that top candidates are interested, and that we have a reputable recruitment company assisting.

4. I don’t think we’ll get clarity before late August, if not early September. This may be a good thing.

5. Vivek is still the biggest impediment or enabling factor for this team finding success.

My theory is that Dumars may be keeping his role ambiguous pending the person hired. What I mean is, someone like Perry or Hughes may be more inclined to keep his voice around, given their relationship, whereas someone like Webster or Redden may refuse his role. People like Barry or Simon, who knows? But I think the team needs to clarify this quickly. If Dumars comes out and says “I work for Vivek, I am a resource for the team, but the new GM makes the basketball calls, period”, that would say a lot.

Several teams have these types of Ambassadorial roles. Frankly it’s what Vlade probably would have been ok at. But it’s never a bad thing to have a qualified, veteran basketball voice around, provided their role is well defined and avoids interference with the front office at all costs.

Parker Wells
2 months ago
Reply to  KevinSalvadori

I don’t think there’s been any indication the top names are interested, only that the Kings are interested in them.

Ican Hascheezburger
2 months ago

One thing I think about is: if Vivek truly wanted Doncic when Vlade wanted Bagley, and then moved to jettison Vlade after seeing how well Doncic performed after the draft, I feel like Vivek won’t be able to help himself in being involved in draft decisions, believing he himself has good instincts.

I just have doubts still that he’s learned any lessons about hiring someone competent and letting them do their thing. I read something on twitter about the guy in Toronto who would be a good hire but that he might be hesitant to join the kings without full control. Maybe Scott Perry is the guy that Vivek picks because Vivek knows Perry is willing to work with Vivek giving input on player evaluation, rather than because Perry is the best candidate.

Rik Smits
2 months ago
Reply to  Kosta

I feel like Vivek won’t be able to help himself in being involved in draft decisions, believing he himself has good instincts.

This is terrifyingly believable.

The new GM should daily send an email to Vivek with the following reminder:
comment image

Hong Kong Kings Fan
2 months ago
Reply to  RikSmits

He missed that 2014 Draft pick on Nik Rocks…
but at the very least he still nailed it in 2018 Draft,

which means he is 50% in his good instincts………………
@(which should be still better then the draft record of Divac)@

p.s. Just let the NEW GM picked the BPA should be the safest way.

Shark King
2 months ago

I’m not convinced Vivek wanted Luka. I’d bet this is him passing the blame for his mistake and blaming Vlade. Kind of how he blamed Petrie when he drafted Bmac over Giannis. At least we got an epic Petrie interview after that debacle.

Rory Cornell
2 months ago
Reply to  Kosta

I always got a little chuckle that the amount of pushback Vivek got from meddling made him change his ways right before meddling would’ve actually paid off for a change.

Rik Smits
2 months ago
Reply to  RORDOG

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Kevin Lam
2 months ago
Reply to  RORDOG

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Maxwell Huss
2 months ago
Reply to  RORDOG

Or is that just the narrative that’s being pushed? Vivek could have been good with that decision, and just distanced himself from it later when it turned out to be a poor one. Wouldn’t be the first time.

Regardless, the lesson learned for Vivek SHOULD be to hire COMPETENT front office people and let them make the decisions. He hired the wrong guy, promoted him under the wrong circumstances without a formal search, and it bit him in the ass.

Parker Wells
2 months ago
Reply to  AirmaxPG

I think Vivek still does whatever he can to push blame from himself. It’s the world we live in unfortunately.

K W
2 months ago
Reply to  Wonderchild

Vivek has literally never hired or fired a coach or a GM in a standard, above-board, “normal” way. He hired Malone before hiring Pete D as GM, an obvious no-no to anyone with a shred of NBA knowledge. He OK’d the firing of Malone to appease his crappy, weaselly GM who had a Napoleon complex and felt threatened by Malone’s success. He hired Corbin for the rest of the season, then cast Corbin aside to make way for Karl, whom he hired because Karl lobbied for the job on Twitter. Around the same time, he hired Vlade as a Totally Not the New GM to push the real GM out the door. He fired Karl months after it leaked that he was definitely going to fire Karl. The Joerger hiring seemed kosher at the time, but we just heard on KHTK the other day that Joerger was hired because Vivek directed Vlade to “take a look” at him, not because Vlade–the GM, who is supposed to hire the head coach–had Joerger at the top of his own list. Joerger was fired to make way for Luke Walton, who Vivek agreed to hire without any search process–formal or informal–because Vlade liked Luke (and Luke’s dad) and had a kind of gut feeling or something. I don’t know much about James Dolan, but Vivek is almost certainly the most shifty, back-stabbing, scatter-brained, weak-willed, machinating, incompetent klutz of an NBA owner this side of the Mississippi. The mere facts of his record prove it. His entire front office has been a laughable mess since 2013, and it is 100% his fault. At this point, Vivek Ranadive is not a brilliant Silicon Valley entrepreneur; he’s just an overwhelmed buffoon with courtside seats.

Parker Wells
2 months ago
Reply to  AmateurNerd

I’m glad you came around and put the blame on him at the end. At first it sounded like you were going to fall for his “don’t look at the man behind the curtain” BS.

Jerry Reynolds
2 months ago
Reply to  Wonderchild

Vivek will still select the GM and Forde is just cover ! Nothing is or will change !

A G
2 months ago

this gives me a little hope. If this is true about Dumars not being a GM candidate, and Matina not being involved in the basketball decisions (ha!), I think they can really make a great hire here.

Of course, being the Kangz, I’m fully expecting Perry to be the hire, but I hope the firm finds a great candidate who’s well qualified and Vivek buys in.

You can change this franchise with this hire, Vivek. Please don’t ruin this one. Listen and trust the pros.

Greg Lederman
2 months ago
Reply to  Dub_TC

BTW, did I read somewhere that Vivek owns less that 20% of the team?! The dude making all the decisions owns less than 1/5 of the franchise… none of the Qualcomm family can step up and flash some cash??

First Last
2 months ago

Sorry but leaking to Sam that you aren’t hiring Joe Dumars can’t erase what’s been done. I’m already looking forward to the next wave of cast-off vets who will help usher in the next culture.

andy sims
2 months ago
Reply to  Marty

I wonder if anyone actually thought that Ranadivé believes that past fiascoes would evaporate from the fanbase’s minds by not making Joe Dumars the permanent head of basketball operations.

Jeromy Simonoff
2 months ago
Reply to  Marty

I’m sure Duane Causwell will make a great GM…lol

K W
2 months ago
Reply to  Sacto_J

I’m crossing my fingers for Jabari Smith!

Carl Spackler
2 months ago
Reply to  AmateurNerd

ThreeWill Will!

Kas Keyes
2 months ago

We literally have been given one last chance. It’s like being on the verge of everything and nothing.

Go Kings regardless

andy sims
2 months ago

This seems like a very good sign that they’re not really looking at anyone already in the organization to take the reins. Fresh blood, fresh ideas and fresh mindset are mandatory for this organization to move in a better direction finally.

It’ll be a couple years before we really know the upshot from whatever happens next, but everything about this seems very encouraging. There appear to be some excellent candidates who want a chance to put their stamp on a team. I don’t know anything about Mike Forde, or what the hell Sportology is, but the simple act of reaching outside of the bubble is, in itself, progress.

I’m fascinated by the concept of being hopeful about the future. This is new to a lot of us.

Greg Lederman
2 months ago
Reply to  andy_sims

Although not still in the org, Perry has been here before under Ranadive. We need someone truly from the outside, not with any stink of being here in any capacity under Vivek.

Adam Dieter
2 months ago
Reply to  Gregoryl

It’s gonna be hilarious if they spend a bunch of money on a headhunter only to hire the guy they already once employed.

Ralph Lawrence Reyes
2 months ago

As long as it isn’t Perry then I’m good. I don’t know what the minority owners are seeing but I am not impressed with Perry at all. Hopefully this isn’t another power struggle among the owners and just let the qualified person do the search and see who is the best person to become our next GM. Crossing my fingers it would be one of Webster, Simon or Redden. If one of those names shows any interest being our next GM, go for it!

Adam Dieter
2 months ago

I don’t understand why this process should go through October. Why can’t there be a solid search and GM in place in time for both the draft and free agency? I feel this process should take less than a month. Am I wrong in thinking that?

Eric W
2 months ago
Reply to  Adamsite

I assume that’s just expectation management. Like I do all day with my daughters.

Adam Dieter
2 months ago

I get that, but why even hint that it may be after the draft and free agency. Why not just say “we are going to take our time and have a long and thorough process.” The former makes if smell of Dumars intent on possibly making final decisions regardless of who is selected as GM.

Doug Scott
2 months ago
Reply to  Adamsite

I think it might have to do with most of the good candidate’s teams are still playing. Under contract. I could be wrong though, just my guess

Jeromy Simonoff
2 months ago
Reply to  Dougscott

Exactly my thoughts…

Adam Dieter
2 months ago
Reply to  Dougscott

I’d think this is the best time to be interviewing candidates that might still be playing. I assume there is isn’t much GMing during the playoffs. There are no roster moves to be made other than scouting for the upcoming draft, which is why the Kings need to get on this sooner rather than later.

Doug Scott
2 months ago
Reply to  Adamsite

Im not going to pretend to know a GM does during the playoffs. But I will say that an assistant GM is probably busy with draft prep, like you said, during the playoffs, so the lead guy can focus on the team. So therefore, a guy like Webster, would be very busy right now and valuable to the Raptors to stay until the season ends.

Just my thoughts

Adam Dieter
2 months ago
Reply to  Dougscott

Good point. There may be teams out there that aren’t letting their assistant GM’s do interviews right now.

Eric W
2 months ago
Reply to  Adamsite

Though that’s a pretty good way to create discontent and make future candidates wary.

Teams generally allow their people to interview. And during the playoffs is usually when it’s happening since that’s when the teams that are turning over their GM positions are working on it.

Parker Wells
2 months ago
Reply to  Dougscott

I’m not sure I agree. Especially for an assistant like Zarren or Webster. I get the feeling it’s extremely rare a team would deny interviews for one of their proteges to get promoted and have a chance to run their own team.

Doug Scott
2 months ago
Reply to  Wonderchild

I don’t really have a hard time seeing it. And if the Kings are out there saying they are going to take their time, most guys wont feel the pressure.

Also, they can conduct interviews, but they may want to stay on with their current teams until the end of the season. Again, I may be wrong, just my read fo the situation.

Parker Wells
2 months ago
Reply to  Dougscott

I just don’t see why a GM would need to stay while they’re teams are playing in the playoffs. There’s very little they can do at this point to affect the on court play.

Eric W
2 months ago
Reply to  Dougscott

I’m sure they’re busy. I’m also sure they can get work remotely and get away for a day or two of interviews.

Parker Wells
2 months ago
Reply to  Dougscott

This isn’t a normal offseason. There are 3 days in between game 7 of the Finals and the draft. If Vivek wants to interview a candidate who is employed, get permission from the team and do the interview. A GM isn’t actively needed in playoff games anyway.

Doug Scott
2 months ago
Reply to  Wonderchild

See my comment below, but I think you make my point, this isn’t a normal off-season. All the more reason teams would want to keep their offices in tact as long as possible. A lead GM may not be active, but assistant GM’s like Webster, Zarren, Hughes would be.

Doug Scott
2 months ago

I have a hard time seeing a GM hired before the draft. I think in a condensed off-season like this, teams are going to place high value on keeping their FO’s in tact as much as possible, so we may not be able to interview the right guy just yet.

I know we all want to hire a guy fast. But it will take years for this new GM to right the ship. I am happy it is being done deliberately. Do you the leg work, conduct proper interviews, and hire the best guy.

Kevin Salvadori
2 months ago
Reply to  Dougscott

Agree completely. With the playoffs going on, and an abbreviated offseason, I see us probably not having a hire until late September, at the earliest. That would mean Dumars would be running draft workouts and other FO moves until that time, unless there is some party interested who happens to be their first choice and is willing to leave their current team immediately (a la Perry).

trackback

[…] shed more light on the incorporation of Dumars both in the short-term and long-term, by reporting that the new GM won’t report to Dumars, but to Kings owner Vivek Ranadive. Going further, he reports that Dumars is not interested in being the long-term lead of basketball […]

Jeromy Simonoff
2 months ago

I think Dumars isn’t completely useless in an FO, and I’m glad he’s allegedly not just going to promote himself. If it was his idea to hire Forde than he’s worth whatever Vivek is paying him: According to his website, Forde is about developing managerial culture in high level athletic programs. He worked with the Spurs in 2014 (who’d have guessed the Spurs needed cultural development assistance?) So this could turn out really well for the team. Personally, I think most of his efforts could be focused on Vivek and we’d be better off for it. If, at the very least, it forces the ownership group to take a different approach to hiring the new GM, an approach that includes actually interviewing qualified candidates, than I dare say there may be hope yet.
(insert Charlie Brown kicking football gif…)

Brian Welch
2 months ago

Why would any good candidate want to come here and work for Vivek, though? If I was a quality candidate, I would say “Thanks, but no thanks” and stay in their current role for another year and see what jobs are open then.

omar aguilar
2 months ago

Can’t we just pry someone away from the competent teams like spurs, Toronto, jazz, celtics?

Ican Hascheezburger
2 months ago
Reply to  Omr_14

It sounds like a good strategy.

So I guess the Kings won’t. 🙁

David Echard
2 months ago
Reply to  Omr_14

Throw Miami in there. What Adam Simon has done in late draft picks, g league, and talent scouting is phenomenal. Bam, Tyler Herro, Kendrick Nunn, Duncan Robinson

Kings Guru21
2 months ago

Proof will be in the pudding.

Austin Jones
2 months ago

I get really tired of being Mr. Negative on here but Scott Perry is absolute trash! You’re going to take the GM from the only other organization in the league that is possibly more trash than the Kings!!!!!
Hire somebody with a proven track record of knowing how to rebuild in the modern day NBA. Is it really that hard!!!!

Last edited 2 months ago by ajonez81

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