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Report: Kings may not trade 4th, interested in John Collins

The Kings are right in the middle of the rumor mill.
By | 164 Comments | Jun 20, 2022

Dec 5, 2021; Atlanta, Georgia, USA; Atlanta Hawks forward John Collins (20) shoots the ball against the Charlotte Hornets in the second half at State Farm Arena. Mandatory Credit: Brett Davis-USA TODAY Sports

According to Shams Charania of The Athletic, the Sacramento Kings are leaning toward keeping the 4th overall pick, as no teams have been willing to meet their steep asking price.

Of course, this is the season of smokescreens and blatant lies to help oneself, so this information may or may not be true, but this rumor shows the Kings are playing things exactly as they should. With Jaden Ivey viewed as the final guaranteed prize in what many consider to be a four-player draft, Monte McNair should be demanding a ridiculously high price to see if a team massively overreaches, and if not, Ivey is a good enough player to draft even with his minor-to-major fit concerns. For the first time in a long time, the Kings seem to be operating with a front office staff that understands the intricacy of the league.

While Sacramento’s manipulation of the draft pick trade market should be considered the most important piece of news, Charania also reported that the Kings have engaged in talks with the Atlanta Hawks around power forward John Collins. In what should be a massive relief for Kings fans, Charania added the tidbit that Monte McNair has not included the 4th overall pick in conversations with the Hawks, meaning a trade back to 16 would be unlikely.

From a talent upgrade and fit perspective, Collins makes quite a bit of sense for Sacramento, a team lacking in both starter quality players and a sensible front court partner for Domantas Sabonis. Sabonis’ unique set of skills and weaknesses are best supported by a floor-spacing, weakside rim protector, and while Collins is by no means the next coming of Rudy Gobert, he’s a much more vertical threat at the rim than Harrison Barnes. Last season, Barnes averaged just 0.2 blocks per game, the lowest mark of any rotational player on the roster. Meanwhile, Collins rejected one shot per game, a much higher volume. Collins also held his opponents to 60.6% shooting at the rim, 3.5% worse than their average, good enough for the 60th percentile among forwards, while Barnes allowed his opponents to make 64.5% of their shots in the paint, 0.6% better than average, ranking in just the 26th percentile. A Collins acquisition wouldn’t solve all of Sacramento’s defensive issues or act as a fix-all salve for Sabonis’ troubles as a rim protector, but it would allow the Kings to upgrade from awful to average in that regard.

Offensively, Collins would shift Sacramento’s game plan dramatically. He’s not quite as good from deep as Barnes, although his 36% from deep last year is respectable as a big man, and he also doesn’t have the self-creator bag that Harrison occasionally dips into when the Kings are in a scoring drought. Instead, the Atlanta big man would give the Kings a weapon they haven’t seen since Richaun Holmes went down last season: a force in the pick-and-roll and transition. In 2021-2022, Collins scored 1.44 points per possession in the screen game, ranking in the 95th percentile. Similarly, he put up 1.2 points per possession in transition, sitting in the 67th percentile. Collins would offer the Kings a Holmes-esque target in both the open and half-court, a key component of De’Aaron Fox’s passing game, without having to take the awkward path of starting a second center next to Domantas Sabonis.

The cost of Collins may or may not be prohibitive for Sacramento. His age (24) and length of contract (4 additional seasons) are right along the Fox-Sabonis timeline, although some would consider his average annual salary of $26 million to be a bit overpaid. The Hawks will likely seek a package somewhere in the range of a starting caliber player and a first round pick, or a corresponding young player worth the same value, meaning the Kings could build a package around Harrison Barnes, who would be redundant with Collins in-house, and either Davion Mitchell or a protected future first round pick.

Between the report that the Kings are refusing to part with the 4th pick without a godfather offer coming their way, and their rumored interest in John Collins, it’s clear that Monte McNair and his team are determined to walk out draft night with an improved roster and better long-term situation for both De’Aaron Fox and Domantas Sabonis.

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164 Comments
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NeedTreeFitty
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June 20, 2022 8:41 am

If by some miracle they go into next season with Collins, Domas, Fox, Mitchell, and keep #4, I may just learn how to love again.

SexyNapear
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June 20, 2022 8:47 am
Reply to  NeedTreeFitty

Seems like Hawks have been dangling Collins for a year. Gotta ask why.

Adamsite
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Nostradumbass 14
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June 20, 2022 8:56 am
Reply to  NeedTreeFitty

I’d want to keep Barnes. Trading Barnes for Collins is a lateral move, IMO. It also ties up the cap even more.

HongKongKingsFan
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June 20, 2022 8:59 am
Reply to  Adamsite

Fox
DDV
Barnes
Collins
Sabonis

is a pretty good lineup.

nonstripedzebra
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June 20, 2022 9:13 am
Reply to  Adamsite

Agreed but how does that happen? I think Barnes is likely part of The Hawks logic. They stay competitive but clear the books a bit, with a chance at a cheaper extension for Harrison if it goes well considering his age, then what Collins is currently costing them. Or Trae and co take a leap and they enter the FA market with the space Collins was eating with Barnes expiring.

Last edited 1 year ago by nonstripedzebra
AnybodyButBagley
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June 20, 2022 10:40 am
Reply to  Adamsite

The constant desire to move Barnes does not make much sense to me. He is a good player that has value. Collins is less than Barnes in my opinion.

If we can trade Barnes and get better players then go for it. There seems to be some sort of unjustified constant banter to trade Barnes for whatever reason.

RobHessing
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June 20, 2022 10:55 am

I think that Collins is better than Barnes, especially next to Sabonis. Additionally, Barnes is an expiring contract. Houston just got a #26 pick for the expiring Christian Wood. I doubt that Barnes would fetch much more than that.

Hamlet1989
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June 20, 2022 10:59 am
Reply to  RobHessing

Thank you

Kingsguru21
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June 20, 2022 11:10 am
Reply to  RobHessing

But even that requires some context as Dallas is quite limited in ways to acquire players. And Houston is still certainly in asset collection mode as well.

How valuable is something like the 26th pick to the Kings at this point? That’s my question. And if I were to answer, I’d say not nearly as much as a team like Houston that also has the 17th pick, as well, so there’s a possible package they could get with those two picks.

murraytant
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June 20, 2022 4:52 pm
Reply to  Kingsguru21

good point. While the Wood for a #26 seems like the comparison, there are mitigating factors- Houston wants Sengun at the 5 and is still acquiring assets and Wood’s numbers seem like empty calories.
The Mavs have limited ways to acquire anybody, and this is a good move for them. Barnes for anything in the 20’s is not a good trade.

Barnes for Collins is a good move- adds size, adds salary but adds stability. I love Davion but I would put him in here over a next year’s pick (strong draft)
As we know Kings have to over=pay.
BTW- Kings salary last year $130M. duds- $360M or so and going up. How do you compete with that? and despite the highest salary and high repeater tax, they still are making money.

AnybodyButBagley
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June 20, 2022 11:13 am
Reply to  RobHessing

My opinion…I don’t think the team changes much with Collins replacing Barnes.

Good point that Barnes is on an expiring contract. I just think the Kings are better off getting rid of some dead weight instead of hell bent on moving Barnes.

markdog333
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June 20, 2022 3:04 pm

I don’t think it is as much being hell bent on moving Barnes as it is recognizing the very real possibility that he could be lost for nothing at the end of the season.

AnybodyButBagley
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June 20, 2022 3:09 pm
Reply to  markdog333

True…he could be. I still think we can get something better for the team with him.

MichaelMack
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June 20, 2022 1:31 pm
Reply to  RobHessing

I read online today, and I can’t remember which national writer, that the Rockets have shopped Wood for a year, and Dallas was the first team to offer a first. I thought that was interesting, especially with his skill set. My guess is that he is less than a desirable locker room presence.

MichaelMack
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June 20, 2022 1:33 pm
Reply to  RobHessing

Also, I agree Rob. I feel that Collins is both a better player and better fit for the Kings, and he is locked up for a few years on a contract that should be easy to trade and/or a nice ballast for swinging a deal for a max-level player.

nonstripedzebra
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June 20, 2022 2:03 pm
Reply to  MichaelMack

I think it’s fair to say it’s a talent upgrade and even a good thing for the Kings he is locked up for so long considering our struggles to attract free agents. But I do think suggesting his contract as easily tradable is a stretch. This deal would be happening I think mostly on the fact that Collins is a cap restraint and overpaid, and Atlanta wanting flexibility.

MidtownMike
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June 20, 2022 2:11 pm
Reply to  RobHessing

Re-sign Barnes…he will be a solid player for the next 3-4 years

nonstripedzebra
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June 20, 2022 2:33 pm
Reply to  MidtownMike

More I sit with this, the likelihood and cost of a possible Barnes extension is a key variable. Barnes was given a generous contract basically on good will by the Kings. He’s UFA and played fairly close to his initially inflated deal.

If the Kings know he wants to go I get the intrigue of Collins for their competitive goals. Attracting a player is difficult in this market and the self induced pressure is on. On the floor it’s a seamless transition. But the money is a jump. Collins has upside to play to his deal, he also is a large risk on being one of the league’s worst overpays.

If Barnes has expressed being open or not to a team friendly extension I think that intel is relevant.

Last edited 1 year ago by nonstripedzebra
Kingsguru21
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June 20, 2022 2:40 pm

But the money is a jump. Collins has upside to play to his deal, he also is a large risk on being a league worst overpay.

Not as long as John Wall or Brad Beal are on a supermax, he’s not. Or Rudy Gobert, for that matter.

murraytant
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June 20, 2022 4:57 pm
Reply to  Kingsguru21

Collins fits better with DS.
and in a sense, this allows Monte to pick who he wants at #4 because he can tell VR that we got a vet just like you wanted.
Murray is a fit as well but Collins and Murray are similar and with Collins the pressure to go for fit with Murray is lessened
If Davion is included, then the back court is less crowded with Ivey

Kings-Rebuild
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June 21, 2022 10:21 am
Reply to  murraytant

If Kings management is worried about fit right now I’m worried about Kings management. We need good complete players not fit although good complete players by definition will provide all the fit you need. This word fit is becoming as ubiquitous as mentoring was for awhile. Let’s hope it incurs the slow death mentoring finally incurred.

Kings-Rebuild
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June 21, 2022 10:17 am

So when the Kings acquired Barnes for basically nothing, they were playing slightly above 500 basketball. Since the acquisition of Barnes the Kings haven’t come close to playing 500 basketball. Now there’s certainly a myriad of factors that contributed to the demise but it’s safe to say Barnes has not been a difference maker. When you’re not winning you can’t continue to ride with the same players and hope by some miracle things will change. Barnes has one year remaining on his contract and I doubt the Kings will resign him so it seems the prudent thing to do is move him before you get nothing for him. It’s possible the team can show some improvement next year but an appreciable improvement will take multiple years of good roster decisions. Barnes just doesn’t figure into a winning future for the Kings and the evidence is overwhelming.

RAP87
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June 20, 2022 10:46 am
Reply to  Adamsite

If we get Collins, I think Barnes is as good as gone especially if the 4th pick is not included.

Barnes + Holiday or Holmes for Collins

AnybodyButBagley
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June 20, 2022 10:48 am
Reply to  RAP87

Two solid players (Barnes and Holmes) for one role player?

I don’t see Collins moving the needle on any NBA team let alone this team.

Hamlet1989
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June 20, 2022 10:58 am

This is a really ridiculous statement, even for you! Collins has already moved the needle on his own team dramatically. The Hawks won’t consider that trade w/o a 1st rounder attached.
Also, a bit ironic from a guy called AnybodyButBagley. Maybe you were hoping we could swing a deal to get Marvin back?

AnybodyButBagley
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June 20, 2022 11:11 am
Reply to  Hamlet1989

It is my opinion. Allowed to have one.

If he makes Atlanta so much better why has he been on the trade blocks for a year?

AnybodyButBagley means just that….any player other than Bagley. It is ironic that you write but cannot read.

TheGrantNapear
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June 20, 2022 11:13 am

Collins in a vacuum would be a great acquisition. Collins along with his contract brings great acquisition down to solid acquisition at best imo.

AnybodyButBagley
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June 20, 2022 11:16 am
Reply to  TheGrantNapear

It is an ok move at best? I don’t see it as a game changer for this team. Build a bench before getting rid of Barnes for basically the same player.

RAP87
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June 20, 2022 11:25 am

So you would rather have Barnes with his expiring deal than a 24 year old who is locked up for 4 more years and could theoretically be a good fit next to Sabonis?

I’m not advocating for Collins but I wouldn’t certainly hate it if we acquire him and letting Barnes go.

Kingsguru21
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June 20, 2022 11:28 am
Reply to  RAP87

Technically Collins is under contract with for 3 more years with a player option for the 4th year.

AnybodyButBagley
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June 20, 2022 11:30 am
Reply to  RAP87

I just think we can get someone better in a deal for Barnes or deal that includes Barnes. No need to trade Barnes now.

I don’t see Collins changing this team or any other team really. My opinion. Collins is a solid role player. Collins is not going to get this team to the next level.

Last edited 1 year ago by AnybodyButBagley
BestHyperboleEver
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June 20, 2022 12:04 pm

Again, I don’t love Collins, but you may be overrating the value of an expiring Barnes.

AnybodyButBagley
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June 20, 2022 1:12 pm

Definitely could be overrating him but….I just think at some point they can get more.

rockbottom
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June 20, 2022 1:37 pm
Reply to  Hamlet1989

Collins is not as good a player as Barnes . Is a better 4 but not all round and highly over paid . Lateral move at best .

MidtownMike
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June 20, 2022 2:12 pm
Reply to  RAP87

s&t Donte and protected ’23

Dougscott
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June 20, 2022 8:41 am

I am not as big a fan of the Collins fit as a lot of Kings are, but he would be a talent upgrade

To me, we need to be invested everything we can on our wing depth and impact. That is how you win these days and play good defense.

SexyNapear
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June 20, 2022 8:51 am
Reply to  Dougscott

I’m okay with Collins if you don’t surrender the pick. But it’s the Kangz so….

Dougscott
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June 20, 2022 8:55 am
Reply to  SexyNapear

I think this is where I am as well.

AnybodyButBagley
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June 20, 2022 10:41 am
Reply to  SexyNapear

KaNGZ…

Fox and the fourth pick for Collins.

richie88
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June 20, 2022 1:55 pm
Reply to  SexyNapear

The report said that the Kings haven’t offered #4 for Collins (& that they haven’t received an offer that’s good enough for them to trade #4), which makes sense since that’d be a massive overpay for Collins.

TheGrantNapear
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June 20, 2022 11:14 am
Reply to  Dougscott

A core of Fox, Sabonis, Collins and the #4 pick (Ivey) isn’t bad. At least the FO would be accumulating talent and assets to make further moves if this core doesn’t work.

andy_sims
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June 20, 2022 8:45 am

I do like that the Collins rumors leave the 4th pick alone. He’s not number one on my list, but Collins is a good player, and is a nice fit with Sabonis.

$26m is too high, but when I imagine what a player along the lines of Collins would cost Sacramento as a free agent, it seems less crazy. The final details are key, but I agree with you, this is a development that doesn’t make my stomach hurt.

Kingsguru21
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June 20, 2022 10:41 am
Reply to  andy_sims

Collins isn’t making 26M next season, and that’s not the AAV if you include his option year over the life of the deal.

2021-22: 23M
2022-23: 23.5M
2023-24: 25.34M
2024-25: 26.58M
2025-26 (Player Option): 26.58M

After crunching the numbers, I do recollect that Collins indeed signed a 5 year 125M deal.

FWIW.

Hamlet1989
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June 20, 2022 11:07 am
Reply to  Kingsguru21

It’s not a bad contract, especially with the salary cap rising. I’m not sure I like him better than Jerami Grant but, I like the contract much better as he’d be locked-up for 4 seasons in his prime years. Grant would almost certainly be a 1 year rental.

Kingsguru21
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June 20, 2022 11:10 am
Reply to  Hamlet1989

I definitely like him better than Jerami Grant outside of the injury issues. But Grant has those, too.

andy_sims
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June 20, 2022 2:46 pm
Reply to  Kingsguru21

I’d imagine that Grant will be looking for a deal along these lines next summer. I don’t know that I’d be inclined to offer something like that.

richie88
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June 20, 2022 3:02 pm
Reply to  andy_sims

I wouldn’t offer that deal to Grant.

Kingsguru21
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June 20, 2022 4:08 pm
Reply to  andy_sims

I’m still skeptical as to what Jerami Grant really does that makes the Kings better. With Collins, at least there is the scoring/shooting/rebounding element that he brings with a bit of defense/shot blocking. I don’t really see Grant doing that on the Kings.

Adamsite
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Nostradumbass 14
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June 20, 2022 4:25 pm
Reply to  Kingsguru21

If the Kings were to acquire Collins and his 5 year deal, would they be able to re-sign Sabonis (if they so chose) to a 5 year deal? Are teams allowed to have three 5 year deals?

Kingsguru21
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June 20, 2022 7:25 pm
Reply to  Adamsite

Yes. Teams are limited to 2 Super Max deals and 2 Rookie Max extensions. Only De’Aaron Fox qualifies of any player on the roster currently, and that’s a rookie max extension.

But a 5 year deal like Collins signed with Atlanta, you could have 15 players with contracts like that technically provided you had Full Bird rights to all 15 players.

It doesn’t work that way in practice, of course. Hope this helps. (I will always hate your rosterbation ideas as evidenced by my numerous puke emojis I answer in response. On Twitter.)

FWIW.

Last edited 1 year ago by Kingsguru21
Adamsite
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June 20, 2022 8:16 pm
Reply to  Kingsguru21

Thanks for that clarification, Nate! I knew you were good for that precise cap knowledge.

I wasn’t sure if Collins deal qualified as a rookie max or not.

Adamsite
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Nostradumbass 14
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June 20, 2022 8:54 am

Man, if Monte can somehow get Collins and get a player like Ivey at #4, that is an absolute win. That being said, Collins is going to cost a future pick, maybe two, if you are not including Barnes.

From a Kings standpoint, Holmes, filler, a lottery protected 2023, and lottery protected 2025, would be great but I don’t think the Hawks go for it. They really have no need for Holmes unless a third team is involved.

SexyNapear
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June 20, 2022 9:21 am
Reply to  Adamsite

The Kings haven’t talked to Ivey. He hasn’t come in for a workout.

Who runs this team?

andy_sims
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June 20, 2022 9:30 am
Reply to  SexyNapear

We should ask for a do-over on last year’s draft, since Davion Mitchell didn’t come in for a workout.

Why would you take him? Who knows if Mitchell can even play at the pro level?

SexyNapear
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June 20, 2022 10:10 am
Reply to  andy_sims

Yeah, brag about the fact that your team is about the make the most consequential decision since the Luka debacle and they are flying blind. Awesome.

andy_sims
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June 20, 2022 10:16 am
Reply to  SexyNapear

Yes, this is exactly the same thing, well done!

BestHyperboleEver
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June 20, 2022 10:18 am
Reply to  SexyNapear

I think you’re overselling the importance of these workouts and interviews.

I can see it mattering with a guy like Sharpe that you don’t have as much film on against good competition. Or interviewing a guy with question marks in his make-up or motor. But they aren’t going to learn anything new about Ivey.

Last edited 1 year ago by BestHyperboleEver
SexyNapear
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June 20, 2022 10:50 am

Yeah, sure, I guess they just shouldn’t meet with any draft picks. Seems like a good strategy.

Hamlet1989
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June 20, 2022 11:12 am
Reply to  SexyNapear

I’m saying this as a guy who has been having a BF all weekend. Go easy bud.

SexyNapear
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June 20, 2022 4:13 pm
Reply to  Hamlet1989

BF?

Kingsguru21
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June 20, 2022 11:12 am

I consider those things sort of like getting a mint after a great steak dinner. The mint is nice and all, but it’s never going to replace the steak dinner in the first place. It’s a cherry on top of the sundae type thing for a lot of these guys.

SexyNapear
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June 20, 2022 4:12 pm
Reply to  Kingsguru21

The excuse making for the Kings front office never ends.

Kingsguru21
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June 20, 2022 4:16 pm
Reply to  SexyNapear

Where’s the excuse being made?

Dougscott
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June 20, 2022 10:42 am
Reply to  SexyNapear
SexyNapear
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June 20, 2022 10:50 am
Reply to  Dougscott

Another fine example of a delusional Kings fan who thinks the franchise is operating at at even a semi-competent level.

BestHyperboleEver
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June 20, 2022 11:43 am
Reply to  SexyNapear

For what it’s worth Morey wasn’t a big believer in pre-draft workouts. According to the workout trackers, as far as we know, the 76ers have worked out 2 players. The highest ranked of which is Keon Ellis. I’d say he and his orgs tend to be at least semi-competent.

SexyNapear
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June 20, 2022 4:11 pm

Get a track record. Than do weird shit

Last edited 1 year ago by SexyNapear
BasketballHella
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June 20, 2022 2:31 pm
Reply to  SexyNapear

As much as the Kangz stench is all over this team top to bottom. This example of having players in or not doesn’t happen as much as it used to. The only reason players did in 2018 was because we had the #2 overall.

Most agents wouldn’t let their clients work out or speak to the kings anyway because they don’t want them going there in the first place.

So this one time it’s definitely less Kangz front office and more player agents and reps not wanting them anywhere near here.

SexyNapear
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June 20, 2022 4:11 pm

Yeah sure. NO AGENT wants his players anywhere near this franchise. Kings fans have to stop making excuses for this incompetent collection of idiots

Kingsguru21
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June 20, 2022 4:15 pm
Reply to  SexyNapear

I’m sorry, but I don’t think the basketball FO ARE idiots. They’ve all come from other FO’s that are a lot of things but characterized as idiots is not one of them. Paul Johnson, the Stockton Kings GM, came out of San Antonio’s organization. Phil Jabour came out of OKC’s. Wes Wilcox worked for Cleveland when LeBron James was there and Atlanta when Mike Budenholzer coached there including that 60 win team. Monte McNair was in Houston with Daryl Morey for over a decade.

That group is a lot of things, I have no doubt, but they have never struck me as idiotic.

murraytant
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June 20, 2022 5:07 pm
Reply to  Kingsguru21

agree- not idiots
But I say this in a LOL mode- what about that new genius, just hired in Stockton to do player evaluations? Angeli World or something.

Kingsguru21
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June 21, 2022 3:31 pm
Reply to  murraytant

I’m operating under the assumption that she’s a non entity and as such I won’t waste my time laughing at the whole thing.

She’s welcome to prove us all wrong, but I’m assuming she’s going to fade away and this’ll be another dumb footnote in a long series of dumb footnotes.

nonstripedzebra
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June 20, 2022 9:08 am

This is interesting and I can see Atlanta taking a little less simply to clear his contract. But I am struggling to understand a deal construction that makes sense for the kings. In isolation or compared to alternatives.

Collins’s contract is less a factor considering Sabonis’s value deal and them being staggered for half that time. It’s still a huge number that’s increasing with a player option. In terms of trades I find it hard getting a deal without Barnes involved. If that’s the case I don’t see the needle moving much. One is expiring but we would be taking on a risk to in relation to our books.

I just think it’s worth comparing the costs for Collins, who seems to garner a fringe all star value, to say a Kuzma or Isaac. Two players I think a better fit with the team and cheaper.

Last edited 1 year ago by nonstripedzebra
BestHyperboleEver
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June 20, 2022 9:15 am

I’m not a huge Collins fan, but he’s significantly better than Kuzma. Meanwhile Isaac hasn’t played basketball in 2 years, and only averaged 45 games in the three seasons before that. If you can pick Isaac up for the cost of a lottery ticket, fine. But I wouldn’t pay a price or make plans that depend on him playing significant impactful minutes. And I say this as a guy who was all in on a Isaac/Mitchell draft in 2017.

andy_sims
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June 20, 2022 9:32 am

Unless you’re talking about including a pick to get Isaac, the “lottery ticket” cost you mention may confuse some. Not that I’m hard to confuse, admittedly.

BestHyperboleEver
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June 20, 2022 9:39 am
Reply to  andy_sims

We would have to trade for Isaac. So unless the trade cost is basically nothing, and of course, we have 17MM in cap space to burn (which is a pretty high opportunity cost), Isaac is a bad move IMO. I think IF you’re considering acquiring Isaac, you have to basically work under the assumption that there’s a decent chance he’s not going to provide useful minutes. And, at that point, why would a team in the Magic’s situation trade him for peanuts?

Last edited 1 year ago by BestHyperboleEver
andy_sims
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June 20, 2022 10:22 am

I have deep concerns about Isaac’s thought processes, nearly to the degree I do about his ability to stay on the floor. In five years, he’s averaging twenty-seven games played per season.

Isaac is owed $52m over the next three seasons, and that’s a lot of space taken up by a guy who may not give you a full season’s worth of games over that span.

BestHyperboleEver
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June 20, 2022 10:24 am
Reply to  andy_sims

Sounds like we agree.

As I said, I also don’t see ORL’s motivation to trade him at the low low (perhaps negative) price they’d be likely to get for him.

andy_sims
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June 20, 2022 1:22 pm

I mean, based on what I mentioned above, Orlando has millions of reasons to move him, even if to only get Isaac off of their payroll. I’d want a first-rounder for our trouble, but I’d rather do nothing than get Isaac.

BestHyperboleEver
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June 20, 2022 2:24 pm
Reply to  andy_sims

But they have plenty of cap space and are still in the relatively early stages of building. So they would be much better off holding onto him and letting his value grow (either by showing he can play or by reducing the contract). At this point, picks are more valuable to them than that particular chunk of cap space.

andy_sims
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June 20, 2022 2:52 pm

Good points. To me, Orlando is a far less desirable place to work and live than is Sacramento. Imagine having to live in Florida, and you’re still nowhere near a beach. Humidity, rednecks, and an absolute tourist trap? Not for me.

I’d like to think that if I was making millions per year, Florida’s lack of a state income tax wouldn’t sway me that much, but one of my few good qualities is that I’m not greedy.

murraytant
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June 20, 2022 5:14 pm
Reply to  andy_sims

Hilarious. Florida’s beaches are nice but Orlando does not have one of those. But it has all the other “amenities”- huge voracious bugs, tourists, humidity and some crazy assed non common sense opinions.

Adamsite
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June 20, 2022 4:49 pm
Reply to  andy_sims

Same. Politics aside, he’s said and done some spotlight catching things that may float better in Orlando than in a progressive thinking Sacramento. That could develop into an issue apart from his injury history.

murraytant
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June 20, 2022 5:10 pm
Reply to  andy_sims

he means, I believe that Issaac is cheap- do Kings have to pay all future medical bills?
Collins better than either of these two

Hamlet1989
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June 20, 2022 11:29 am

I’m kinda with you here. I like the idea of giving up draft picks even less than losing Barnes.
I’m not sold on Barnes as a 4. He’s ok there offensively but, he can’t guard a legit PF. Aaron Gordon made him look totally out-classed. Collins patches holes at 3 and 4 when Barnes moves back to Small Forward where his size becomes an advantage. I would think long and hard, because I can think of some deals, for Collins, I might like but not really any that I love.

Hippity_Hop_Barbershop
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June 20, 2022 9:33 am

This is going to be a fun week. Hopefully it doesn’t end in soul crushing disappointment.

RAP87
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June 20, 2022 10:43 am

“Hopefully it doesn’t end in soul crushing disappointment.”

Its the KANGZ WAY! Of course that would happen on draft night.

TheGrantNapear
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June 20, 2022 11:27 am

It is giving me vibes of the Luka draft. I still remember that week it was reported that we were taking Bagley, and I thought it was just a smokescreen so no one moves up to 1 to take Luka. Of course I and most King’s fans were wrong.

BestHyperboleEver
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June 20, 2022 11:46 am
Reply to  TheGrantNapear

I’m still not sure what this has in common with the Doncic draft. Are there reports that we’re planning on taking an over-hyped “athletic specimen” over a generational talent?

andy_sims
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June 20, 2022 12:23 pm

Of course there aren’t. There’s been almost nothing notable from the organization, and even last week’s report about the preferences of Brown & Ranadive don’t seem to be based on much of anything.

McNair appears to be handling the process in a way that has made sense since the lottery order was decided: A high price placed on the #4 if it’s to be traded, or an excellent prospect, whoever remains when Sacramento is called.

I don’t know what the likelihood of acquiring Collins might be, but I’m pleased that part of the cost won’t be this year’s pick, unless perhaps the Hawks are willing to include DeAndre Hunter.

richie88
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June 20, 2022 3:17 pm

While I don’t think there’s a generational talent in this draft, Ivey feels somewhat similar to Bagley as an overhyped athletic specimen (though I don’t expect Ivey to be as bad as Bagley) & I think there’ll be at least 1 available prospect who’s definitely better than Ivey.

TheGrantNapear
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June 20, 2022 3:29 pm

I wasn’t comparing apples to apples. Just the sentiment going into the draft was as with this one that we’re in a great position to improve the franchise barring making a stupid bone headed move. We’ll see what happens Thursday. We’re in a great position, but at the end of the day, Kangz may rule.

ManilaBayCleanerCrew
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June 20, 2022 8:37 pm

Barnes + Holiday for Collins + Huerter. Would Atlanta make that trade?

RobHessing
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June 20, 2022 9:36 am

I’d do Collins for Barnes and Mitchell and then draft Ivey. Fox, Ivey, Sabonis, Collins would be fun. Then you have to cross your fingers and hope that DDV is the answer on the wing. I doubt that Atlanta takes that deal, though.

RobHessing
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June 20, 2022 10:05 am
Reply to  RobHessing

And 1 – I would also consider Collins for a top 10 protected ’23 pick, though that would come only Barnes and not Mitchell.

UpgradedToQuestionable
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June 20, 2022 10:16 am
Reply to  RobHessing

Trading a future FRP is a dangerous game if you’re Sacramento – when you miss the playoffs (play-in ain’t playoffs as we all agree) you crush the fan base who, as we are all living now, trend up the fandom with hope and dreams this time of year and throughout the Summer and Pre-Season.

The Kings can’t depend on Free Agency where they are getting leftovers and crumbs.

Just my opinion – one of the most valuable players on the Sacramento roster is next year’s first rounder (for the last 16 years). When you are in the playoffs, not so much. Even with this possible upgraded roster, getting into the Western Conference playoff picture is far from a sure thing.

John Collins is just not enough, IMO, to part with a first round pick. If they were one piece away, and he was the piece – ok. Sacramento, even with John Collins is more than one piece away, IMO.

RobHessing
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June 20, 2022 10:21 am

After 16 years, I don’t think that the thought of “crushing the fan base” is on the organization’s front burner. And again, it’s top ten protected, so it is a limited risk.

UpgradedToQuestionable
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June 20, 2022 12:39 pm
Reply to  RobHessing

Agree. Crush was too strong a term. This site is proof that this fan base, despite being deeply buried in disappointment can thrive with hope and fun and good cheer.

Back when, in a time long long ago when Sacramento had strong playoff teams and became a Title Contender – the draft was an amusement; what curious gems can they add? Well, Kevin Martin (26), Gerald Wallace (25), Hedo Turkoglu (16) and wash out the Quincy Dooby (19), Dan Dickau (28), Francisco Garcia (23). If they skipped a draft, no matter, team is still going strong.

Ah, the good ol’ days.

UpgradedToQuestionable
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June 20, 2022 12:50 pm

And not unimportantly –

but if I’m John Collins, I am okay with a trade, even to Sacramento, as long as I don’t have to don that awfully ugly yellow Hawks jersey ever again. And that doesn’t work if Sac brings back the gold lamè.

RikSmits
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June 20, 2022 12:58 pm

Yeah, we’re past the crushing part and at the dislodging bits of icky fan gristle from the grooves of the organization’s booth-part.

But hey, creamy thick shakes! I mean; nice arena!

murraytant
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June 20, 2022 5:19 pm
Reply to  RobHessing

next year’s draft appears strong. If Kings keep protected pick, fine but even an #11 is good.and if the Kings keep it, the drama goes on for years.

murraytant
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June 20, 2022 5:18 pm

yes. Collins not worth losing a FRP. or having the risk of loss hang on for years.

TheGrantNapear
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June 20, 2022 11:29 am
Reply to  RobHessing

If I’m Monte and those are the two choices, I’m trading Davion and keeping the 2023 pick knowing well that this team is likely back in the lottery.

murraytant
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June 20, 2022 5:20 pm
Reply to  TheGrantNapear

yep

MidtownMike
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June 20, 2022 2:15 pm
Reply to  RobHessing

Eww no way…Kings big losers giving up Barnes and Mitchell

richie88
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June 20, 2022 3:20 pm
Reply to  RobHessing

I’d much rather have Murray & Davion than Ivey.

murraytant
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June 20, 2022 9:12 pm
Reply to  richie88

It might be Collins + Ivey and losing Barnes and Davion.
vs.
Murray and keeping Barnes and Mitchell

richie88
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June 21, 2022 1:28 am
Reply to  murraytant

I’d much rather have Murray, Davion & Barnes than Ivey & Collins.

Adamsite
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Nostradumbass 14
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June 20, 2022 4:45 pm
Reply to  RobHessing

That’s too much for Collins. Swapping Barnes for Collins is a wash, but including Mitchell is just too much.

Dub_TC
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June 20, 2022 9:55 am

I haven’t felt this good coming into a draft in a long while. Monte has an actual chance to do something good, I think. Hopefully he can.

1951
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June 20, 2022 9:59 am

comment image

RobHessing
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June 20, 2022 10:14 am
Reply to  1951

How do you feel after the kingth motht rethent draft pick?

Thor.
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.
.
.
Thor.

1951
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June 20, 2022 10:21 am
Reply to  RobHessing

Jaden Ivey does not like sausage. He said Sacramento “wouldn’t be the wurst option.”

comment image

andy_sims
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June 20, 2022 10:23 am
Reply to  1951

Please show yourself out.

1951
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June 20, 2022 10:27 am
Reply to  andy_sims
RobHessing
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June 20, 2022 10:35 am
Reply to  1951

comment image

Hozr
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June 20, 2022 6:48 pm
Reply to  1951

You’re such a brat.

Kingsguru21
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June 20, 2022 10:53 am

Between the report that the Kings are refusing to part with the 4th pick without a godfather offer coming their way, and their rumored interest in John Collins,

I mean, really, who out there truly thought the Kings would trade the 4th pick for Collins? The Kings didn’t do that for Sabonis, why would they consider it for Collins? Because of an opinion that McNair is under a win-now mandate from outside sources? LOL. That’s all I got on that one.

it’s clear that Monte McNair and his team are determined to walk out draft night with an improved roster and better long-term situation for both De’Aaron Fox and Domantas Sabonis.

Of course McNair is going to ask everything for that 4th pick, why shouldn’t he? He won’t get it, but you don’t get what you don’t ask for. And isn’t McNair’s job as GM to improve the roster? Or am I missing something?

I thought the most revealing thing about the Shams blurb on the Kings was the need to state that McNair is thought to be in control of basketball operations. Not the statement itself, but the need to state that McNair is in control. Yet again.

TBH, most of the column was whether Kyrie Irving would end up on the Nets, Knicks or Lakers anyway. There wasn’t much else in the tidbits that told me much of anything, and certainly the points about Irving didn’t have much use for me personally, either. There was a whole section dedicated to whether or not Lou Williams would retire for chrissake. There was a 2 line bit about Minnesota being interested in Clint Capela. (That was the most interesting thing of the whole column, I thought.) The Pacers are discussing trades around Brodgon and Turner, surprise surprise!

That’s most of what Shams wrote, I might add. Not all. There’s some other stuff in there, but not especially interesting (to me). It’s that time of year.

Last edited 1 year ago by Kingsguru21
TheGrantNapear
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June 20, 2022 11:32 am
Reply to  Kingsguru21

You seemed pissed at Shams.
I’d love to see Kyrie back with Lebron and Westbrook back with KD, just for the comedy of it all.

Kingsguru21
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June 20, 2022 11:40 am
Reply to  TheGrantNapear

I’m not pissed at anyone. Outside of myself for filling my Mom’s clay oven with too much water that is overflowing outside the oven and now I have to clean that up.

But I have no reason to be pissed at Shams for what he reported. I’m sorry if you don’t understand actual criticism and how it works, though, bud. I’ll try harder to do it Idiocracy style next time, but I’m pretty sure my Tyme Masheen is broken.

AnybodyButBagley
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June 20, 2022 1:16 pm
Reply to  Kingsguru21

It is perfectly ok to write a coherent post and not attack people like a total ass.

Occasionally you pull it off. Keep trying.

Kingsguru21
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June 20, 2022 1:51 pm

So it’s okay for you to mischaracterize my opinion on purpose with no penalty. But it’s not okay for me to call you an asshole when you do. Got it. Good to know.

AnybodyButBagley
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June 20, 2022 3:05 pm
Reply to  Kingsguru21

Not mischaracterizing anything on purpose. Is what it is…

Kingsguru21
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June 20, 2022 4:10 pm

Right. Just like I believe there’s oceanfront property in Arizona.

AnybodyButBagley
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June 20, 2022 11:31 pm
Reply to  Kingsguru21

You should look at map. Basic knowledge is helpful. Your knowledge is limited only by your inability to see reality.

NinjaFetus
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June 20, 2022 11:19 am

Collins would add much-needed talent to this roster, but I don’t think that would be a good move honestly.

We need outside shooting more than interior at the moment, and while Collins can hit some shots I don’t think it would be enough to open up the middle. Look at how the league is right now, outside shooting is prioritized and we don’t have a bunch of that on the roster currently. Unless someone has really worked on adding that over the off-season I don’t think we have good enough shooting from outside to add someone of Collins’s talent and not be clogging the middle, which would prohibit Sabonis and Fox’s ability.

TL:DR – Collins is a good talent, but we need better outside shooting first, imo. Just my 2 cents.

TheGrantNapear
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June 20, 2022 11:22 am

There’s a world where Collins’ contract mirrors that of Barnes’. Remember the first year or so of Barnes’ contract was viewed as a complete overpay and we fans were pissed. Fast forward into the future and Barnes’ contract ended up becoming at the very least a fair contract, if not a somewhat value contract. Point being, we can see a similar trajectory for Collins’ contract, specifically with the CAP rising.
Collins is really young and still has a lot of room to grow. The pick and roll threat with him and Fox would be legit and the spacing he would give Sabonis to operate on the block would be awesome.
If Monte can kind of buy low right now on Collins and avoid giving up this year’s pick then go for it. Next year’s pick if included should be top 5 protected.

2021-22: 23M
2022-23: 23.5M
2023-24: 25.34M
2024-25: 26.58M
2025-26 (Player Option): 26.58M

OG_Aggie
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June 20, 2022 11:36 am

Any trade for Collins depends on Atlanta’s motivation. If it’s to clear future salary then Barnes and some other assets gets it done. If they want value for perceived value then I think the Kings don’t do it.

As for the Godmother (shout out to the best sandwich in the world, at Bay Cities Italian Deli in Santa Monica,) offer, it won’t happen until the Kings are on the clock and some GM loses blood to his brain looking at whoever of the top four is sitting there. I think Detroit and Indiana is as far as Monte should be willing to drop. I could see packages from both teams that would work. Otherwise, draft at 4 and go from there.

Hobby916
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June 20, 2022 11:39 am

So Barnes + Holiday/Holmes, maybe a protected 1st as well, for Collins then draft Keegan to replace Barnes? Got it.

Marty
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June 20, 2022 12:18 pm

This was a fun sentence Tim. 🙂

this information may or may not be true, but this rumor shows the Kings are playing things exactly as they should

bjax1
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June 20, 2022 12:20 pm

Love this week. Good stuff. How about this. Collins and a lottery protected first next year, and 2 years after, otherwise it converts to 2 seconds. Throw in Barnes and one of Holiday, Harkless or TD. May need to take another player back from Atl. I would do that deal. I love Barnes but he’s a tradable asset, and Collins is locked up for a bit. It hasn’t work with this core. Time to try switching out pieces.

TheGrantNapear
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June 20, 2022 3:34 pm
Reply to  bjax1

I don’t think two firsts are necessary to obtain Collings.
One should do it.

Adamsite
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Nostradumbass 14
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June 20, 2022 4:43 pm
Reply to  TheGrantNapear

Not if that one is unlikely to convey. There is no way in hell they should include a future unprotected pick. I’m fine with 2 protected firsts.

Kingsguru21
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June 20, 2022 7:30 pm
Reply to  bjax1

If the Kings got back Huerter, I’m absolutely game.

Marty
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June 20, 2022 12:28 pm

IMHO, giving up future firsts for John Collins would be next-level KANGZ.

andy_sims
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June 20, 2022 1:26 pm
Reply to  Marty

Entirely dependent on the protections.

Kingsguru21
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June 20, 2022 1:56 pm
Reply to  andy_sims

I’d have no trouble with a top 10 protections from 2023-25 and converting into 2 2nd rounders in 2026. Especially since Atlanta is deep into the tax and the Kings would be saving them around 11 million dollars were they able to make a trade that got Atl completely out of the tax.

Gotta give up something to get something.

Adamsite
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June 20, 2022 4:42 pm
Reply to  Kingsguru21

Same. 2023 lottery protected (converts to two second rounders in 2023 and 2024 if not conveyed) and a 2025 lottery protected first (converts to two second rounders in 2025 and 2026) is what I would propose, along with Holmes and filler.

Full admission, the Kings aren’t making the playoffs next year, so that pick won’t convey, but they had better be in the playoffs in 2025 or we will have burned the arena down by then.

Kingsguru21
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June 20, 2022 7:32 pm
Reply to  Adamsite

Full admission, the Kings aren’t making the playoffs next year,

Doomer. You’z a Doomah Adam!!!! Fall back in shame, Doomah!!!!!!

richie88
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June 20, 2022 3:38 pm
Reply to  andy_sims

1 protected pick would be fine. 2 picks seems excessive, no matter the protections.

Kingsguru21
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June 20, 2022 7:33 pm
Reply to  richie88

Agreed. Collins is, at best, worth a non lottery 1st.

Mike120
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June 20, 2022 12:34 pm

I’m for whatever gets us to:
Fox
Ivey
Barnes
Collins
Sabonis. Would love to keep all future FRPs and Mitchell. Probably a pipe dream. Would a package of Holmes, Holiday, TD and two second rounders get us Collins?

bjax1
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June 20, 2022 12:39 pm
Reply to  Mike120

Why would they do that? Collins is better than Holmes.

rockbottom
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June 20, 2022 1:51 pm
Reply to  bjax1

They want to unload his contract and Hunter is better and will need paid in a year .

Kingsguru21
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June 20, 2022 2:22 pm
Reply to  bjax1

Atlanta is 7M+ deep into the luxury tax since Trae Young qualified for the 5th year 30% criteria. They were a few million over, but that increase in pay for Trae added an extra potential 5 million to that tax bill.

The Hawks FO knew this was coming. I don’t think there was ever any intention of paying the tax for their team this upcoming season. Even then, they could easily get under the tax by waiving Galinari’s partially guaranteed contract. Part of the reason they are trading the tax is waiving Galinari is only a one time fix, and they have other players that are going to create a new problem next season (like De’Andre Hunter).

Adamsite
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Nostradumbass 14
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June 20, 2022 4:38 pm
Reply to  Kingsguru21

Still, they could likely do better than Holmes, Holiday, TD and some second rounders.

Kingsguru21
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June 20, 2022 7:34 pm
Reply to  Adamsite

Maybe. But getting out of the luxury tax can be tricky.

Adamsite
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Nostradumbass 14
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Nostradumbass 14
June 20, 2022 8:23 pm
Reply to  Kingsguru21

I was thinking they could simply trade him to the Spurs for one of their two later round picks and some minor filler. Something like John Collins for Zach Collins, #20, and/or #25. That saves them a ton of money.

Kingsguru21
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June 21, 2022 4:46 pm