Monte McNair finally put a fuse to his powder and the results are explosive.
According to ESPN’s Adrian Wojnarowski, the Sacramento Kings are trading Tyrese Haliburton, Buddy Hield, and Tristan Thompson to the Indiana Pacers for Domantas Sabonis, Justin Holiday, and Jeremy Lamb. The Kings will also get a second round draft pick.
The Pacers are trading Domas Sabonis, Jeremy Lamb and Jeremy Lamb to Sacramento for Tyrese Hailburton, Buddy Hield and Tristan Thompson, sources tell ESPN.
— Adrian Wojnarowski (@wojespn) February 8, 2022
Jeremy Lamb AND Justin Holiday. https://t.co/0GbRwKcRBP
— Adrian Wojnarowski (@wojespn) February 8, 2022
The Pacers are including a 2027 second-round pick in the deal to the Kings, sources tell ESPN.
— Adrian Wojnarowski (@wojespn) February 8, 2022
Ok, deep breath while we process for a second.
Damn. This is a huge trade for the Kings. Tyrese Haliburton was definitely the Kings best asset when factoring in production and contract, and is clearly the prize from Indiana’s side. But we loved Haliburton in Sacramento. He was, I think it’s safe to say, most people’s favorite player on the Kings.
On the flipside, Sabonis is an absolute stud. He’s just 25 years old, is on a great contract, and is instantly and undeniably the Kings best player. Lamb and Holiday are also real nice players. The Kings traded one great young player and two negative assets for three solid players, one of which is arguably the best player in the entire trade.
Another positive for Kings fans, our long Buddy Hield nightmare is over.
I’m not ready to say this is a win. I’m gutted at losing Haliburton. He’s such a fun player and it feels like the sky is the limit for him.
I’m also not ready to declare this a loss. Sabonis is going to be very fun.
The other key is what happens next. Sabonis and Fox have a lot of redundancies in their strengths and limitations. I suspect there will be more moves to come, and those will be a big factor in how Monte McNair gets graded when the dust settles on Thursday.
Wow…still processing. Had to sacrifice Hali to rid ourselves of Buddy…thanks Vlade.
To quote the great Bunk Moreland: “Happy now, bitch?”
Just do something, they cried.
Bunk was great.
and Sheeee-it.
The trade broke your website
Yeah, I keep getting “Database Error” messages.
Goddamn, Haliburton?
Bye Rese and Buddy, good riddance to Thompson.
terrible
poor ownership needs the splash for ticket sales
Sabonis is a free agent two years after this one
Haliburton was the only hope here
I get that Sabonis is an all-star, but giving up Hali absolutely stings. Just think, the Pacers are giving up an all-star, yet to hit his prime for Hali and garbage. THAT IS HOW MUCH HALI IS VALUED IN THE EYES OF THE PACERS.
So is Monte planning on building around Fox and Sabonis? Two guys that can’t stretch the floor and are not plus defenders? I don’t like it.
I fucking hate you right now Monte, there had better be more coming for this to make sense.
Kings Fans: “We FINALLY have a player to build around who makes his teammates better.”
Vivek: “Hold my beer.”
Agree. Do not like this trade. Bad idea to give up Haliburton, who checks all the boxes, shooting, playmaking, and is only getting better.
And build around Fox? Idiotic risk. Hangin onto an idea we’ll after it’s done. The Kings way.
Haliburton is going to be a badass PG-mini Nash type numbers already, and the Kings chose Fox and a run at the playoffs.
There had better be more. This stinks of ownership insisting on building with a non shooter poor defender. Hate it. It goes against logic and the percentages.
Haliburton – I don’t like losing him. He was the one player on our team who had more than one dimension to him.
Hield – Adios. It was fun (a few years ago)
Tristan Thompson – Hello, ladies of Indianapolis.
At least we picked up a 2nd rounder.
One criticism I got from the Pacer fans was the ball tended to stop when it got to Sabonis and everything slowed down.
Plus he clogs the lane. How does that work with Fox?
Not enthused.
We love Hali. He’s going to be an All-Star someday soon, that’s my prediction. BUT. Sabonis is at that level right now. Good contract. 25 years old. We dumped HIELD and Thompson. This shows just how highly Haliburton is regarded, since from Indy’s perspective he is THE acquisition in this trade, and they gave up Sabonis for him. On the pure data merits, this is a fair trade at worst for the Kings. It just STINKS to give up Hali. I would’ve preferred offloading Fox 10000x more than Hali.
I just wish we didn’t have to trade one of the best pieces we’ve had in a long time to get rid of buddy hield…
So first off, if you’re reading this Tyrese (unlikely but you’re awesome enough that it’s possible), you were the best part of the Kings these last two years. We wish you success in the future— All-Star, championships, etc. because you deserve it— and I hope I see you back in a Kings’ jersey someday.
Secondly, we now have two point guards and two centers in our starting lineup. It’s possible to play Fox and Mitchell/Holmes and Sabonis together, but man it doesn’t make me comfortable. What’s the next step here, and should we be disappointed without follow-up trades to fix the potential positional issues (and knock on wood that any follow-up trade isn’t horrendous)?
The Pacers fans are ecstatic on their website. This is a dream come true for them.
For me, it’s f’n bleh.
If they only knew what they’re getting in Buddy and his bloated contract.
It declines every year and also that Rick guy who coaches him will actually know how to use him and keep him productive
I am very curious how buddy will fare in a better system. Buddy is the type of player who needs structure desperately in order to be effective. I’m glad he’s gone tbh but wish it didn’t have to involve losing Hali 🙁
https://twitter.com/HPbasketball/status/1491122359155101697?s=20&t=SIUoNABulPNMSHiEb7Sybg
The Kings traded the best value and received the best player in this trade. Sabonis is easily the best teammate Fox has ever had.
Hali will be missed, and he will be looooooooooved in Indy. It hurts a bit to see my favorite King go, but the roster improved without sacrificing future picks.
Folks that have not seen a lot of Sabs are sleeping on him. He is really good. And the narrative that he is a ball stopper is vastly overrated. He has handled more this year as Indy’s point guards have been injured. He is a plus facilitator, Jokic-lite. And he is under a very good contract for the next 2.3 seasons. And he’s only 25.
Hield and TT going for the expiring Lamb and Holiday (under contract next year) is a net positive for the Kings.
The trade will likely cost the Kings a slot or two in the upcoming draft – I’m guessing an extra three wins (give or take) over the remaining 27 games. NO and Sac battling for 10-11 in West, finishing 8-9 from the bottom in the final league standings.
Still a lot of work to be done – the team still needs to figure out a way to add a third player of Fox / Sabs caliber.
Losing Hali is going to hurt. What a stud. I hope that he crushes it in Indy. But I think that the Kings are better today than they were yesterday, and without sacrificing future assets. It’s too bad that Hield was not moved earlier – he’s really not much more than filler here. An overall win for the organization, in my opinion.
There needs to be more from Monte. Sabonis and Fox needs shooters around them, and they just traded away two shooters to get Sabonis.
We shall see if another trade happens by Thursday.
LOL, JJ Reddick just said on ESPN what I posted and he doesn’t like the trade from the Kings perspective. He feels Indy is the winner in the deal.
I hear from a source that Larry Bird likes the trade. Opinions vary.
My guess is that ESPN and social media will
eviscerate the Kings over this, because after 15+ years of tomfuckery, the
default setting is disdain. The truth is that no one can call this trade today,
though everyone is 100% entitled to their opinion. That said, I couldn’t give
two squirts about what any of the ESPN talking heads or Twatters think about
this trade. I value the opinions in these threads 1M times more than any of
those hacks.
our hacks are definitely much better at distinguishing between great / good / meh / not so good / Klassic Kangzing. I’m not enthused but this could have gone much worse…we could have gone full Vlade and traded Hali and a 1st round pick and kept Buddy.
Which is why it was so difficult to get by today with no TKH!
They may not know but this trade definitely has a feel of the Kings going with the less likely outcome, lower percentage and bad idea.
In that way way it is like the failed deals prior.
Prime example was Bill Simmons pod… said Kings were idiots (maybe fair) because point guards are tough to find…only 7-8 good ones. Constantly over last year said point guard is super easy to fill. Like RBs in NFL constant comparison. Pick a lane.
Also seen so many places that Turner would have opened up spacing because he is the shooter between him and Sabonis. Turner 33% last 2 years. 32% for Sabonis. Massive difference 🙄
JJ is close friends with Hali though, and as much as I like JJ’s takes he did call Hali a “great defender” which is definitely some embellishment. I wouldn’t have made this trade though, to be clear
Agreed, though I was surprised to see that Holiday is at least a slight threat from beyond the arc. And the Hield that the Kings traded was not the Hield of the Joerger era.
I don’t think that Holmes is a great fit next to Sabs, and with Hali gone you really need to add a 3rd ball handler behind Fox and Mitchell, who likely becomes your 1st off the bench PG. The hope would be that any subsequent deals would be made for setting up next season as opposed to chasing the 10 seed this year.
Yeah, I do worry about ball handling now. Before Hali, the Kings had Bogi. you got to have at least 3 legit ball handlers, right now they have one in Fox and still an unproven one in Mitchell. Hell, even Buddy did some ball handling. Who is next on the depth chart right now? Ramsey?
As it stands right now, Davi would have to be the PG off the bench, and a break in case of emergency PG would be needed. Is there someone in Stockton?
The Kings dealt 29% of their played minutes today, so it’s certainly going to look different. And I don’t see Sabs and Holmes as a pristine fit…PJ Washington for Holmes might solve that?
The Kings still need to get really lucky in the lottery this off-season or make a deal for a legit 3rd muskateer. My hope is that they are not done dealing, and that their deals are more with an eye for the long-term than the 10 seed.
Also, seemingly lost in all of this is that Buddy Hield is gone. Buddy. Hield. Is. Gone.
That was the 1st thing that came to mind for me . I wasn’t sure there was a legit trade out there the Kings could have done. I’m still not, honestly.
It really hurts losing Tyrese. It helps a lot to gain Sabas Jr. I really want to see how this roster looks come Thursday. If this is entirely it….it’s something. But not enough.
How much if an issue is the fit between Holmes and Sabonis? I love Richaun but he’s a 24-28 minute per game player making $10 million annually. I don’t know that ten to fifteen minutes a night of that duo is unplayable. Although packaging Holmes with Barnes and/or a pick could bring in better fitting players. Is that enough for Siakam?
yes, think of next year, not this year.
The deadline deal for Vucivich by the Bulls helped them a lot in year two. Difference- Kings gave up proven young asset, Bulls gave up a #8 pick (F, Wagner)
Every time we say “this must not be it, more moves must be coming for this to reaally make sense,” then nothing else comes and it doesn’t make sense.
Nicely summarized, Robert.
What Sims said. Nicely summarized Yogi214. (Sorry, just had to.)
I’m wondering if the Kings sacrificed a real future for a slightly better team now. I doubt they can go far with a Fox/Sabonis odd pairing, unless they add a lot. And now they have even less shooting. In a league where shooting is King……They should have traded Fox. For someone else.
They are betting on Fox blossoming with Sabonis. Keeping Haliburton is better for future team success I believe.
Yeah I think that sums it up as well as anybody has put it. I personally don’t like the deal. We got older and less athletic and didn’t improve our positioning for the future. Yes Fox would have probably been better to relinquish than Haliburton but I suspect there wasn’t a market for him. The pressure now ratchets up even higher on management because if there are no subsequent moves, by itself this trade is a disaster.
Rob–
if the kings stayed pat, they would have finished with the 5,6, or 7th worst record. No one can beat the Bottom Tanking Four. However, even standing pat, would not guarantee that the Pacers (with Sabonis) or the Blazers would not overcome them.
With Sabonis as a King, I suspect that Pacers + Blazers finish with the Bottom Four and Kings get #7th worst. This is a switch of 1 slot, maybe 2.
Yes, if the only byproduct of the trade is 2022 ping pong balls, this is not a good trade for the Kings.
Meter’s running on Fox, and you either need to fish or cut bait. I was probably more in the camp to deal Fox (and anyone else not named Tyrese Haliburton), blow it up and start over. But the Kings (or the market) determined otherwise, and that is how it came to be that the Kings acquired a player that is as good or better than their best player.
Holy shit. McNair actually made a big move. I’m still processing this whole thing.
IM FUCKING DYING
Justin Holiday can’t play home games, so do they keep him?
Edit: I haven’t lived in Sacramento for a decade or so. Am I wrong in thinking that unvaccinated players can’t play home games there, or am I totally off-base?
The state is dropping mask requirements in a week, so it may be that it doesn’t matter/no one cares.
Mask mandate doesn’t have an effect on what the Kings decide to do with vaccines.
If they’re dropping the most minimum mandate, there probably isn’t any point in having any others.
No Holiday can play home games. NYC is the only place where a home player can’t play unvax’d.
Nevermind. I think I forgot something about there being a mandate or whatever. And for some reason I thought it was only NYC.
Oh well. It’s possible the Kings could move Holiday anyway in a deal so it might not come up.
Nevermind again. Apparently, according to James Ham and Sean Cunningham, Kings players are not required to be vax’d, there are two players on the roster who are not as is.
City of NY and SF were the only cities I recalled having mandates for professional players and home games.
The state is dropping mask requirements in a week, so it may be that it doesn’t matter/no one cares. Sac County rules could come into play, however.
he can play at Golden One- the fans show vax records, not the players. Only SF and NY exclude un vaxxed players.
There is another un-named King who is not vaxxed.
Shooting is for nerds
Well put Greg.
I don’t think people appreciate how hard it was to trade Buddy Hield. And, this is peak value for Tyrese Haliburton. If any trade you make, you want something in return. The Kings only traded Buddy Hield, Tristan Thompson and Tyrese Haliburton, they got back two useful rotation guys in Justin Holiday and Jeremy Lamb. Also, they didn’t trade a pick to get Sabonis.
Yes, those who love Haliburton and didn’t want him traded under any cost are disappointed. Understandably.
But there is a path. You wanted a move? You wanted a move that made forward progress? This is that. This is a move from a roster and team building standpoint that makes sense. Sabonis is a heck of a player and while he’s never going to anchor a team defense of note, he is an excellent defensive rebounder. And while he’s not a great 3 point shooter historically in Indianapolis, perhaps that’s a part of his game the Kings can figure out how to tap into. Chris Webber shot more jumpers under Adelman than he ever had for the Bullets in the 4 seasons he was in DC.
How much of a factor was Tyrese Haliburton to winning basketball? We’ll get that answer, I suspect, in the next few seasons, but he wasn’t a true needle mover here. De’Aaron Fox is much tougher to trade, and De’Aaron being able to defend SG’s instead of PG’s makes a lot more sense defensively.
Let’s not forget that Davion Mitchell is still around, and he is a far better defender of PG’s than either Haliburton or Fox by a lot. We’re still talking about team building, right?
Yes, this is a tough trade to make, and yes it’s a young player we all very much enjoy watching play. But to get something you have to give up something, and the Kings got a lot of something in this deal.
Like Greg said, I want to see what other moves are made. And I want to see whether or not this team is going after a play-in spot that seems very pie in the sky where having a high pick would be better. But if you wanted a path chosen, there’s a path being chosen.
And so it goes detective lieutenant. And BHE: There do be some puddin’ on this here table in the Evil Cowtown. HUZZAH! Hooray for paths chosen?
Not a whole hell of a lot, apparently. Of course, this depends on one’s willingness to apply their standards in all cases.
What’s good for the Fox is good for the Cyclone.
Ultimately, I think the Kings were willing to trade both Fox and Haliburton. Haliburton just had more value now, and Fox’s upside is higher. That had to play a large part in the calculation.
I mentioned it above (if the comment ever shows up) but at this point, I’d rather give the keys to Mitchell and deal Fox for a two guard who can shoot. Unless Davion takes leap in terms of shooting, I don’t think you can play them together and be good.
How much of a factor was Sabonis to winning basketball. One could also argue that he had better players around him than Haliburton.
Just a few days ago I said no one is untradeable on the Kings with the possible exception of Haliburton. I said you only trade him for an all-star 25 years old and younger. That is exactly what Monte just did.
I love Hali, so this hurts from that perspective. In a vacuum the Kings got the best player in the deal, but I’m not sure how well Sabonis is going to work with Fox. Hali and Sabonis would have thing to behold.
You got to spend money to make money, right? Which is what we did. When was the last time the Kings even had a player make the all star team? I can’t even remember.
Well, folks wanted MM to get off his ass and “do something”, so here we go!
‘But to get something you have to give up something‘ – This right here. Trades over time regress to the mean of being net neutral.
Well stated. I’m in this boat. Let’s see 🤷♂️
Don’t you think this is peak value for Sabonis and don’t forget we had Kuzma and Harrell for Buddy not too long ago. Man wouldn’t we like that trade even more now. Sabonis is a solid player, but he’s a stiff athlete and he’s not a particularly good defender and he’s certainly not a franchise player. All these guys from Indiana to me were a bit overrated considering what they been getting in actual trades and prospective trade talk. If they were as good as the trade market seems to indicate, they wouldn’t have the record they have. We may get a small temporary blip up with this trade but as time goes on it will look progressively worse IMO.
WELCOME TO HELL, SABONIS OF THE LAMBS
“SABONIS LAMBS IS PEOPLE!”
*Basketball Hell
Fucking Kangz!
fucKINGStupid
This is an embarrassment to the entire organization and a straight up betrayal of what kings fans there are
Franchise with no all-stars trades second-year player who’s had no impact on the win/loss record.
I wish Haliburton had been able to stay, but you are going full Scarlett O’Hara, and it’s equally hilarious and mortifying.
no clue who O’Hara is but I think reducing what Tyreese was to “a second year player who had no impact on wins and losses” is not the greatest way to describe what we gave up
But do you mind if we call Sabonis a two-time all-star?
I’m not thrilled about losing Haliburton, but if everyone wants to go all-in on Fox being unable to single-handedly increase win totals, then it sure as hell applies to anyone else on the roster.
As has been said of Fox, if he’s so great, why aren’t things getting better?
You shouldn’t use old timey references Sims. Confusing the children is always a bad idea.
But the assists. All those assists.And blowouts. But who cares right? Tyrese plays winning basketball but isn’t winning because the talent around him sucks. But that only applies to Tyrese, everyone else on the roster are losers.
Man, I’m going to miss Tyrese. I’m just having a huge sad not thinking about those dimes. And those step back 3’s that I never think are going in but do anyway.
Tyrese made players around him better. I’m not sure that’s true for Fox, and almost certainly isn’t true this season. I can’t argue that Tyrese added wins, because this team doesn’t have any. I don’t have an issue with the deal. I just hope they’re going balance out the roster and reacquire some shooting.
How did Tyrese make players around him better? I’m curious of this, and more specifically beyond the assists because that’s the easy part of this equation.
This is a good question. Fox averaged over seven APG last season, and is over six per game for his career. The Kings have lost a lot of games.
Tyrese is a great passer, and the Kings continue to lose a lot of games.
I guess we need a definition of “better.”
And I ask this as a big fan of Ty’s, whose game I love as much as anyone’s.
This looks like trying to bait me into a stupid argument. Nope.
Not the most graceful way of dodging a simple, direct question, but you can make it up to me some other time.
Moving the ball, breaking down defenses and creating easy shots with his passing. I haven’t looked at the numbers, but I believe Hali was a signficant plus player on offense, not that it matters now anyway.
Domas does this also. He’s averaging 5 assists this year.
In the 8 games De’Aaron was gone, these are the averages:
17.9 PPG 9.4 APG 2.6 TOV 5.9 3FGA on 34% 4 FTA on 87.5% (41.4/34/87.5 is your FG/3PT%/FT%)
105.1 ORtg 119.7 DRtg 54.4 TS% USG% 21% TOV 9.6% AST% 39.3
I believe this is partly why he was traded. His presence wasn’t an automatic guarantee of anything, and he had more value in trade than anyone on the roster. By alot.
I’ll remember those, but also the 3-5 decent looks that he didn’t take each game. I hope Tyrese averages twenty shots a game in Indy. He could have done that here, and no one would have complained.
And all those steals he gets in those passing lanes!!! Tyrese did so much!!! I’m been muttering for hours, “Stupid! How Stupid!!” I’m so angry! Ty has yet to soar. And Monte let him fly. Pray I’m wrong. Doubt it.
Frankly Scarlet, I don’t give a damn!
Tomorow at Terra.
says Scarlett to Rhett
Last time I checked, Sabonis isn’t having any impact on winning either.
Ehhhh… no, this definitely better than doing nothing, which would have been very much what you’re describing.
giving up Hali for a guy who is gonna play like a year or 2 at most here? I think I’d rather of done nothing
Or just trade Buddy and company for minor assests or something. Hali should of been untouchable
*deletes 2000-word screed against McNair for doing nothing before the trade deadline*
1) Giving up Hali was never a condition of “doing something” at the trade deadline.
2) I’m a lurker who reads/skims here instead of commenting all the time. I certainly never deleted any of my comments.
Nobody on this stupid team should be untouchable, at this point.
Your first sentence is a point that seems to be overlooked. What are our chances of keeping Sabonis in two years and what will we accomplish with Sabonis these next two years. We could have locked up Haliburton for over 5 years or more.
Immediate reaction –
Pros – Sabonis is pretty damn good.
— no more Buddy schmoozing up the other team after each game.
Cons – losing Haliburton is really difficult to accept, just as a fan.
— We traded our 2 best 3 pt. shooters. That could turn into a Pro, also, if we stop running that shitty high pick and roll / drag offense now.
— I don’t think Lamb is that good.
— Someone already mentioned but Holiday likely won’t be able to play home games.
— Haliburton’s leadership and heart are going to be really difficult to replace. He’s not a Luka level talent, but it feels like missing out on that kind of a guy all over again.
— Dammit.
“We traded our 2 best 3 pt. shooters.”
Tristan Thompson is not a good 3 point shooter!!
In times like this I get to be reminded of and get to really appreciate the kings fans community. The kings may suck balls but y’all are great and in these never ending tough times there is always someone here that can make everyone laugh
I see almost 0 positives besides that, but its a nice little upside.
https://twitter.com/CarmichaelDave/status/1491130669208334337
I certainly hope so.
Without details, this is merely a wish.
Wash your hands!
What, they saw what Portland was doing and said, Hold my beer?
This is always said right before the Kings make it clear that yes, they are done.
Tyrese, we love you and we are sorry to see you go. You will thrive outside of Sacramento. I will be paying a lot more attention to Pacers games going forward. Sabonis, welcome to basketball hell! I’m praying you are the second coming of Chris Webber.
Hali was my favorite King in years, but something had to be done to try to pull this team out of its rut, and I’m here for it. I’m glad they finally made a move.
No criticism from me on the move itself. This is a first step and it doesn’t have to be the last. Right now, this team can’t shoot. A Fox/Davion backcourt isn’t going to work, because as it stands, neither of them can shoot the ball. I think Fox needs to go for a high level two guard who can shoot (McCollum would have been a good replacement, given this deal).
Carmichael Dave says they’re not done. Let’s hope it’s not something bad like Barnes for Jerami Grant, where you’ve literally traded every player on the Kings who can shoot the ball.
But I’m happy to see them take a swing, and I hope the next one doesn’t take two more years.
When sixteen months is twenty-four months.
Otherwise a very sensible take.
Two offseasons and two deadlines is two years in the NBA.
Yeah, I loved Haliburton and wish he could’ve stayed. But he’s unfortunately the best asset the Kings had, and he was always going to be the asset you had to give up for something big.
Several things here. Davion is shooting.34% on 3’s since De’Aaron went out. Not a great number, but not horrible either.
Not shooting the ball but defensively it will work much more effectively than a De’Aaron-Tyrese pairing. But there’s no question if you’re going to pair them both of them need to shoot the ball much better, and I think there’s a possibility with Sabonis around that’s the case. It’s also incumbent for Fox and Mitchell to be better playmakers than they’ve been to this point (although with Davion he’s averaging 4.3 assists to 1.8 TOV”s since De’Aaron’s been out) overall.
There’s a lot of kinks to work out. And if the Kings still plan on trading Barnes and Holmes, now would be the time. Get as much as you can.
The Barnes deal where Patrick Williams and Derrick Jones Jr works. Holmes for PJ Washington and Ish Smith work as well. .
We’ll see. Proof is in dat dere puddin’.
Several things, eh? I count two.
See below.
Shaddup you Gem City moronabus.
Several things here. Davion is shooting.34% on 3’s since De’Aaron went out. Not a great number, but not horrible either. Of course Davion is also 31% on the season overall.
Not shooting the ball but defensively it will work much more effectively than a De’Aaron-Tyrese pairing. But there’s no question if you’re going to pair them both of them need to shoot the ball much better, and I think there’s a possibility with Sabonis around that’s the case. It’s also incumbent for Fox and Mitchell to be better playmakers than they’ve been to this point (although with Davion he’s averaging 4.3 assists to 1.8 TOV”s since De’Aaron’s been out) overall.
There’s a lot of kinks to work out. And if the Kings still plan on trading Barnes and Holmes, now would be the time. Get as much as you can.
The Barnes deal where Patrick Williams and Derrick Jones Jr works. Holmes for PJ Washington and Ish Smith work as well. .
We’ll see. Proof is in dat dere puddin’.
I really like the homes for PJ Washington idea I’ve seen it kicked around on some other sites as well
Barnes for Williams makes sense. Bulls are win now and Williams has been out. Williams brings 3 point shooting and rim defense.
I guess we’ll all have our opinions right now and time will tell but I’ll go on record that this trade will yield a small blip up temporarily and then become progressively worse as time goes on and in two years when Sabonis’ contract comes up in will become a disaster. Lastly don’t think we are getting a franchise player in Sabonis. He’s a solid player, a bit of a stiff athlete and not a great defender.
This feels like a trade a GM makes to keep his job. Improve your roster (marginally) and let’s hope it works.
Being the GM of the Kings must be a lot like having a petulant child hanging over your shoulder screaming “WHY AREN’T THEY GOOD YET? MAKE THEM GOOD FASTER!”
To be fair, this is the first significant move from this front office in two offseasons and two deadlines, and the team hasn’t made the playoffs since 2006. I don’t think people being impatient is out of line.
Impatience, sure! I’d settle for realistic.
“You need to turn terrible assets into great ones, and don’t give a way the store, even though it has almost nothing on the shelves!”
Strawman.
I meant Vivek, not the fan base.
It took me 10 minutes to load the page. Crazy. Hali was the best, I absolutely did not want to see him go. Sabonis is definitely a really really good player. Probably good enough to get us just shy of the playoffs and a worse pick. Whether this trade works out or not…. being a Kings fan sucks. My heart has been jerked around so often the last 15 years. If this works out and the Kings make a crazy run I’ll be there all the way. But if this spirals out of control again, as history suggests it probably will, this might be it for me. I am emotionally exhausted.
So what it next? Holmes has to get moved, right? Kings now need shooters and ball handlers.
PJ Washington and Ish Smith for Richaun Holmes
Harrison Barnes for Derrick Jones Jr and Patrick Williams.
Kings need to figure out roster requirements to make each of these deals work. I could see Ramsey going to Charlotte and Woodard going to Chicago to accomplish that.
I like this trade a lot. I know losing Hali hurts but Sabonis isn’t a slouch. Of course the Kings are going to get killed for this because now, apparently Hali is the greatest player in the NBA and Sabonis sucks, but I think we’ll really like this deal when the dust settles.
Fly away little bird, you’re free.
In terms of talent, this trade may actually favor the Kings. But I’m concerned about fit. Tyrese as a long, intelligent, pass-first guard was they type of dynamic and versatile player I felt we should build our team around in a positionless NBA. Sabonis is definitely a better player, but I’m concerned if he’s viable defensively as a starting 5. If he isn’t, he probably needs to be paired with a defensive stud in the frontcourt but the thing is….he already had that and it wasn’t great. Not sure if this helps create a foundation for the Kings to be better long-term, but it certainly is a shot in the arm for a flailing franchise. Monte has successfully traded for the best player thus far in the trade deadline, that’s not terrible.
Just as a quick aside for salary purposes, but as of now the Kings are at about 102.5 million for 9 players next season. Fox, Sabonis, Barnes, Holmes, Holiday, Mitchell, Harkless, Davis, and Len. That does not include cap holds or roster charges (which likely won’t matter once draft picks get included). That also does not include Metu, Ramsey or Woodard’s deal being guaranteed.
The salary cap is about 119 million next year.
I was really hoping the kings would do nothing, secure a top 5 pick, find a coach that could develop a young team (like Atkinson) and get closer to an actual rebuild but here we are lol I guess I’ll be watching a lot of Pacers games now. Congrats on getting away Hali!!
Can Buddy failed Physical to void Trade? lol
Congrats to Tyrese, you are a good guy. I hope you come back and drop double2 on Vivek’s face
Reminder of why we are “win now”
https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2021/03/waltons-job-appears-safe-finances-play-role.html
“There are a variety of reasons why Walton is expected to hold onto his job, barring a complete second-half collapse. Finances come into play, as Walton is owed a combined $11.5MM in the next two seasons of his four-year guaranteed deal. The franchise has lost approximately $100MM due to the pandemic and there was even an ownership cash call in May, per Amick and Jones.”
An ownership now looking at bottom 5 ticket sales
This is the final straw for me, I don’t like anything about this trade, we lost the only thing worth rooting for in this organization and best hope for future. I really appreciate this site and all the hilarious comments here but I’m officially done caring even 1% about this team or paying any attention to them.
Taking emotion out of the equation, monte got us an all star for a second year player (who may or may not become better than he is), an overpaid garbage shooter and a bench rider. All of this was done without giving up picks!!!! That seems like a pretty good deal to me and to those scratching their head about why not fox? Just remember that it takes 2 teams to complete a trade. Not sure how some people think, “why won’t we just trade Ramsey for Simmons? The 76ers are dumbasses and won’t see it coming!” Well that’s not how the nba works, you can’t trade a shit sandwich for filet mignon. 💩
Was right there with you until you implied that Fox is a shit player.
No it was a general implication. If you read more closely, I was implying more of Ramsey as a shit player, not fox.
I know we’ve been a terrible organization for most of our time in Sacramento, but judging by what I’ve read out there reaction wise, you’d think we traded second year MJ for Larry Nance or something. The average response seems to be Kangz get fleeced! What were they thinking?!?
Like everybody else, I would have preferred not to lose TH, but we got an All Star back and got rid of two players/contracts that aren’t going to be part of our future while also getting back some serviceable parts in return. I think this trade helped both teams.
This!
I’m very sad to lose Hali, my favorite current Kings player, who I love to watch play and admire his commitment to Sactown as well as budding leadership for the team. Higher ceiling than I anticipated, tremendous growth this season. I’m rooting for his success in Indiana, he’s got star potential. But it’s not a given Tyrese becomes an All Star, though I would bet on him getting close at the very least.
As much as it pains me to lose a player with such potential and years of team control over- we are getting back a 25 year old two time All Star for at least 2 more seasons beyond this one. During which time we better be making more moves to become not just a playoff contender but a higher seeded playoff team that’s competing to win.
We got the best player in the trade. I would have loved to see Hali+Sabonis. But hopefully Fox can form good chemistry with him instead, and return to last season’s form/upward trajectory.
Now, what’s the next move? This isn’t the direction (play in/playoffs) that I would have picked for us, but is anyone really that surprised? Rebuild/tank has never truly been the direction, as much as it should have been.
What can Holmes+Bagley+a top 3 protected ’22 FRP+future FRP fetch? I prefer to keep Barnes+Mitchell but they could be included too to get a ‘star’ level player that fits with Fox and Sabonis.
Smaller trades for a Washington or Hart or Covington (or all) would help with the play in goal this year.
But I’m hoping for bigger. We need to if we want a chance at keeping Sabonis beyond 2024. I suppose step one can be play in/playoffs this year with the minor trades. And try for another big swing in the offseason (FA unlikely but maybe another trade).
Currently Grant seems the most available. Haven’t really seen enough of Wood to know if he could fit as a power forward? Would Toronto give up Siakam? 6’8 manning the front court alongside two forwards that are both listed at 6’7. Costly, but I would be willing to go all in at this point.
I’m salivating at the thought of another great player to pair with fox and sabonis. I think monte has to go all in now, clear whoever and whatever you can (including picks) to get another great player. To be honest, fox has never had a really good supporting cast around him so I’m excited to see how this project turns out. Hoping for the best!
What Section said above. Really hate to see him go, but trade is legit.
More has to come.
” I suspect there will be more moves to come, and those will be a big factor in how Monte McNair gets graded when the dust settles”
Why does this sound so fucking familiar
Good trade for the kings. They got a 25 year old, 2 time all star and dumped Hield’s contract. That’s worth giving up Halliburton.
I personally would have rather given them Fox than haliburton, but this front office is hell bent on Fox being their guy.
anyway, people here tend to over value current fan favorites. Sabonis is an all star and a better player than haliburton, period.
Yeah, I don’t understand why they’re allegedly all-in on Fox. Fast, but can really only drive, no outside shot, no FT shooting, no defense. Not exactly the type of player that you focus on. That said, I can only assume that Fox is basically unable to bring anything of value coming back. I’m just hoping he’s still being shopped, though.
Finally able to get on TKH. Damn you all for hogging the bandwidth earlier!
Bummed about loosing Hali, but feeling a little hopeful for getting Sabonis back and seeing how it works. Still strikes me as a “we’re still going for the play-in this season” move. Webber 2.0 moment?
Hooray Kings!!! Monte finally made the huge trade everyone had been begging for. We have a real all star now and got rid of Buddy’s poo poo deal. Things are looking up!! I can’t wait to see the other moves before the deadline.
This trade seems lile a win win for both teams as both teams stand to improve. Sabonis is obviously the best player currently in this trade. However, I feel like Haliburton has the potential to become Indiana’s next Reggie Miller. Sabonis is also like the Kings’ next Webber and he is basically at that level now. Both great passers, rebounders and an arsenal of offensive tools. Basically Webber now for a potential Reggie Miller upside. For that reason, I believe the Kings come out as winners. Plus Sabonis fits the Fox timeline more closely.
Sad to lose Hali. But Monte finally did something, time will tell if it’s the right something but it’s something. There needed to be change and shake up for this team more than almost any team we have seen in the last 10 years.
Side note to my man fox though, you better figure it out and fast. This ownership and front office has cleared the decks for you a few times with coaches and moves and deals to make you the showcase piece. There is no where else to hide now and just watching how sabonis handled his teammates in Indy when they got soft and quit, you better put those man pants on and come to work every day. No more excuses.
Fox has not had any decent supporting pieces around him for the last 5 years. Hoping that changes soon.
Right wrong or otherwise this ownership/front office looks st Fox as a franchise cornerstone. He’s paid like a franchise cornerstone. It’s not his fault he’s been surround by crap since he arrived. But he is going to be accountable and held responsible if he doesn’t elevate his d and learn to play within a TEAM offensive plan. Don’t get me wrong it’s been fun watching him develop his mini Westbrook game but he also hasn’t made anyone better around him or led to more wins on his own. Sabonis has won and has elevated teammates. His d may be lacking but I’ve never seen or heard him accused of not trying on d. I’ve seen fox not give a shit as soon as he doesn’t have the ball in his hands for 5 years
The Kings got a very good player at the cost of a player who could also end up being very good. People are upset, because we all enjoyed Haliburton so much. Not being even a tiny bit ironic here.
But mainly it’s about the same thing that every person wants, has always wanted, and will always want: Having your cake, and eating it, too.
I’ll just say this as a follower from afar: I think some of you are underestimating the contract side of things.
After this season, both Sabonis and Halliburton will be under contract for 2 more years. Both will be pretty young once they hit FA. The big difference is the former will be a UFA while the latter will be a RFA. And for an organization which has traditionally had trouble bringing in and retaining outside talent, I would be very concerned about Sabonis walking in a few years unless things start to look a lot better in short order. If that happens, things will look a lot worse.
Add onto that the complete lack of shooting in the starting lineup and the question marks on defense…unless there are moves made to address that, I don’t like this deal for you guys. Still, it’ll be interesting to see how everything plays out.
Yup, Kings absolutely need to go all in to keep Sabonis around. It’s vital they do it now, even if it involves this years draft pick, which is arguably their best asset at this point.
I would dangle our unprotected first rounder and filler, possibly Barnes for a quality impact player to make a big 3 including Fox and Sabonis. There is no half-assing going all in and that’s exactly what this team needs to do at this point, after a trade like this.
I’m pretty sure that this is the only fanbase in the NBA that would refer to Harrison Barnes as “filler.”
I think there’s a decent chance he goes to Utah, but I’m not sure for who/what. There are a number of guys out on the Jazz that would be great additions, but I imagine that they, like other interested teams, are low-balling the hell out of McNair.
wow, should be great for Tyrese. Finally a great coach for him. Just look at how Rick Carlisle developed some scrubs into decent NBA players in Dallas. I mean, he turned the No 3 pick into an All-Star (kidding, but players like Powell or Brunson or Crowder should be mostly his work). Should do wonders for Tyrese.
Sabonis in order to function and maximize his impact on a team needs the whole gameplay to be focused around him. That’s what Indy tried with serious coaches, MacMillan, Carlile, and failed. They couldn’t manage to hide Sabonis on the defensive end and the impact on offense he offered wasn’t enough. So they part ways. And now Kings have to do the same if they want to succeed. They need to hide on d Sabonis. Unfortunately they will fail soon enough, there is no Turner on Sac stretching the floor and operate as rim protector (Sabonis is nothing of each, Holmes also), there is no Brogdon to navigate the offense and the perimeter defence and above all there is not EVEN a coach to optimize team’s best qualities-there are not even qualities in this team to be accurate. So, this is no card game to evaluate the trade just by reading the numbers of the players involved. If someone is to evaluate this trade should take under consideration all the factors that make a trade and the fit of a player on a specific organization effective. I don’t care if Sabonis is a two times All-Star (this is a silly arguement) the condition of this team along with the characteristics of this particular basketball players make this trade a bad one for the team.
We would do a diferrent conversation if they were to take back Simmons from Philly, giving Tyrese, Buddy and so on. A player with similar flaws with Sabonis (lack of perimeter shooting) but with advanced playmaking skills on offence and defence, and the skill to run the floor. Even id prefer to give up on Fox, this trade would make sense (Fox, Simmons together). But the FO chose otherwise.
If I had to trade for anyone at the moment, it would be Patrick Williams from the Bulls. He offers both 3s and rim protection. Give them Barnes for Williams + large contract filler.
Best of luck to Tyrese. I’m bummed that you were tried to Indy. On the other hand I’m excited about Sabonis coming to the Kings. Color me conflicted. Hoping there are more trades to come.
If you truly are a fan of Hali, you know this is the best thing for him!!!
I’m still processing this trade. On one hand, Hali is a great player that any team would love to have. On this other hand, it’s very possible that he’s in the perfect intersection of youth/performance such that his value right now is the highest it will ever be. It’s easy to see the parallels w/ situations like Jaylen Brown a few years ago and Tyler Herro in 2020, where those players could have been traded for legitimate superstars (Kawhi, Buter, Harden), but teams held onto them and ultimately regretted it. It’s possible that Haliburton will become a superstar, but it’s also possible that next year he’ll be mostly the same player that he has been for the last two years, who is a wonderful player, but not a good as Sabonis. Like many deals, it will take time to know who the real winners are, but as of right now I’m ok with it.
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