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Welcome (back) to Basketball Hell

Things aren't getting better.
By | 98 Comments | Dec 27, 2024

Jan 2, 2020; Sacramento, California, USA; Sacramento Kings majority owner Vivek Ranadive and chief operating officer Matina Kolokotronis react during the second quarter against the Memphis Grizzlies at Golden 1 Center. Mandatory Credit: Kelley L Cox-USA TODAY Sports

Well, folks, it was a good one-year run. 

Eighteen months ago, coming off of an impressive Western Conference run and a heartbreaking loss to the Golden State Warriors in the first round of the playoffs, the Sacramento Kings seemed to be positioning themselves as the next young belle of the basketball ball. They were young, a little brash, and lighting the beam after every win perfectly matched the emerging “why not us” culture at the Golden 1 Center. The Kings were one or two smart trades or draft picks away from emerging to the top of the league. 

Eighteen months was a long, long, long time ago.

On Thursday night, in need of a win amidst a four-game losing streak, and having lost the majority of their games at home, the well-rested Kings took on the lowly (until you realize they had the exact same record as the Kings) Detroit Pistons. Even while missing Domantas Sabonis, the Kings should have viewed the evening as a get-right opportunity, and they seemed to treat it as such for about 40 minutes. Having led by double-digits for most of the game, Sacramento coughed up a win via an atrocious 4th quarter performance, cherry-topped by De’Aaron Fox’s foul that led to Jaden Ivey putting the Kings away with a four-point play. It was a perfect encapsulation of the 2024-2025 season. 

Unfortunately for all involved, things also aren’t going to get magically better in the coming weeks, as Sacramento enters its toughest stretch of the season. Over the next month, they will face the Lakers, Mavericks, Sixers, Grizzlies, Warriors, Heat, Celtics, Bulls, Bucks, Rockets, Wizards, Warriors, Nuggets, and Knicks. More than five or six wins during that stretch would be a minor miracle, and the Kings will likely be far out of the playoff race come the close of January. 

Sure, the season isn’t technically over, and the most purple-colored glasses among the fanbase can share the good news that the Kings are only 3 games out of the play-in, but even if this team shoulders their way through the crowded bottom of the Western Conference, they’re not going anywhere in the play-in tournament or playoffs. They’re too small and too soft, both mentally and physically. Monte McNair assembled a team of nice guys who show up, lose a game, and head home ready for the next one. Not to mention a head coach whose offensive and defensive strategies border the same as those of a college-aged volunteer coach at La Sierra community center. 

Others may point to a roster shakeup as the gleaming hope at the end of this tunnel of atrocious basketball, but I cannot in good conscience share the belief that Jerami Grant or Cam Johnson, or (God forbid) Kyle Kuzma, can come in and fix both this disaster of a roster and a culture. There are too many holes, both offensively and defensively, for one average-level starter to suddenly turn things around, and the Kings have neither the General Manager nor the assets to make more than one solid but unspectacular addition. 

To put it frankly, the 2024-2025 season is over, and the only things Kings fans have to look forward to is running draft simulations on Tankathon, wondering when, not if, Mike Brown and Monte McNair will be fired, and debating whether or not De’Aaron Fox will request a trade, which he probably should for his best basketball interests. 

If Fox does ask out, the chances of Sacramento’s ownership allowing the team to fully rebuild are essentially zero. They will demand a quick turnaround of their (likely) new General Manager and (likely) new coach, who Vivek Ranadive will have hand-selected. Pause and think about the chances of success with that decision-making process. If Fox doesn’t ask out, the Kings won’t have the assets or the management skills to properly build around him, meaning several seasons of mediocrity or worse are coming over the basketball horizon. 

Either way, and whatever details are made clear over the next several months, better days aren’t coming. 

Welcome back to basketball hell.

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Hobby916
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December 27, 2024 9:05 am

comment image

Convoy
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December 27, 2024 9:52 am
Reply to  Hobby916

Hell 2.0

Jman1949
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December 27, 2024 12:14 pm
Reply to  Hobby916

Welcome back
To hell, with no ticket out
Welcome back to the same old Kangz
We’ve all cried about

Well the names have all changed
Since Cuz hung around
But Vivek has remained,
Time to burn it down

Who’d have thought we’d be here
(Who’d have thought we’d be here)
With no way out to flee here
(With no way out to flee here)

Yeah, we’ve suffered a lot
Time to put’em on the spot
Welcome back

Welcome back
Welcome back
Welcome back
Welcome back

BingBong
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December 27, 2024 9:10 am

Definitely not Jerami Grant or Cam Johnson. They each average 4 rebounds a game as power forwards.

TheGrantNapear
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December 27, 2024 10:11 am
Reply to  BingBong

No more sideways moves

Adamsite
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Nostradumbass 14
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Nostradumbass 14
December 27, 2024 10:49 am
Reply to  BingBong

A move like that could potentially sneak the Kings into the play-in (of which they would lose) and could cost them the pick to ATL. They could go into the offseason with no picks and Fox wanting out after missing the playoffs yet again.

Carl
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December 27, 2024 12:19 pm
Reply to  BingBong

And Kuzma is worse than both in every other phase of the game.

ScottyPop
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December 27, 2024 9:12 am

We’re back, baby!

20220208_213302
SierraSpartan
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December 27, 2024 9:37 am

Time to break these back out…

kangs
Inthestarz
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December 27, 2024 9:39 am

“and debating whether or not De’Aaron Fox will request a trade, which he probably should for his best basketball interests.”

no, we are debating when, not if, Fox will be traded for the Kings interests, and how that will affect Brown/McNair’ careers

Last edited 18 days ago by Inthestarz
OLDBHOY
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December 27, 2024 10:59 am
Reply to  Inthestarz

I am SO NOT concerned with Fox’s requests. IMO, he is vastly overrated and a big part of the problem.

Delesandro
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December 27, 2024 11:06 am
Reply to  OLDBHOY

I want to see him handle the press in a large market.

Carl
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December 27, 2024 12:23 pm
Reply to  OLDBHOY

I’m concerned in the sense that Fox is a depreciating asset due to his contract length as of a week ago. The longer you wait, the less you get.

Last edited 18 days ago by Carl
OLDBHOY
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December 27, 2024 12:45 pm
Reply to  Carl

That’s why I brought up trading him at the start of last season. IMO, coming off an All Star, 3rd team All NBA year was his peak value.

I have doubts on how much he will return in trade but I don’t track the league as a whole or individual non-Kings players much.

Delesandro
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December 27, 2024 12:56 pm
Reply to  Carl

True.

His play is driving his value down. His agent is going to force a deal which takes all leverage away from the Kings in a trade scenario.

tom4life2001
December 27, 2024 9:41 am

Do you think Vivek has learned his lesson about taking win-now half-measures that lead to unsustainable mediocrity? Will he look around the league and see Houston, Orlando, and OKC of examples of proper rebuilds? Or is all of this mainly a money and engagement issue? I am hoping he will see the writing on the wall and concede a proper rebuild is in order. Dreams are free too.

TheGrantNapear
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December 27, 2024 10:12 am
Reply to  tom4life2001

Anjali incoming as the GM.

BeTheBall
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December 27, 2024 10:13 am
Reply to  TheGrantNapear

Not sure she could do worse than what we have, honestly.

Adamsite
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Nostradumbass 14
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December 27, 2024 11:43 am
Reply to  TheGrantNapear

I know it’s a joke, but I think there is a nonzero chance of that happening.

RikSmits
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December 27, 2024 11:48 am
Reply to  Adamsite

comment image

TheGrantNapear
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December 27, 2024 11:54 am
Reply to  RikSmits

My thoughts exactly. She’s probably already the AARM.

Carl
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December 27, 2024 12:27 pm
Reply to  Adamsite

Woody Johnson with the Jets (the Vivek of the NFL) has “proven” having your kids make team decisions “works.”

Carl
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December 27, 2024 12:25 pm
Reply to  TheGrantNapear

She would use ChatGPT as the brains of the operation (relabeled “Roy AI”) and aside from occasionally suggesting the Kings trade for Wilt Chamberlain, it might be better than what we have.

macdoogs
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December 27, 2024 1:49 pm
Reply to  Carl

I haven’t really checked out any of the ai stuff outside of early 2k philadelphia, but I do wonder what one of those would say on how to fix the kings lol

Corneroffense
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December 27, 2024 9:50 am

I think I’ve gone from ‘get a real 4’ to ‘blow it up’ in the last 48 hours. Nobody’s taking Sabonis for $40 million, so they keep him. I still like the DeRozan 3 way deals for a 4 using the DeAngelo Russell expiring. Or, if they’re blowing it up, maybe just get Russell and filler straight up and waive him. The hard one is Fox. Who is gonna take Mr Doesn’t Matter? TKH, let’s brainstorm some Fox deals, with an explanation of why the other team would take him.

BeTheBall
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December 27, 2024 10:04 am
Reply to  Corneroffense

Miami has traded for locker room issues in the past, maybe they will again?

Jack
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December 27, 2024 10:11 am
Reply to  Corneroffense

Trade Fox to the Spurs for K. Johnson, Z, Collins, J. Champagnie and 3 firsts.
Trade Huerter Lyles and a first to the Jazz for J. Collins.
Starters: Monk, Derozan, Murray, J Collins and Sabonis.
Backups: Carter, Ellis, K Johnson, Champagnie and Z Collins
You still have the Spurs 3 firsts( used one of ours for J Collins) and the rest of the Kings trade chips.
IMO those first 10 players have a really good chance of winning games.
IMO Monk makes a good point guard. Murray how has an opportunity to shine more. Monk and Sabonis work well together. John Collins is now the big we wanted. Zach Collins is a good backup to Sabonis and we have a better bench than before. All 5 backups can contribute. We now have both offense and defense especially better rebounding.

Jack
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December 27, 2024 10:26 am
Reply to  Jack

Forgot to add C Jones to Fox’s trade package.

OLDBHOY
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December 27, 2024 10:36 am
Reply to  Jack

Do you think Fox will garner that haul or something similar?

I hope so but I have my doubts.

I am not clear on his value league wide and I think I let my own opinion of him (LOW) jade my view on trades.

Delesandro
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December 27, 2024 11:00 am
Reply to  Jack

In spirit this trade is awesome. In reality nobody gives us a player and three first round picks for Fox.

Jack
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December 27, 2024 12:28 pm
Reply to  Delesandro

Sure they do.

Delesandro
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December 27, 2024 12:58 pm
Reply to  Jack

Our opinions differ.

Your willingness to accept the reality of the Kings and change them is something I appreciate.

lazlohollyfeld
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December 27, 2024 12:11 pm
Reply to  Jack

Am I right that the only chance Fox gets a Super Max is making All-NBA AND all the other requirements such as tenure with the team that drafted him? If he’s traded, he can get a big contract but not the Super Max he can get if he stays in Sac. If I have that right, that seems we have some leverage over him. For what that’s worth. Being out of position on Ivey, when everyone knew you only had to stick to your man beyond the arc, and than the unthinkable of fouling Ivey won’t get him many votes for All-NBA. He may have only been the third best guard in that game last night.

TheGrantNapear
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December 27, 2024 10:13 am
Reply to  Corneroffense

4 teams showing interest so far. There’s potential for a bidding war as this trade deadline appears like it will be a dud. Both conferences are wide open as well. Some team will overpay for Fox.

OLDBHOY
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December 27, 2024 10:30 am
Reply to  TheGrantNapear

IMO that is the absolute dream scenario.

My fear is Fox does not have as much value as assumed.

Jack
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December 27, 2024 1:19 pm
Reply to  OLDBHOY

Why would you give that assesment? There are teams out there( 4 now) who want him.

OLDBHOY
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December 27, 2024 1:42 pm
Reply to  Jack

Because I don’t have a high opinion of him as a player. I think he is overrated and have said that here for a long time.

RikSmits
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December 27, 2024 10:33 am
Reply to  TheGrantNapear

According to the rumor mill, 4 teams are showing interest…

Delesandro
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December 27, 2024 11:00 am
Reply to  TheGrantNapear

We need to trade him while he is at peak value.

Jack
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December 27, 2024 1:20 pm
Reply to  Delesandro

Yes.

Carl
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December 27, 2024 12:29 pm
Reply to  TheGrantNapear

Fox has plenty of value. If you’ve got a young team and bunch of assets (Hi Spurs) that’s ready to make a leap, Fox is a guy who can help push you up to the next level.

Jack
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December 27, 2024 1:21 pm
Reply to  Carl

That’s what they are counting on and rightly so.

Jack
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December 27, 2024 1:16 pm
Reply to  TheGrantNapear

IMO it’s the Spurs. Fox would make them contenders. He is an ideal fit with Wemby and they know it that’s why they started with arranging their assets before anyone else.

tom4life2001
December 27, 2024 10:34 am
Reply to  Corneroffense

HOU could have many winning trade combinations. I think the base of the trade would have to be Sheppard, 2-3 picks, salary filler, and one other asset such as Jabari or Whitmore.

If MIA gets some picks for Butler, then they could potentially put a decent deal together.

SAS has our 2031 pick swap and many other picks including ATL next 3 drafts and various salary filler.

LAL would have to do something like Reaves, Russell, and 3 picks. I don’t think it is enough and I doubt the Kings trade Fox to the Lakers.

Another dark horse could be TOR but I doubt Fox would re-sign there.

Delesandro
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December 27, 2024 11:03 am
Reply to  tom4life2001

Imagine Fox in a large market with real media. He does what he did last night and says what he says in the post game interview. Fox has never been crushed in the media. He has no idea what playing for a real basketball team means.

Adamsite
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Nostradumbass 14
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December 27, 2024 11:05 am
Reply to  tom4life2001

I’d imagine if the Houston were to go after Fox they’d want to send out VanVleet in return.

Fox, Lyles, Huerter for VanVleet, Eason, Thompson, and a pick(s)

VanVleet has a TO for next season so the Kings could potenially flip him again by the deadline, cut bait and create cap space this summer, or keep him around for more season of rebuild. Eason, Thompson, and the pick(s) are the real value.

As to Miamai, they’d likely want to ship out Rozier if Fox were coming it.

Fox for Rozier, Vasquez Jr, Jovic and picks would be my guess. Miami would then hang onto Butler and go all in this season with Fox, Butler, Hero and Bam.

tom4life2001
December 27, 2024 11:48 am
Reply to  Adamsite

I doubt HOU puts Eason and Thompson in a deal. Amen is untouchable from what I understand. I could see Jabari before those two but they may need his shooting. I’d be ok with FVV if the Kings traded for him this season and then could decline his team option next year.

I see SAS and HOU topping anything MIA offers unless they flip what they get in a Butler deal to SAC.

TheGrantNapear
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December 27, 2024 11:57 am
Reply to  tom4life2001

Yeah we’re not getting Amen in a deal with HOU for Fox.

I listened to the recent BS and House NBA pod and they spoke highly of Fox and actually don’t think we should trade him. My take away from that is Fox has a lot of value in a trade.

Jack
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December 27, 2024 1:24 pm
Reply to  tom4life2001

Amen might be tradeable if you are looking at Fox.

eddie41
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December 27, 2024 12:58 pm
Reply to  Corneroffense

there’s a good podcast on Game Theory with Sam Vecenie about the Fox situation. plenty of teams are interested in Fox and they talk about his trade value.

They also say if the Kings trade Fox, they would be “blowing it up”. However, I don’t think the team would have to trade everyone, so I don’t think they’d have to “blow it up”.

Klam
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December 27, 2024 9:53 am

new coach, who Vivek Ranadive will have hand-selected

Mark Jackson hiring incoming.

BeTheBall
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December 27, 2024 10:01 am

We never actually left.

RikSmits
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December 27, 2024 10:05 am

Sure, the season isn’t technically over, and the most purple-colored glasses among the fanbase can share the good news that the Kings are only 3 games out of the play-in

They are 3 games out of the play-in, but only 2.5 games out of the 13th spot in the West.

At this point, with a more or less healthy Philly slowly gaining ground (7-3 over their last 10), I think the only teams clearly worse than Sacramento are:

  • Washington (tanking)
  • NO (decimated by injuries)
  • Utah (tanking)
  • Toronto (what are they doing?)
  • Charlotte (what are they doing?)

I wouldn’t be surprised if Portland (what are they doing?) suddenly clicks and overtakes us.

It’s pitiful. Tow top “clutch”players and hgoing 3-11 in games decided by 5 or less.

One of the best arena’s and home crowds and such a home record? Disgusting.

Can’t overcome a huge deficit, can’t protect a big lead.

Serenity now.

TheGrantNapear
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December 27, 2024 10:15 am
Reply to  RikSmits

Perfect year to tank.
Trade Fox and sit Domas towards the end of the season. Mr. Flagg would solve a lot of our problems.

tom4life2001
December 27, 2024 10:35 am
Reply to  TheGrantNapear

Flagg would also give the team cover to do a proper rebuild. Getting the “Maine Event” would be such a huge boost the organization.

TheGrantNapear
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December 27, 2024 11:58 am
Reply to  tom4life2001

And you could then decide over the summer whether to completely start over with the young guys and trade Domas and MM etc.
Flexibility moving forward is key and trading Fox now is the key to that imo.

tom4life2001
December 27, 2024 12:58 pm
Reply to  TheGrantNapear

I think they wait until the offseason, but I hope Fox asks for a trade now so they can try to maximize his trade value and extract as many assets as possible. Outside of Fox asking for a trade, I think they wait until they know for sure Fox won’t be making All-NBA. Fox’s saving grace could be too many stars not qualifying due to # of games played qualifier which in my mind, is the worst case scenario for the Kings.

Carl
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December 27, 2024 12:49 pm
Reply to  RikSmits

NO (decimated by injuries)

And a healthy Pelicans team beats the Kings 19 times out of 20.

Last edited 18 days ago by Carl
TheGrantNapear
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December 27, 2024 10:10 am

I’ve been saying it for a while now, Fox and his tenure are akin to Cousins’ tenure.
Fox’ Sac career is Cuz 2.0. Glad to see many are starting to share this conclusion.

MM and Vivek need to trade Fox now whilst his value is high, pre-trade deadline. BSPN reporting that the suitors are SAS, MIA, HoU and LAL. Commence a bidding war.

Post Fox trade I prefer blowin it up but I know Vivek won’t go that route. So, trade DDR as well and see what you can build around Domas, DC, MM, KM and the assets from a Fox trade.

The upcoming draft is loaded, gaining an extra first that has potential to be top ten along with our own pick is crucial.

Just my 2 cents.

BeTheBall
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December 27, 2024 10:12 am
Reply to  TheGrantNapear

Do you really trust McNair to make a decent trade? I’d rather bring in a new GM and let him give it a go, instead of letting Monte get fleeced in yet another deal.

TheGrantNapear
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December 27, 2024 12:01 pm
Reply to  BeTheBall

I don’t trust MM.
But MM isn’t getting terminated mid season for one. And a Fox trade is pretty straight forward as the precedent for what a return should look like is there from recent trades of all star caliber players.

It’s a combo of firsts and young players, if no team is willing to make a fair offer a long those lines, you don’t trade him.

Carl
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December 27, 2024 12:58 pm
Reply to  BeTheBall

Do you really trust McNair to make a decent trade?

I don’t trust McNair to actually do anything. But there have also been a *lot* of personnel failures, now that I think about it. I do think @TheGrantNapear below has it right that there is an established template for this sort of deal that shouldn’t be hard to follow.

Last edited 18 days ago by Carl
delusionsofmediocrity
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December 27, 2024 10:40 am

Plumb the depths, the depths of hell.

Delesandro
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December 27, 2024 10:55 am

I do not understand how one can honestly think Fox is staying or should stay here. He has laid out his conditions for leaving many times. The criteria for his departure that he has clearly stated publicly has been met. The Kings smartest move is to get something for Fox in return to have some basic type of future for this team.

Any talk of Fox staying makes no sense.

Last edited 18 days ago by Delesandro
Adamsite
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December 27, 2024 11:30 am
Reply to  Delesandro

I think it could make sense of Monte could correct a wrong by moving DDR for real length of a 3 and D player. Your guess is as good as mine of who that may be.

RikSmits
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December 27, 2024 12:10 pm
Reply to  Adamsite

Seriously, how can that correct what is happening here?

The current number 6 seed has a .567 record. Apply that to 82 games and that is a 46-38 record (rounded down). To reach 46 wins, the Kings have to go 33-18 the rest of the season. That’s a .647 record.

I know that people point at the Maverick’s midseason trade last year; but they traded a middling player and got two good players in return. They also have two high BBIQ main players and a coach that the players actually seem to listen to.

I have such a hard time seeing things getting better, especially after last night. You think that Fox will respond well to that shit show and the explicit (and rightful) calling out by Brown?

My guess is that Fox and Monk are big block of the locker room and nice guys like Domas and Keegan have not enough gravitas to keep it thogether. Coach seems to be losing the locker room.

With the next 5 tough games coming up, this has the potential to turn into an utter clusterfuck really fast.

Last edited 18 days ago by RikSmits
Delesandro
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December 27, 2024 12:22 pm
Reply to  Adamsite

We still have Fox. I don’t see him as the leader and the franchise player he and his agent say he is. Lock Fox in on a super max and this team is screwed for another decade.

Jack
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December 27, 2024 12:35 pm
Reply to  Adamsite

Maybe Cam Johnson. Nets might be able to flip Derosan a little better than Johnson.

BingBong
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December 27, 2024 12:15 pm
Reply to  Delesandro

If they keep Fox, they would need to trade for someone else to be the actual leader and backbone of the team. Then again, Fox would also have to accept when that player gets on his ass, and I’m not sure he would.

Delesandro
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December 27, 2024 12:24 pm
Reply to  BingBong

In a fantasy world we get Jimmy Butler and Fox gets slapped on the court in the middle of the fourth quarter.

discocricket
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December 27, 2024 11:03 am

I will operate under the assumption that a Fox trade is now in the best interests of both player and organization. We don’t know if he’s already asked out.

If Fox goes, there’s no reason to keep DDR.

Sabonis is probably worth less around the league than we might think. Given his age and contract, he might just be the veteran leading this team for the next 3-4 seasons.

Monk could start at PG, but given his age and contract, he would be a valuable trade piece. He might want out anyway if Fox is heading out.

Huerter is salary ballast and will cost us something to get off of.

I’d like to give Keegan a bunch more usage and see if we can make a 20PPG scorer out of him.

Probably the best we can do for now is reboot the front office with a hungry, active, analytically advanced up-and-comer who is okay with keeping Mike Brown. This hire makes all the above trades, not Monte. Monte needs to be the fall guy in Vivek’s mind.

I’d keep Keegan and Devin Carter (and would move both in the right deal). Everything else is available. Time to start over.

It would be nice if we could drive a stake in the heart of “patience”, “shooting above all else”, “size and athleticism don’t matter”, “draft NBA-ready guys”, and other counterproductive tropes of the Monte era.

oshima9
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December 27, 2024 11:37 am

Fox, Monk and DeRozan should be first ones out the door. I’d trade Sabonis to a contender as a favor to him so that he can escape if the return is a good one. He’s worked hard here and deserves better than what is to come. Some team might like Lyles as a player off the bench.

Ellis, Carter and Murray are the pieces that should be kept. Huerter is a millstone. I wouldn’t trade him if it costs a pick to move him.

I’d keep Brown through a rebuild. He would have more power to implement his vision without having to deal with Fox and trying to preserve Huerter’s trade value.

TheGrantNapear
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December 27, 2024 12:06 pm
Reply to  oshima9

I’d trade Sabonis to a contender as a favor to him so that he can escape if the return is a good one.

This is the conundrum with trading Sabonis. I don’t know how much value he has, especially on his contract that MM gifted him not long ago. Based off articles I read and nba pods I listen to, most don’t think very highly of Domas.
I mean, name one contender that makes sense for a Domas trade? I can’t think of any. Weirdly maybe the Spurs if they saw him as a good fit next to Wemby, I don’t know.
Fox and Domas to SAS for a crap ton of
picks and young players would be wild.

macdoogs
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December 27, 2024 2:06 pm
Reply to  TheGrantNapear

Domas and Wemby might actually be an amazing duo if you think about it. Wemby might be a more natural power forward as crazy as his size makes it seem but with his handle and shot making he wouldnt need to always be in the post banging around with Domas down low or on the elbow doing the dirty work.

I’d actually love to see that more than fox and wemby as a fan of good basketball

Jack
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December 27, 2024 12:38 pm
Reply to  oshima9

I would trade Huerter Lyles and a pick for John Collins. Net one of what we need.

UpgradedToQuestionable
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December 27, 2024 12:11 pm

I will repeat what I opined in the last thread, more or less.

The losing is awful, and the 4 point play in the closing seconds is embarrassing. The first 5 game losing streak in the Mike Brown era.

Set the whole team ablaze is, IMO, not the way to go. For the coaching and GM – absolutely not. We’ve seen this before in the Michael Malone -> Ty Corbin -> George Karl version engineered by Vivek and Pete D’Alessandro. It was cringeworthy.

Ride out the season with the GM, Head Coach and Core players (Sabonis, Fox, Monk, DeRozan, Keegan, Keon, Devin Carter). Keep your draft capital intact or increase it with trades. Play your rookie.

Blow it Up is unattractive to me. The thought of repeating this whole process after the middling success of the last two seasons is distasteful as someone who is a ticket holder.
My memory of what was the last number of seasons prior to Mike Brown and what we have today make we abhor the thought of going through all of that again. And I have little doubt that is how it will play out if this current team is burnt to the ground and we are asked to start anew. This phoenix would remain encrusted in ashes and not fly.

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December 27, 2024 12:15 pm

Okay, so let me repeat my question to this post from the other thread:

I understand and respect that as a season ticket holder, you have vested interest in seeing an exciting, good team.

We can have an argument about what we see as an exciting, decent team but that is largely subjective and my view on that isn’t “better” than yours.

We can also have an argument about giving up assets for win-now players and how bad that is. Also subjective and very dfficult to assess without knowing specifics.

But my main question is that if you want to “to ride it out”, you are prepared to lose Fox for nothing? How attractive is that? Because that is a viable risk. Or am I understanding this wrong?

Kingofkings2410
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December 27, 2024 1:14 pm
Reply to  RikSmits

I posed the similar question to upgraded in the other post as well. Not confrontational but just curious to his idea(s)?
”ride it out” seems really counterproductive… kangz

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December 27, 2024 2:16 pm
Reply to  RikSmits

Ride it out is in reference to the present 2024-2025 season. That exception being that should a player ask out of the franchise: and to be clear – that would be the player publicly announcing that desire (a la Jimmy Butler, just last week) not what someone claims he insinuated. I would be shocked, not just surprised, if that were the case with De’Aaron Fox, who has been nothing short of wonderful in his time in Sacramento in regards to his public persona. A superb ambassador for the city and franchise, along with his darling wife and children. A consummate professional. This is, to me, noteworthy.

As for the timing of Fox leaving the Kings, via free agency or trade – of course it could happen, as he is a bright and capable adult. As for him just leaving? I can’t pretend to understand any one individual, however, that would be a marked departure from the De’Aaron Fox we’ve seen. He spends his Summers with coaching staff (Luke Loucks) even for his honeymoon, he mentors Keegan, he has influenced his close Wildcat buddy, Malik Monk, to sign and stay for less than market value. He is starting to see his name in the Sacramento era record books, and the franchise records (60 point game, 109 point two game). He has improved his game (most?) every season.

Most of all, De’Aaron Fox (who has already earned $150M U.S. dollars with the Kings) is signed through next season (2025-2026). This talk about trading him tomorrow before he walks away is a dust storm of fan manufacture, IMO.

Ride it out because as disappointing as this season has been, hobbling the chances of producing an upward climb by firing and trading and the like seems panicky and rudderless in this mid-season – the same attributes we assigned to this organization under Pete D’Alessandro and Vlade Divac. The carousel of coaches. The roulette of a roster.
Stay the course, ride it out, wait it out, however you prefer to phrase it. April 2025 will be here soon enough. If a handsome trade arrives now through the trade deadline – yes yes – but leave the Core intact.

And lastly – RikSmits; as to your mentioning respectful tones – they are appreciated but unnecessary; your history and community legacy speak for themselves. You have always been respectful and adamant on the freedom of fandom to all. It is I who bow in respect to you (and others on this site) to share your thoughts, even though we may disagree (an echo chamber would be nightmarish and boring) on many directions and strategies.

RikSmits
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December 27, 2024 7:41 pm

Thanks for the kind words my man. I often am a bit brash, I know.

Appreciate you (and the whole TKH community)!

Delesandro
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December 27, 2024 1:03 pm

I keep seeing Carter mentioned as a core player. I do not understand that.

Can you explain why you see Carter as a core player?

Interested in hearing what people hope he can be.

oshima9
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December 27, 2024 1:10 pm
Reply to  Delesandro

unknown talent on a rookie scale contract, he could be a rotation player or even a starter

RikSmits
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December 27, 2024 1:39 pm
Reply to  oshima9

He missed too many games to be considered All-NBA, right?

Delesandro
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December 27, 2024 1:53 pm
Reply to  oshima9

So he is an unknown that is cheap. Not a core player. In my mind a core player is a part of the team that can built around and needed to win.

BingBong
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December 27, 2024 12:34 pm

Off on a tangent, anybody else notice NBC Sports Bay Area treats the Kings like an unwanted stepchild? 7 Warriors articles a day, and sometimes the Kings can’t even get a game recap. No editorials or real insight pieces. And not just this season, but even the 22-23 glory days.

Last edited 18 days ago by BingBong
RikSmits
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December 27, 2024 12:37 pm
Reply to  BingBong

FIFY:
even the 22-23 vainglory days.

BingBong
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December 27, 2024 12:42 pm
Reply to  RikSmits

I mean, I’m treating them like an unwanted stepchild right now too, but that’s beside the point.

Delesandro
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December 27, 2024 1:04 pm
Reply to  BingBong

What would they say about them?

RikSmits
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December 27, 2024 12:45 pm

How is your #NBA team on this list?!?!

DFitch ???????????????????????????????? (@kingfitch1990.bsky.social) 2024-12-27T19:29:24.577Z

everything is fine.

jlandweh
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December 27, 2024 1:03 pm

To me, obviously Sabonis and Fox don’t work together. We need to find an answer. Neither are the best players on a winning team…but maybe Fox can be a winning player as a #2. I would prefer to trade to Sabonis because he’s harder to build around.

How’s this sound?

Sabonis and Lyles to Miami for Butler, Ware, and maybe a pick or 2.

Huerter and McLaughlin (and maybe a later pick) for Capela.

Gives us a chance to improve our defense.

Hippity_Hop_Barbershop
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December 27, 2024 1:28 pm

Trade Fox now while the market is hot. His press conference last night was basically putting in two weeks’ notice.

Klam
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December 27, 2024 1:33 pm

I wonder if you’d potentially get more for Fox closer to the trade deadline since teams might become desperate at that point? Although the only thing you’d need to make sure of is Fox not getting hurt.

Hobby916
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December 27, 2024 1:47 pm
Reply to  Widowwolf

And the first domino falls.

Mike120
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December 27, 2024 1:50 pm

My son is telling me Shams reporting Mike Brown was fired.

Corneroffense
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December 27, 2024 2:35 pm

Glad to see the comments going mostly ‘blow it up’. Lots of intriguing ideas. Hope they don’t actually think Interim HC (guessing) Pizza Guy Emeritus Doug Christie is the only move they have to make. Let’s knock over some dominoes! Let’s get Fox’s wife that low tax rate!

I was concerned about a Van Vleet/Fox deal but Fred’s team option for next year takes care of it. Get some picks Monte! Anything more is gravy. Wonder whether Ime Udoka’s ‘gritty’ team image makes a difference when they’re considering Fox. Miami is one that would seriously consider Fox’s big contract, and I’d love to hear about Butler cussing him out after a game. HEAT Culture! The problem is, who wants Terry Rozier, Herro (aka better Huerter), or Duncan Robinson? Gotta find a third party. The Spurs? Well, they already have a real team leader, so that’s compatible with Fox’s apathy. They already have a real point guard too. Vassell, Sochan and picks would do it for me. Better yet, Castle, Sochan and Collins. Castle looks good and I think Sochan is the next Aaron Gordon. I still have a hard time thinking they’d want Fox’s ego. Let’s find out!

bangbangplay
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December 28, 2024 2:54 am

Basketball Hell never left and will never leave as long as Vivek is here. It was just covered up by the Beam Team season.

Nathanssj
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December 28, 2024 9:47 am

I understand the thought of firing McNair, but I think overall he’s done a good job. Everyone wants a wing which I get, but the cost of a wing is extremely high as they are the most valuable commodities. Case in point is bridges. Not a guy you build your team around, at best 3rd maybe 4th best player on a true championship contender and he cost, off the top of my head, 4 draft picks. McNair came into the job extremely behind the 8 ball. Was told to build a contender with very few assets in general and having to recover the mess divac created. It’s hard/impossible to be flexible with what he was given. The correct move would’ve been to bottom out and collect assets (okc,houston, today Washington and Brooklyn). He was forced to build a team though. Knowing that he made a lot of little moves and drafted overall pretty well that led to sabonis. No gm is 100% in the draft and I would’ve taken knecht, but his draft record is pretty good overall. When everyone goes to getting a wing I never hear any names other than grant, Collins and kuzma who just don’t move the needle. The only way out of this with the new cba and tax aprons for a small market team is truly to bottom out and get assets. I had season tix for a decade in sac and now live in okc and I’m telling you seeing the patience and vision to be a contender here is the model to follow. The kings have made short sided long term moves the last 3 years to get to mediocreville. 2022-23 was an aberration and it was easy to see around the league with all the injuries around the league. I felt that might’ve been the ceiling then and it’s proven to be right. The playoff drought is over, so there really is no reason to keep riding this out. I think, with a proper rebuild, McNair has shown me enough to build a contender with actual real assets when I think it’s a miracle he built this with mostly having to manufacture assets from the very little he has had to work with his whole tenure.

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