fbpx
The Kings Herald

Independent Sacramento Kings Coverage. By Fans, For Fans. | Support Us On Patreon

Chainmail: Talkin’ next season, contracts, and much, much more!

You asked, we answered!
By | 56 Comments | Apr 13, 2022

Welcome to the last Chainmail of the 2022 NBA season! We had some great questions this week, so let’s dive right in, shall we?

From Klam:

Given the reports of Frank Vogel and the Lakers parting ways at the end of the season, how would you feel if the Kings hired him as the new head coach?

Tim: I’m going to steal Tony’s standard for any Kings decision and ask “Would a normal organization do this thing?”, and in this case, I think it would be an NBA-normal thing. He’s not my absolute favorite candidate, but if Monte decided to make the hire, I wouldn’t be too critical either. Vogel has found some success in some areas and failed in others, but he’s absolutely qualified to take the job, something that hasn’t always been said about some of our former coaches.

Will: I could absolutely understand why the Kings would hire Frank Vogel as the next head coach of the Sacramento Kings. Would he be my first, or third, choice? No. But I could also see ownership and management looking at seven of his eleven years of coaching resulting in a playoff run and handwaving the Orlando stint as a bad fit. I think it’s pretty clear that Frank Vogel is an NBA caliber head coach, what I’m not clear of is how much “Frank Vogel, Kings Coach” moves the needle in Sacramento. He’s neither an offensive nor defensive genius, he doesn’t seem to be a culture setter or a development whiz, he’s simply a decent, well rounded head coach. Which is NOT a bad thing, it just isn’t enough for the quagmire and conundrum that the Kings have set themselves up for right now. They need more than Vogel can, in my opinion, give.

From RobHessing:

Given that Fox and Hali were rarely as effective with each other as they were independent of each other, how do you see the fit between Fox and Davion unfolding?

Tim: I don’t think either one will ever be as comfortable together as they would be separately. Davion Mitchell is a point guard. De’Aaron Fox is a point guard. They both need the ball in their hands to be as effective as they would like. That doesn’t mean that one absolutely has to go, but it turns out, drafting two point guards when your best player is a point guard creates some issues down the line.

Will: Yeah, I agree here with Tim. I think there’s precedent elsewhere in the league that it COULD work, and obviously the dual point guards thing is something that seems to intrigued the McNair front office… but I’ll be most curious to see how Fox reacts to it next season. Obviously there’s a different in the two point guard pairings, Davion being able to pick up the main ball handler on defense is something that Hali just plain couldn’t, but if Fox starts the season slow, or pouting, it wouldn’t surprise me to see the pairing be parted in much the same way that Fox-Hali were, with Fox being the odd man out. If McNair truly believes in Davion at point, and Fox scales back production again as a 1.5, the next playoff push might be with Mitchell-Sabonis and whatever wings Monte can get for De’Aaron.

From MichaelMack:

If the Jazz called and said they want a trade of Fox, Holmes, and the 2022 first round pick (top-4 protected) for Donovan and O’Neal, would you do this?

Tim: I would absolutely do that, as I think Mitchell is on another tier than Fox, and Mitchell-Sabonis would be an awfully fun pairing. While Mitchell isn’t exactly a sniper from the outside, his three-point shooting is significantly better than Fox’s, and he’s shown himself to be the consistent “go-to” guy that Fox still only shows on occasion. I’m sold.

Will: One of those guys has been the #1 option on a playoff team multiple season… and the Kings can acquire him for Holmes a single first rounder and a talented, imperfect point guard with their replacement waiting in the wings? I’d be sad to see Fox’s tenure end, but excited to see that Mitchell-squared backcourt of the future. I see it as more likely that Rudy Gobert gets bounced down the road, with the Kings offering Barnes, Holmes and a few firsts, but that’s another question entirely.

From KingsGuru21:

A big positive from Domas’ first game to his last in a Kings uniform was that the Kings ranked 5th in DRB% during that time as a team. Do you think this could be duplicated over the course of an entire season?

Tim: Yes, I think they can. Domantas Sabonis is a top-5 rebounder in the NBA, and his ability to conquer almost any other starting center on the boards also allows Sacramento’s guards and forwards to swoop in and snag rebounds on both ends of the floor. I would be a little surprised if they didn’t rank toward the top of the league next season, especially if Monte can find a real starting power forward this summer.

Will: I cannot for the life of me see why not. The Kings don’t really have another big on the roster that’s close to matching rebounding acumen… it wouldn’t surprise me at all if Domas is in the top two in rebounding and leads the league in offensive rebounds with a full season of Kangz basketball under his belt. Heck, just knowing he’s the biggest trade acquisition since C-Webb, I’d assume the Kings would gameplan around Domas’ rebounding just to make sure he’s well-fed during the ensuing wins-famine.

From GregoryI

What kind of head coach does this team/organization need?

Tim: The Kings need a coach that will get these guys to buy into his plan. They haven’t had that since Mike Malone. Dave Joerger was a smart coach, but there was a reason he wasn’t retained after his 39-win season: several of the players were no longer following his lead. Luke Walton was a friend of the locker room, but his strategies were poor and the team had a severe lack of accountability. This team needs some weird combination of those two gentleman.

Frankly, if this new coach can’t get De’Aaron Fox to buy into some sort of defensive scheme, the season is probably lost. They need someone who will come in and kick some ass while maintaining the respect of the roster. They need someone who can put together a modern, comprehensible, and effective defensive scheme. They need someone who can maximize two offensive players who can’t shoot from the outside. Whoever checks the largest majority of those boxes should be hired.

Will: I was recently on The SportsEthos podcast with Jill Adge where we talked specifically about my darkhorse favorite coaching candidate, Brian Keefe and we talked about what Kings fans assume or want in their next Kings coach. I laid out a few things: we need a coach that understands modern NBA defenses, a coach that players respect but who also isn’t soft on them, a coach that can develop talent and (this ties in a bit with #2) a coach that can set a culture, specifically of accountability. I think the closer you can get to a coach or full coaching staff that does all four, the closer the Kings are to having a playoff team in the near future. There’s a good deal of that have two or three of those and far less are the unicorns that have four but I think that’s what you’re looking for in your head coach and by extension his staff.

Joerger understood the modern NBA but he rubbed players the wrong way, Luke couldn’t understand his way out of a paper bag but players liked him – neither set a culture and each had some middling success in development in their own rights. Guys like Kenny Atkinson, Brian Keefe, Charles Lee and others are in the mold of what I’m looking for but I’d be thrilled with plenty of others. Get a head guy that has as many of those characteristics as possible, fill out the bench with those who fill in the gaps, toss Doug Christie in to get more seasoning if you really need a Vivek guy in there and then let the staff cook.

From 1951:

If the Kings fail to make the postseason next year, what is your estimate of when the drought ends?

Tim: It’s going to be quite a while. If the Kings miss the playoffs next year (which I expect them to), Monte McNair is probably escorted off of the premises with extreme prejudice. At that point, a new GM is going to want to follow his own path, and De’Aaron Fox will be in his sixth year having not led his team to the playoffs (not that it would be all his fault). My guess is that in the 2023 offseason, the Kings would deal at least one, and probably both of, Domantas Sabonis and De’Aaron Fox to start another rebuild. The only silver lining is that if Vivek Ranadive manages to hire his first good GM in four tries, returning to the playoffs isn’t actually that hard for a high-functioning organization. We’re looking at 18-20 years.

Will: I think it’ll be two years from now or seven years from now, with very little wiggle room on the latter prediction. McNair’s level of aggressive patience requires doing a lot of work in a very small window of time – waiting like a trapdoor spider for the right deal to finally come along then seizing that singular moment and wrestling like crazy to finally be fed. We’re witnessing the wrestling now and I don’t see what he’s caught (or can catch even) to be enough to make it to where he wants the Kings to be. The Kings would have to: nail the coaching hire, nail the draft, nail free agency and any trades that come along, have a fantastic training camp and come out swinging in order to make it into the Top-8 seeds next year and it’s something that is just unprecedented up to this point in the non-Adelman years of Sacramento basketball.

Obviously, everything is impossible until it is done, but I’m not holding my breath on the Kings pitching a perfect game from now until October. What I CAN see happening is: Kings get a good head coach, have a good draft, sign and trade for some pieces that improve the depth of the team. The hover around .450 and make the play-in but lose. Vivek holds off of firing Monte because of the signal it sends to Sabonis with one year left on his contract, so he gives Monte another off-season, they draft well, trade/sign some more deck chairs to be rearranged and THAT is enough the following year to squeak into the playoff picture. Two good off-seasons instead of one furious one.

Now, it that doesn’t happen? Monte is gone, Fox wants out, Domas is a free agent and leaves, Davion Mitchell becomes the tank commander and the Kings enter into the cycle all over again, taking 5 years, different ownership and a dying generation of fans willing them into the playoffs in 2027.

From Yakshi:

As a player, what is Donte DiVincenzo’s actual dollar value for the Kings next season?

Tim: Ugh, I really struggle with Donte DiVincenzo. He’s clearly a McNair favorite, so I hold no doubt that the Kings will do everything reasonable within their power to keep him. And yet, in all reality, he’s a fine backup guard whose production is pretty replaceable by a dozen other guys in the league, and he’s also reportedly unhappy with the front office (side note: how many players have shown unhappiness with the front office two years into Monte’s career?). I would be comfortable paying him $7 – $9 million per year on a three year deal. Anything significantly higher than that, and I’m letting him walk.

Will: Donte’s dollar value in Sacramento has to be somewhere around the MLE, projected to be at basically the $10 million mark. I know there are reports he’s unhappy with the Kings for not starting him and I’m sure there’s some sort of teeth to the idea that the Kings want to sign him for cheaper than he thinks he’s worth but… that’s the business of basketball baby. Much like Richaun Holmes last off-season, the less happy DiVincenzo is with his contract, the more thrilled I am to have him back next year. If it’s $10 mil? Hey ok. If it’s $7 mil, HEY OKAAAY! His recent injuries are what they are and a 3 year, $24-27 million dollar deal should be right there in the sweet spot for both sides of the drama.

Patreon Membership
* indicates required


To prevent spam, our system flags comments that include too many hyperlinks. If you would like to share a comment with multiple links, make sure you email editorial@kingsherald.com for it to be approved.

56 Comments
Oldest
Newest Most Voted
Inline Feedbacks
View all comments
AmateurNerd
Vote Up
Original Member
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Comments
April 13, 2022 12:02 pm

Donte would be a great 7th man on the Kings’ 2022-23 playoff team! Unfortunately, this means he will be a mediocre starting SG on the Kings’ 2022-23 play-in-loser team.

Last edited 2 years ago by AmateurNerd
Gojira2021
Comments
Comments
April 13, 2022 12:24 pm

I can see why Vivek could care less about putting a winning product on the floor. Vivek purchased the franchise for $534mil back in 2013 and now 9 woeful years later the value of the franchise has risen to $2billion. Vivek doesn’t have any incentive to improve because he’s raking in the profits regardless (win or lose). The Kings are basically just his little toy and he’ll probably continue to meddle and screw things up.

Kosta
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
April 13, 2022 1:13 pm
Reply to  Gojira2021

Shame, maybe?

I would hope his ego pushes him to …let go of his ego (gulp).

But it’s gotta hurt a little bit to have his name tied to this franchise’s reputation, no?

Don’t take my word for it, though. Hell, I’d eat sweet potato fries (ew, gross!) if you gave me a billion dollars.

I’d even wear a gold lame Kings jersey (ducks, runs from Will!) for that kind of money.

andy_sims
Vote Up
Comments
Original Member
Patreon Supporter
Vote Up
Comments
Original Member
Patreon Supporter
April 13, 2022 2:32 pm
Reply to  Gojira2021

This makes a lot of sense, because if there’s one thing you can say about self-made billionaires, is that they aren’t the competitive, striving types.

There is a strong disconnect, I’d guess largely due to having broke-ass owners like the Maloofs, but if you are dependent on your pro franchise to make money, you aren’t wealthy enough to own one. This is not an issue for Ranadive. Everyone would prefer to make money rather than lose it, but pro franchise ownership is mainly about vanity, and less about cargo containers full of cash.

There are a lot of reasons for the Kings lack of success that tie directly to Ranadive, but an unwillingness to spend isn’t among them. It certainly wasn’t applicable to Bobo, as my understanding is that he was one of Ranadive’s favorites. McNair attempted to get a return for him with Milwaukee, but the reptilian agent reneged on it. At that point, you have to decide whether to overpay a gimpy player who hasn’t started half the games he’s played in the NBA, and who, approaching thirty, shot two-hundreths of a point better than Buddy Hield from distance this season. I maintain that not doing so was the best option, likely over Ranadive’s objections, and expect that to be borne out going forward as Kevin Huerter makes Bobo redundant, and a cap liability.

I’d also note that Tim has become rather a caricature of himself on the topic of Monte McNair. If he ever had any objectivity, it is long gone. It continues to undermine the overwhelmingly fantastic writing at KH.

Carl
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
April 14, 2022 8:52 am
Reply to  andy_sims

but an unwillingness to spend isn’t among them.

I don’t have the numbers easily available, but have the Kings operated over the cap at all since Vivek took over? I believe the answer is ‘no,’ but someone tell if I’m wrong.

Last edited 2 years ago by Carl
RobHessing
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Author
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Author
April 14, 2022 9:03 am
Reply to  Carl

They’re over the cap right now, I think.

RobHessing
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Author
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Author
April 14, 2022 9:06 am
Reply to  RobHessing

It’s all relative. They are $15-17m over the cap right now, below the tax. That places them at roughly 18th in the league in player payroll.

Carl
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
April 14, 2022 12:44 pm
Reply to  RobHessing

Thanks for the correction, guys.

Adamsite
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Nostradumbass 14
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Nostradumbass 14
April 14, 2022 9:06 am
Reply to  Carl

Over the cap, yes, but into the tax, no. They are over the cap this year at $127M. Cap is at $112 and tax line is at $136M

There aren’t too many teams that make the playoffs that aren’t spending into the tax level. You have to pay to play in the postseason in this league. The top 8 contenders are at or over the tax this year: Warriors, Clippers, Nets, Bucks, Lakers (Ha!) Jazz, 76ers, Nuggets.

RobHessing
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Author
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Author
April 14, 2022 9:08 am
Reply to  Adamsite

Sportrac has their total cap at just under $134m. That’s good for 21st in the league, between Atlanta and Houston.

Adamsite
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Nostradumbass 14
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Nostradumbass 14
April 14, 2022 9:15 am
Reply to  RobHessing

Sportrac also adds old cap holds (Guy and Brewer) to the full cap, but I’m not sure those count against the tax. the taxable salary must be somewhere between $127 and $134M. Either way, they are below the tax.

sonny
Vote Up
Comments
Vote Up
Comments
April 13, 2022 2:48 pm
Reply to  Gojira2021

He didn’t buy the team for 534M by himself. There are other minority owners.
Which leads me to this question:
If that is Vivek’s mindset – not worrying about the product but the value/profit – don’t you think that that’s what the minority owners are also thinking? Damn the team, we’ve quadrupled our investment!

I think this can also be the possible reason why there isn’t any coup attempt to take the controlling power from Vivek

Putthegundown
Comments
Vote Up
Comments
Vote Up
April 13, 2022 3:43 pm
Reply to  Gojira2021

The sad thing is that the NBA is perfectly fine with the Kings having one of the worst owners in the league. They aren’t getting any of my money so F him and his garbage franchise.

Roaddog
Original Member
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Comments
Vote Up
April 13, 2022 11:57 pm
Reply to  Gojira2021

honest financial question I have no concept of the answer to: Is a 400% return over 9 years a good ROI at that level of extreme wealth? The Dow Jones is up nearly 300% since 2013.

MidtownMike
Original Member
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Comments
Vote Up
April 13, 2022 1:02 pm

If the clippers get eliminated in the play in games do you think Balmer could press a big move?

Fox, Holmes and this year’s 1st for Kawhi? It upgrades their pg and center plus the draft asset.

Davion
DD/TD
Kawhi
Barnes
Sabonis

Kingsguru21
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Patreon Supporter
April 13, 2022 1:30 pm
Reply to  MidtownMike

I wouldn’t do that. Kawhi’s injury history is scary enough for me to say no to that. This org and Kawhi? A horrible idea.

MidtownMike
Original Member
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Comments
Vote Up
April 13, 2022 2:08 pm
Reply to  Kingsguru21

I agree scary but that’s a huge upgrade for the roster with our guard depth

Sacto_J
Comments
Original Member
Vote Up
Comments
Original Member
Vote Up
April 14, 2022 9:50 am
Reply to  MidtownMike

I get taking a chance but I think Kawhi is done. Did he even suit up this season?
I’d consider it minus the draft pick. Or change Kawhi to PG and I’d throw in a 2nd / future protected 1st.

oswan88
Comments
Comments
April 14, 2022 11:37 am
Reply to  Sacto_J

Don’t see why the Clippers do it but I’d much rather have PG as well.

andy_sims
Vote Up
Comments
Original Member
Patreon Supporter
Vote Up
Comments
Original Member
Patreon Supporter
April 13, 2022 2:34 pm
Reply to  Kingsguru21

There’s also the aspect of this proposal where McNair would be laughed out of the room so forcibly that he’d be at risk of serious injury.

Kingsguru21
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Patreon Supporter
April 14, 2022 7:55 am
Reply to  andy_sims

True. I don’t really see why the Clippers do that either.

AnybodyButBagley
Comments
Vote Up
Comments
Vote Up
April 13, 2022 9:37 pm
Reply to  MidtownMike
  1. Nothing on the Kings roster that gets him.
  2. He chooses to play or not play for very good teams. Why would he ever put on a Kings jersey?
satdawg
Comments
Vote Up
Comments
Vote Up
April 14, 2022 2:01 am
Reply to  MidtownMike

First Donovan “spida” Mitchell and now Kawhi Leonard?!?!? Why on gods green earth would Utah trade him and for so little. I can’t believe that actually got answered, and LA wouldn’t give up on Kawhi just cause he had an acl injury, they’re gonna atleast run it back with him next season when he’s healthy. He would not play here guaranteed, dude would literally retire before being traded here. Like this team is so screwed at the moment. They really need to just get rid of everybody for whatever they can and start over next offseasonif they don’t make the playoffs.

Last edited 2 years ago by satdawg
andy_sims
Vote Up
Comments
Original Member
Patreon Supporter
Vote Up
Comments
Original Member
Patreon Supporter
April 13, 2022 1:59 pm

“pouting”

sure first time for everything

Dan Houlder
Dan Houlder
April 13, 2022 3:46 pm

Thanks for your answers.

SuperShaka
Comments
Vote Up
Comments
Vote Up
April 14, 2022 7:56 am

Would a deal of Barnes and Holmes for Gordon Hayward and Charlotte’s first this year be a good value for both teams?
Hayward is the better player but is older, has injury issues, and a longer contract. Charlotte needs a better center and another wing that can stay on the court.

Adamsite
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Nostradumbass 14
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Nostradumbass 14
April 14, 2022 8:50 am
Reply to  SuperShaka

The Hornets are in an interesting spot. They just got eliminated in the play-in and are going to have to pay Bridges damn near the max to keep him this summer. They don’t have cap room, have an unbalanced roster with really only Plumlee as center and are still paying Batum over $8M next year!

The Holmes off the court issues aside, he’d be an excellent piece for them, but the issue is cost. Plumlee has a non-guaranteed deal next year that they’d likely want to cut in order to save costs with re-signing Bridges, but they’d then have no true center. I doubt they can find a suitor for Hayward with his contract and injuries so they are stuck with him on the wing. If I’m Monte, I’m calling up the Hornets and offering them Holmes for Kelly Oubre straight up.

This allows the Kings to move Holmes for a wing, and allows the Hornets to waive Plumlee and use the space to take Holmes while also letting them re-sign Bridges without too much worry.

Now, if there are really desperate to move Hayward, it could be an excellent opportunity to gain some assets. If I were Monte, I’d offer them Barnes and Harkless for Hayward and a their first. Again, it would take a desperate Hornets to make that move.

I’d worship at the shrine of Monte if he could somehow pull off both of those deals in one:

Holmes, Barnes, Harkless for Hayward, Oubre and a first.

Last edited 2 years ago by Adamsite
RobHessing
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Author
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Author
April 14, 2022 9:02 am
Reply to  Adamsite

Other than dealing Holmes in a Hayward deal, I don’t see much of a market for Richaun this summer. Maybe the Mavs would deal Bullock for him? I did a light jog through the NBA rosters and could not find much. And with Harrell being a FA this summer (as well as Mitchell Robinson), I think that the market does nothing for Holmes’ already diminished value.

The Kings have $15.1m tied up in Holmes and Len next year. Unless Holmes has an epiphany and embraces the role of bench big, this could really limit the Kings in their moves to fill the myriad holes on the roster.

Adamsite
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Nostradumbass 14
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Nostradumbass 14
April 14, 2022 9:09 am
Reply to  RobHessing

Totally agree. Even without the off the court stuff, Holmes’ deal is a thorn in Monte’s side, and not even a year after he signed him to it. He’s currently the highest paid backup center in the league by a country mile.

I also agree that the Hornets and Mavs are about the only teams that have a need for him and may be able to swallow his deal.

oswan88
Comments
Comments
April 14, 2022 11:41 am
Reply to  Adamsite

Crazy how the deal went from a steal to a thorn in Monte’s side lol.

Adamsite
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Nostradumbass 14
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Nostradumbass 14
April 14, 2022 12:47 pm
Reply to  oswan88

That’s what happens when your biggest fee agent signing in 20 years is a guy to be your starting center to a fair deal, but then go out and trade for a starting center to replace him a few months later.

On a personal note, I’m a bit surprised that decision making by Monte is talked about a bit more around here. It’s kind of like drafting starting level point guards in consecutive years after you gave a max extension to your star point guard.

BeTheBall
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
April 14, 2022 1:26 pm
Reply to  Adamsite

I have to think Monte figured Fox would improve on his 2020 season to start his 1st year of his max deal (rather than notably regress). If so, that would have made him much more attractive this past deadline.

WizsSox
Patreon Supporter
Original Member
Comments
Vote Up
Patreon Supporter
Original Member
Comments
Vote Up
April 14, 2022 1:31 pm
Reply to  Adamsite

It’s kind of like drafting starting level point guards in consecutive years after you gave a max extension to your star point guard.

I think it’s not talked about because the draft is a piece of McNair’s GM resume that should be looked at favorably and hard to fault in my mind. In the 2020 NBA draft which player reasonably projected to go in the 12-20 range would have extracted the value needed in a trade to get Sabonis…other than Haliburton. Maxey? Bey? Maybe, but I doubt it. Whether you have a point guard previously or not, then that makes it a great pick. Sabonis is a clear upgrade to Holmes and you see what you can spin Holmes for later. Dom violence issue can obviously complicate that, but not sure how you foresee that.

2021 Draft from projected 9-20ish, who would be a better value wise than Davion after their rookie years? Zaire? Duarte? I suppose one could argue that. One could also argue Mitchell has the most value of that group too.

In either draft based on the position they picked, I don’t see any obvious, “Damn, Monte screwed that up royally” whiffs. We all know the feeling of not being able to say that about past Kings GM’s.

I think he has gotten very good value from their draft positions and it’s up to him to spin that repetitive value into a team that works, which he has already attempted once in trading Hali and could do again with either Fox or Mitchell if he deems they work better separately (remains to be seen).

The Kings are not good, thus changes will/should be made. Maximizing your value according to draft slot, is the optimal route until you have a firm playoff worthy core ready to go, regardless of positional similarities. (Obviously there are some limits to this do to possible minutes to showcase value).

Lots of arguments to be made about why you don’t trade Hali (I am fine with the trade), but I don’t see the point of questioning drafting back to back PG’s if that’s where the value lies for a team lacking valuable assets. So far it seems like Monte got if not the most valuable, one of the most valuable pieces remaining (in projected range) available when he drafted.

Last edited 2 years ago by WizsSox
Adamsite
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Nostradumbass 14
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Nostradumbass 14
April 14, 2022 1:55 pm
Reply to  WizsSox

I think all of that assumes that you always draft BPA no matter the pick, which I’m not sure is the the correct thing to do. At what point you go for position and need over BPA in a draft is anyone’s guess.

I guess what I’m saying is if you draft for valuable assets, that might become of service come a trade, are you really drafting to improve the team on the court that season. Does a GM say, “hey, let’s draft this guy, even though he is redundant with the current roster, because he may have value in a season or two for a trade.”

Let’s just say at #7 this year the BPA is either a PG or a C, do the Kings still draft him for value?

WizsSox
Patreon Supporter
Original Member
Comments
Vote Up
Patreon Supporter
Original Member
Comments
Vote Up
April 14, 2022 2:33 pm
Reply to  Adamsite

I hear what you are saying, there is a point of diminishing returns with the strategy. I think at the Kings level of asset/talented players (low), yes you still draft BPA.

Of course you won’t always draft BPA as an end result, but trying to I think is the right thing to do at this stage and except for more rare situations, usually the best practice. If your decision group think it’s close between 2, sure go with need. But if I feel one prospect is clear cut better than another after evaluations and I am the Kings, yes I would draft a PG or C, even if I have to begrudgingly do it.

Luckily for the Kings this year, seems a lot of guys in their tier of prospects should cross sect BPA and fit pretty well.

Last edited 2 years ago by WizsSox
Adamsite
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Nostradumbass 14
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Nostradumbass 14
April 14, 2022 6:05 pm
Reply to  WizsSox

For sure. If there is an obvious and consensus drop off of talent after you pick, then grab the BPA. The issue for the Kings in that situation is that haven’t had that opportunity since the Bagley draft…and they blew it. IMO, there is rarely a consensus BPA after around the 5th pick.

Kingsguru21
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Patreon Supporter
April 14, 2022 7:06 pm
Reply to  Adamsite

For sure. If there is an obvious and consensus drop off of talent after you pick, then grab the BPA. The issue for the Kings in that situation is that haven’t had that opportunity since the Bagley draft…and they blew it. IMO, there is rarely a consensus BPA after around the 5th pick.

You’re welcome to explain where Monte McNair failed in this scenario.

You don’t like what McNair has done. I get that. But it would be incredibly less ingenious if you admitted that and stated why.

Adamsite
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Nostradumbass 14
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Nostradumbass 14
April 14, 2022 8:34 pm
Reply to  Kingsguru21

I was all aboard the Hali wagon. He was #2 on my board and was overjoyed that he fell to the Kings at #12. I envisioned him as a great backcourt pairing with Fox. The Mitchell pick, on the other hand left me scratching my head. When your two best players are Fox and Hali, and you already have Buddy under contract, why do you draft another PG. I still think it’s mistake, and I’m sure that will get a reaction.

Before folks say, “but Mitchell was great value at #9,” I get that, but he didn’t help the Kings in the win column or roster construction. You also can’t judge the Mitchell pick through the lens of the Sabonis trade in which Hali was removed from the equations. The two are completely isolated.

The fact remains that Monte drafted a PG when his two best players on the team also played that position. I have an issue with that, regardless of Monte’s perceived BPA. He painted himself into a corner of needing to move one, if not two, of them in the near future.

Couple all that with the Holmes signing followed by the Sabonis trade just months later and it has me wondering if Monte has a plan or just jumps on the best available option when it is presented. Flying by the seat of his pants, so to speak.

murraytant
Comments
Vote Up
Comments
Vote Up
April 14, 2022 3:26 pm
Reply to  Adamsite

Ivey ? at 4 if Kings get lucky.
actually I would not

RobHessing
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Author
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Author
April 14, 2022 2:06 pm
Reply to  Adamsite

The rough part is not being able to deal Holmes at the deadline for even a 2nd round pick that never conveys. The freeing up of payroll dollars alone would have been better than where the Kings are right now.

Kingsguru21
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Patreon Supporter
April 14, 2022 7:10 pm
Reply to  RobHessing

The rough part is not being able to deal Holmes at the deadline for even a 2nd round pick that never conveys. The freeing up of payroll dollars alone would have been better than where the Kings are right now.

This is a hindsight 20 20 take. Anyone saying otherwise is welcome to speak up, but this is reminiscent of the feelings one has post Bee article.

RobHessing
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Author
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Author
April 15, 2022 9:04 am
Reply to  Kingsguru21

Yeah, this is a rabbit hole convo waiting to happen. My statement is pretty basic and simple. If you want to hoist the hindsight flag, go forward and prosper.

murraytant
Comments
Vote Up
Comments
Vote Up
April 14, 2022 3:23 pm
Reply to  Adamsite

I think Kings believed that despite the roster imbalance, that they might be good. That went away quickly. Then Sabonis was unexpectedly available and they went for it.
Then Holmes got hurt, had off court issues and just did not play well. What if Monte had not gone for Sabonis-
at this point- and I love Holmes- get anything just to get rid of the salary.
and Jones might be induced to return although Hornets and Mavs are salivating over him, I suspect

Carl
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
April 14, 2022 1:19 pm
Reply to  Adamsite

Totally agree. Even without the off the court stuff, Holmes’ deal is a thorn in Monte’s side, and not even a year after he signed him to it.

I also wonder if the Kings knew about the accusations when they signed the Holmes deal. If so, that’s extremely questionable from a management (and moral) perspective.

Adamsite
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Nostradumbass 14
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Nostradumbass 14
April 15, 2022 9:26 am
Reply to  Carl

I’m not sure they knew way back then, but who knows. What I can’t get out of my head is that the Kings definitely knew about the Holmes situation when they made the trade for Sabonis. The accusations against him by his ex happened before the trade deadline.

Could the trade or Sabonis have been pushed to the finish line in part because of the Holmes situations?

Carl
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
April 15, 2022 1:22 pm
Reply to  Adamsite

Could the trade or Sabonis have been pushed to the finish line in part because of the Holmes situations?

That’s certainly possible, especially after what we’ve heard recently about Vivek dithering and/or asking his competitors (which means he’s not listening to his front office) on trades.

I think the Kings would have done the deal anyway. They want to win today. McNair has said they’re not going to waste future assets on a one year acquisition, and I think that’s true. (At least until Bronny James enters the draft, where I fully expect the Kings to throw a half decade of assets overboard for a year of an over the hill LeBron.)

I expect a minor version of the Sabonis deal this offseason, involving one or more of the Kings first round picks. I don’t think they’ll acquire an expiring contract, but I do think those picks and Barnes are on the table for two years of anyone under 30 who has sniffed an NBA All Star game.

Last edited 2 years ago by Carl
murraytant
Comments
Vote Up
Comments
Vote Up
April 14, 2022 3:18 pm
Reply to  Adamsite

Hornets are a potential landing spot for Holmes but man, that recent baggage will hurt him and the fact he has been hurt and his production dropped way off and he costs a lot. At this point, most anything to get rid of his salary would be a win.
Hayward is breaking down. Heard the LAL were interested.
Not sure if Hornets would interested at all in any scenario to give up a first.
Mavs might be able to use a center

Looks grim on the trade front. oh yeah, to LAL for Westbrook LOL

Carl
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
April 14, 2022 1:15 pm
Reply to  SuperShaka

Would a deal of Barnes and Holmes for Gordon Hayward and Charlotte’s first this year be a good value for both teams?

I see your logic, but I don’t see any way the Kings front office does the deal. It makes the Kings worse over the next several years due to Hayward’s injury issues, plus adds salary in exchange for a first round pick, which is really a future asset. The Kings are in win now mode, or at least they think they are. I could see it if they had enough dead salary of their own to send out, but they really don’t at this point, other than Holmes being devalued based on his play and off-court issues.

Last edited 2 years ago by Carl
Adamsite
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Nostradumbass 14
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Nostradumbass 14
April 14, 2022 1:40 pm
Reply to  Carl

I was just looking at the salary numbers. Barnes and Holmes equal Hayward next season and Holmes is on the books for $12M during Hayward’s last year under contract at $31M. So the Kings would basically be paying $19M for a first round pick around #14. What is the going price for a mid first rounder these days?

I feel Hayward, when he’s not injured, is better than Barnes, so I guess you are crossing your fingers that he can play 60-70 games per season for the next two years and whoever the Kings get at #7 and #14 can pick up the slack.

Carl
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
April 14, 2022 3:05 pm
Reply to  Adamsite

I agree that Heyward is better than Barnes when healthy, but he seems to have settled in at playing about 50 games per season, which it wouldn’t be unreasonable to expect will get worse over time. I think if you move Barnes and you have Heyward for 50 games, you’re likely worse that year. And I don’t think the Kings are going to make any kind of move that trades being worse short term for any kind of long term asset.

Another deal that does work is Holmes, Harkless, Holiday and Len for Heyward and a first. But it uses all of the Kings cap space for two seasons for a guy who misses 30 games per season, not to mention the roster issues it creates on the Charlotte side.

Charlotte might be more inclined to roll the dice on Westbrook (or John Wall?) than a pure salary dump

Last edited 2 years ago by Carl
SuperShaka
Comments
Vote Up
Comments
Vote Up
April 14, 2022 3:22 pm
Reply to  Carl

Hayward’s health is the gamble with this trade. His playmaking could really help the Kings and using the extra pick to add depth, and a future replacement, at forward could help fill in for the 30 or so games Hayward would miss. Plus a new and improved medical staff could make Gordon whole again!

RikSmits
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
April 14, 2022 10:36 pm
Reply to  Carl

Hayward is averaging something like 48/49 games played during the last 3 seasons. Fox? 56 games…

1951
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
Patreon Supporter
Comments
Vote Up
Original Member
April 14, 2022 10:17 am

That’s what I thought.

comment image

christkills
Original Member
Original Member
April 14, 2022 4:56 pm

D Mitch or not D Mitch

That is the question

SierraSpartan
Original Member
Vote Up
Comments
Original Member
Vote Up
Comments
April 15, 2022 9:39 am

Q: What can the Kings do to remind us all that, notwithstanding all the talk about doing things differently, they are still the Kangz?

A: Hire another retread ex-L*kers coach…

Vogel.jpg
Greg
Admin
Vote Up
Comments
Original Member
Author
Vote Up
Comments
Original Member
Author
April 15, 2022 1:54 pm
Reply to  SierraSpartan

I wouldn’t worry about rumors from that guy

Badge Legend

Patreon Supporter Patreon Supporter   Registered On Day 1 Registered On Day 1   Published Post Published Post  Published Post Nostradumbass
Comment Up Votes 200 Up Votes   Comment Up Votes 500 Up Votes    1,000 Up Votes    3,000+ Up Votes

Comments 50 Comments   Comments 100 Comments    250 Comments    500 Comments    1000+ Comments