Over the last few days, the rumor mill in Sacramento has been in overdrive, and then some. De’Aaron Fox has been put on the block and immediately removed, Tyrese Haliburton and seven million picks were apparently offered for Ben Simmons, Daryl Morey has been negotiating with the Kings through radio interviews, and just about any name currently being shopped has been linked to Sacramento. With so much information sprouting from both reliable and unreliable sources, a couple of faithful Kings reporters have stepped up with updates in the last 24 hours.
Sam Amick of The Athletic, undoubtedly the most well-connected national source for the Kings, shared some updates on the Carmichael Dave show on 1140 KHTK. While the interview wasn’t the bomb-dropping sort filled with juicy tidbits and gossip, Amick did clarify some potentially conflicting reports between coworker Shams Charania and himself. Previously, Sam had reported that the Kings had placed guard De’Aaron Fox on the block, with Jason Anderson of The Sacramento Bee confirming that report by sharing a potential swap of Fox for Indiana Pacers big man Domantas Sabonis, but Shams shot down those rumors on Thursday afternoon with an interestingly worded report:
“The Sacramento Kings organization has a current mindset: They are not trading guard De’Aaron Fox, sources tell The Athletic.”
Later in the report, he specifically refuted the Sabonis conversations:
“Team sources said any potential deal around Fox for Pacers center Domantas Sabonis will not happen.”
Although those reports seem very definitive, there is some key information missing. Amick clarified why Shams’ report conflicted with the information that had been shared by multiple individuals in the previous 24 hours:
“The Kings are saying these things while knowing exactly what Philly has told them, while knowing exactly what Indiana has told them. I think they’re reacting to the current market and what they’ve been told by these teams.”
Amick later went on to confirm that the very specific phrase of “current mindset” was extremely reflective of what the Kings were feeling in response to potentially rejected offers by both the Sixers and the Pacers. Essentially, De’Aaron Fox isn’t being shopped at the moment because the return hasn’t been as expected or hoped for, rather than an altruistic reason of wanting to keep the band of Fox and Haliburton together for as long as possible. The Sabonis deal is certainly off of the table at the moment, but that was not necessarily initiated by Sacramento. If the Kings get a call that interests them, or if the Pacers or Sixers drop their price for their incumbent, on-the-block All-Stars, De’Aaron could immediately become available.
Richaun Holmes on the block
The other update from Wednesday came through KHTK’s rival, ESPN 1320. James Ham confirmed the phrasing that the Kings weren’t shopping De’Aaron Fox or Tyrese Haliburton at the moment, and he threw in an extra, mildly surprising piece of information. In addition to putting veterans Harrison Barnes and Buddy Hield on the block, as well as the eternally available Marvin Bagley, Sacramento’s front office has also included recently re-signed starting center Richaun Holmes in trade conversations:
“That is the hope, they will be able to make changes starting with guys like Harrison Barnes, Buddy Hield, and Richaun Holmes. All of these guys are available, from what I know.”
Holmes being shopped signals a potentially interesting shift in Monte McNair’s mindset heading into the deadline. Previously, only players that had been signed by Vlade Divac had been shopped, but Holmes is a guy that management chose to pay and keep around this past summer. It’s clear that the front office understands that their playoff hopes for this roster were far too optimistic and that this team needs a massive shakeup.
As one of the best pick-and-roll rim runners in the league, Holmes offers perhaps the best value of any of Sacramento’s veterans, depending on league-wide team needs. Although the center position isn’t historically as valuable as a wing such as Harrison Barnes, Richaun’s friendly contract of just four years, $46 million is easy to match salary-wise and is much easy to absorb for tax-paying teams, especially when compared with Barnes’ average salary of $19 million per year over the next two seasons. Teams like the Portland Trail Blazers, Dallas Mavericks, Charlotte Hornets, Golden State Warriors, and many others will likely be calling about the availability of Holmes’ services.
The willingness to put all of these veterans on the trade block may be an encouraging sign for this front office, as they refused to do so last deadline with the Kings in a similarly hopeless situation, but the sought after return for Barnes, Holmes, and Hield is still unknown, and a bit of a concern. In the same interview with Damien Barling and Kenny Caraway, Ham shared that the Kings are seeking young-ish players, in the 24-27 range, to help win now and also build around Fox and Haliburton; however, there is a far cry from a 24-year old developing player and overpaying for a solid, if an uninspiring 27-year old veteran like Jerami Grant who wants to score and get paid for scoring.
The Sacramento Kings are clearly open for business, and it seems as though just about everyone is being shopped, as should be the case for a team sitting 11 games under .500 and acting as if they want to escape the gym and just get home every night. It remains to be seen if management and ownership are willing to accept how far gone the season truly is, or if they’re going to push for a 10th place finish, the future be damned.
Hmm.
It’s certainly not personal with Holmes or that they don’t want him. But this team is utterly broken, even if Richaun has little to do with that.
The Kings need players that give a damn abt winning or losing. I don’t see that with Buddy, Fox, Barnes, etc.. I do see that with TD, Hali and Holmes. If they are shopping Holmes and his great contract, they need a nice haul coming back (ie. Holmes for Plumlee and 2 1st’s from CHA)
And yet… trading a key piece of the current lineup (Holmes) for picks would not help the team “push for the play-in” this year, which apparently is their (lame) goal. If they trade Holmes, my guess is he’s packaged along with Hield, Barnes, Bagley, etc., for a slightly above-average vet on a big contract who the team thinks can help them win a few extra games this spring and sneak into the 10th seed. This team’s mindset is pathetic.
Right, I know my trade idea is more for the right-thinking among us who believe this team is not “a piece or two away” to immediate success. Our only hope is that this current roadtrip is a complete disaster and even an incredibly lame goal like the play-in becomes out of reach.
Abject failure is maybe the only way to make these absolute morons realize a rebuild is needed. That a playin chase is useless.
But Vivek is a dog with a bone. He won’t give up, ever. Won’t alter his view. Maybe it’s all just about $ and ego.
They talked about trading every vet last year but decided the prudent thing was a playin push. Kept Walton, despite the obvious lack of ability. Then, they did it again this year. I hate them.
Now, trying to thread some needle to nowhere is the playbook.
Just lose and prey Vivek gets distracted by a doggie treat long enough to not see the rebuild.
Otherwise, maybe a billboard would help. But I doubt it
So Porzingis will be a King by Feb 10th?
I hope not!
Holmes to CHA makes sense. I doubt it will be mid-season, but I’d even be open to “helping” them find the space to re-sign Bridges by taking on Hayward for the low low price of some combination of picks/Jones/Washington/Thor/McDaniels/etc.
I would think a deal including Bagley and TT’s expiring contracts would have appeal for CHA.
Yep. As I mention below, I don’t expect CHA to move Hayward before the summer, but something like:
Holmes, Bagley, TT for Hayward, Jones, Thor, 1st would make some sense and works (I think. I haven’t checked) money-wise.
They have Bridges, Oubre, Rozier, Bouknight, etc to full those 2/3 minutes and clear 10-20MM from the books for next season depending on what they choose to do with Bagley.
Cap question: Can the Kings trade Bagley and TT in the summer? Aren’t their contracts done at that point?
Correct. This was a “I don’t think CHA moves Hayward now, BUT IF THEY DID…,” type of scenario.
Only in a S&T.
And only Bagley. TT will be a UFA. TT really needs to be traded as an expiring this season. Even if it’s for basically nothing.
They could trade TT in a S&T but I doubt anyone does.
Right. Sorry. It’s possible. There just isn’t really much reason for anybody involved to actually do it.
Harrison Barnes, Homes, and Bagley for Hayward and PJ Washington works right now if the Kings wanted to blow things up. Kings would have to insist on a pick or more to be included, but that allows the Hornets to still compete and clear some cap space.
I’m not especially enamored with Washington. I Can I trade him out for other assets?
I’m not enamored with him either, but he’s a young stretch 4 that the Kings would control the rights of. He’d still be starting for the Hornets if Bridges hadn’t made the tremendous leap he’s made this year.
Yeah, but he’d be starting because they wouldn’t have better options and the Hornets wouldn’t be as good. To me, he looks a whole lot like a decent back-up that you’d be happy to have on a rookie or very team-friendly deal, but you really don’t want to be paying market rates to keep or acquire him. Again, he’s fine. But I think guys like Jones, Thor, and [random mid-to-late 1st rounder] have more upside and, right now, I’m looking for upside. Even if that comes with more risk. Ultimately, I think guys like Washington are pretty easy to pick up on the cheap.
decent backup—sounds like a headlining Kings starter!
Pure speculation, I’m guessing she’s reacting to the news that he’s on the trade block.
Or she just tried yogurt pie for the first time
As he should be. He’s a good rotation big on a good contract, but the Kings need to be putting themselves into positions to find potentially elite contributors. Not stockpiling role players.
Well said. 1,000% agree
Agree
This is all very conflicting, but I wouldn’t be surprised to hear that the Sixers and Pacers don’t want Fox. He doesn’t fit too well with either team. Hoping we’re not being setup again for the team overvaluing its assets and getting nothing done.
Like I’ve been saying, Sabonis for Simmons might make sense for both teams, if the Sixers can also offload Harris.
Eh, I don’t really see Sabonis as a great fit next to Embiid. On the Pacers end, what they really need is guys that can stay on the court.
Besides what BHE said, making the money work would be tough to trade for Simmons and Harris together.
I can see teams doing it, but not during the season. And it would require a complete restructuring of your roster to do so. There’s a reason why I said it was criminally stupid for the Kings to consider it. The only way I see them having considered it at all is if Fox was included, Haliburton wasn’t, no picks were going back to Philly.
And that’s a tough trade to pull off at the deadline given how many players it would take to do that deal.
My guess is the Kings offered De’Aaron Fox, Buddy Hield, Harrison Barnes and Marvin Bagley for Ben Simmons, Tobias Harris, Paul Reed and Isaiah Joe.
And that was an obvious no go for Morey on all fronts since he wants a way to get Harden in the offseason.
Even beyond the numbers, ultimately, teams that are performing relatively well (like the 76ers) don’t tend to trade away core pieces during the season. For example, a guy like Gordon Hayward is clearly not a central part of Hornets rebuild and they’ll almost certainly look to move him in order to clear space to re-sign Bridges. BUT they’re playing well and he has played a big role in that. So I highly doubt they would consider trading him during the season. Instead, they’ll likely wait until the summer.
The bigger issue for Charlotte is that contract extension they gave to Rozier. Yikes! And people complain about Buddy and what he’s making!
Yeah, that’s a bad contract. But he’s playing well and is a good fit with Ball since he has the length and physicality to defend both guard positions. At this point, in a vacuum, I think Rozier’s contract is better than Hield’s.
Rozier. Is cheaper and better than Buddy !
He’s not cheaper. Not anymore.
And he’s still owed an absolute f-ton of money in the next five years. Seems like trading to add another small guard to the lineup would be a bad way to spend $120 million.
I guess now we’re dumping Buddy for the most expensive bag of chips on Earth.
If that bag of chips has a money tree I can shake a million dollars out of, please let me know. I could always use a million dollars.
The addition of Harris in these negotiations completely changes the calculus. It seems adding him in talks is the caveat for Morey to get his desired Simmons return. In my estimation that makes it necessary for them to add a fair bit more in any deal. If we had your Jason Thompson salary hole, trading like for like bad money maybe, but I agree that is a huge move for a midseason trade. Usually you seek to diversify the payroll with value propositions, not putting 65 million of your cap under two players on inflated value.
I honestly can’t think of too many teams that would want Fox right now, especially at his price. I’d wager less than 10 teams view his production and contract over their current starting point guards. It may even be closer to 5 teams.
When that number gets closer to 15 or 20 teams, then you aren’t trading him either.
It’s one of those deals that the more of an asset you have in a player, the easier it is to move on. And that might not be the best thing for you ultimately. What the Kings need is for Fox to live up to his potential, not be a perpetual question mark.
I really fear that if the Kings hang onto him and continue to flounder after the deadline, he may ask to be traded. The Kings would then really have lost all value in him and would likely get pennies on the dollar in trade. I hope Monte has a good pulse on the players.
I hope this happens. I hope Vivek’s non plan blows up in his face.
Yes, it would be good if the team remains terrible.
My sentiments as well. And that isnt helped with a Sexton, Brunson floating and likely gettable for a smaller deal or at a cheaper cost come the summer (let alone the depth of replacement level pinch starters always available or will be on the market come summer)
Personally the list is Houston, New York and New Orleans who have a basketball case for having interest. Other than that its really a hypothetical of someone possibly being interested or based on his value compared to what a team is sending out.
I think that in part is the reality of Fox’s value. Starting or replacement value guards are league wide, and might not come at the price point or usage demands that narrows possible fits for Fox to begin with. Of teams that at least abstractly you could see pursuing him for basketball reasons are the Rockets, now the Porter experiment seeming to have gone south, and his hometown ties, maybe the Knicks with Kentucky connections and an aging guard core, and the Pels just to change the squad.
There are other teams I could make a case could justify an exchange (like PHI and IND considering there own issues) but the pool is possibly small. And when you have Brunson, Sexton coming to market, any number of bench guards you could fetch for a possible expanded role, a max Fox is a big bet.
It’s very few teams. I have the Pels, Knicks, Boston, Houston, and maybe Pacers that would have interest in him. Making contracts work is another story.
I am guessing the Knicks would really like to get him, and they have a few young players like Toppin and Quickley to make taking back Randle a bit more palatable. I think we all knew Julius Randle would be a King someday anyway.
Probably set up. And the Kings are delusional. Fox isn’t valued super highly because he’s flawed. Can’t shoot, doesn’t play D often and isn’t a PG/team type player but rather 1-1 Westbrook type non PG
He’s a good 3 (2)option maybe but Vivek overvalues him. How about building around players with a high ceiling? Players that can shoot and defend. IE-the way you actually win in playoffs.
I would take Sabonis over Simmons ant day
“Essentially, De’Aaron Fox isn’t being shopped at the moment because the return hasn’t been as expected or hoped for, rather than an altruistic reason of wanting to keep the band of Fox and Haliburton together for as long as possible.”
Here’s what I don’t understand. IF the team was shopping De’Aaron Fox, it’s because they believe he is not a franchise cornerstone and isn’t worth the cost they are currently paying for him; therefore, they wanted to trade him and start anew. So if they discovered teams weren’t willing to offer Fox as much as they thought/hoped, why does that compel them to hold onto Fox longer, despite already deciding he isn’t a cornerstone and isn’t worth the cost? If anything, the underwhelming offers they apparently received for Fox confirmed their original evaluation of him! So why hold onto him, now having more evidence than ever that he isn’t “the guy,” instead of trading him for whatever assets (probably still quite good assets) you can get for him at this point?
The only (semi)-logical reason to hold onto Fox now is the hope that, even though he isn’t a cornerstone and isn’t worth the cost, he is still good enough to drag the team to the play-in if his supporting cast is re-shuffled. What a pathetic mindset. “We know he isn’t the guy to build around, but we’ll do it anyway, because we’d rather make the play-in once than think long-term and compete for an actual championship.” Jesus. Kangz.
Fox is at the lowest trade value of his career. Last summer was the time to shop him. Of course he’s lost favor around the league. He’s been completely disinterested on defense this season, can’t hit a three, and seems checked out. Who wants that?
So far!
That’s a pretty substantial inference. There’s nothing about making a player available that necessarily implies that the team feels that he’s not worth his contract. Good players get traded all the time, if the return furthers the team’s goal more than keeping the player.
If Holmes is on the block, as everyone ought to be, are you suggesting that the organization feels that he isn’t providing value to the level of his contract? He’s been injured, but I’ve yet to hear anyone state that the Kings feel that he’s overpaid. I’d be pretty surprised to find out that more than a handful of GMs wouldn’t jump at the opportunity to acquire Holmes on his current deal.
“There’s nothing about making a player available that necessarily implies that the team feels that he’s not worth his contract. Good players get traded all the time, if the return furthers the team’s goal more than keeping the player.”
Totally agree. What irritates me is that Sac refused to entertain any offers for Fox for years, and publicly committed to him as their cornerstone on multiple occasions. He is the foundation of the current roster; pretty much all the other players are here to play a role around Fox. By signaling a desire to trade Fox, you are also signaling that your foundation isn’t strong enough to seriously compete for a championship someday. So by then by effectively walking back the signal and taking Fox off the market, you are implying that either 1) you changed your mind and still do think Fox is a strong-enough foundation on which to build a championship team, or 2) you are okay with keeping him as the foundation, despite already concluding you can’t build a championship team around him. Knowing this team’s pathetic obsession with making the play-in, as if it’s some sort of prize worth pursuing, my gut it #2 is it.
TLDR: I just don’t have any confidence that this organization can think long-term. They’re obsessed with participation trophies (play-in) for some lame reason. Kangz.
I guess I don’t believe that any change in strategy is some great admission of wrongdoing, but in most cases, simply indicates that circumstances or philosophy have changed. With a new GM, I would expect a change in direction, of which there have been indications, one example being Fox’s possible availability.
It’s also a bit above my pay grade to know one way or the other if the Kings have entertained offers for Fox. It’s reasonable to expect that there have been previous offers, just as there are now. It doesn’t mean that any of them make sense from Sacramento’s point of view.
You read a lot that the team can’t get any worse, but that’s naive. It’s not hard to imagine any number of realistic and awful scenarios that would result from inept personnel decisions predicated by a vague demand for change for change’s sake. To be sure, this franchise needs a great deal of change, but decisions can’t be made out of frustration.
There are still three weeks left to the deadline. I have no idea what will happen, what could realistically happen, or if anything will happen. No matter how it plays, there won’t be anyone among us who knows all of the details or context. The inevitable leaks about teams that show them to be successful or failures after the deadline will be self-serving to the nameless cowards who float them.
They will, naturally, be taken as gospel.
Y’up. Welcome to the distorted reality of Vivek’s mind. Ego so big it blocks out logic and reason.
Translation: No stars are coming, prepare yourself Kings fan.
I’m seeing a Tobias Harris for Harrison Barnes/Buddy Hield in our future…
I think it’s Harris for Buddy and Bagley. Harris is tremendously overpaid, and that frees up money Philly needs to go after major free agents in the offseason. They probably need to deal Harris for less salary if they’re actually going to compete for a title next season.
I think your deal is the one that Philly wants, but doesn’t make sense for Monte. The way I see it: Harris is a slight upgrade over Barnes as a player, but with a terrible contract. For us to take that terrible contract, they need to take Buddy back. Addition by subtraction.
I definitely said it was Buddy and not Barnes!
I see that now, sorry! I would prefer they take Barnes instead of Bagley (too many B’s….), but understand that doesn’t help them clear much space for the summer.
Somebody is gonna get a great deal with Richaun. I’m sure Kings will get a second rounder and some veteran stiff in return.
I don’t find it very surprising that Holmes is on the block. The message, which has been largely consistent, has been that everyone is available except Fox and Halliburton. The exception for those two has been softened this week, but “everyone” certainly continues to include Richaun Holmes.
To be fair, Richaun has put in a lot of hard work over the years. He deserves to be promoted to an NBA team.
Agreed. I’ve always wanted him back as Embiid’s backup.
Holmes should go. He isn’t the starting 5 on a championship level team. He’s a more well rounded Montez Harrel. A luxury the Kings won’t need for awhile.
I’m of two minds on Fox. He’s got skills that few others in the NBA have, but will he put it all together. If he brings a big return then maybe part ways and wish him well. If teams are trying to get him cheap then keep him.
I’m probably alone on this, but I would keep Bagley. He has talent, and I think if we dump him for nothing we will regret it.
With Fox, it isn’t really a question of “putting it all together” as much as it is one of development. Can he develop his shot? Can he improve his vision and ability to choreograph the offense? Defensively, can he learn navigate the opponents’ team actions to improve his ability to contribute positively to the team’s overall defense? These are all important developments when talking about jumping into the elite/star category. Now, he doesn’t HAVE to be a star. He’s a very good and useful NBA player as is. He’s just a guy that’s more of a high level complementary player than a cornerstone.
Extending from that though is personally a concern of his narrower potential as a secondary and tertiary contributor. The reason we could justify him as a pick was his primary upside, but if he cant be afforded that leeway or usage, the benefits of his strengths in my opinion start to become at odds in more collective schemes. Its hard to imagine him as a plus starter on a 55 win team without being the primary or co primary option. That personally is a major reason I would be open to move him in the right deal. I am struggling to imagine how he is an additive contributor when more democratized offenses start to matter.
I think its wise for the Kings to maximize the possible returns by diversifying the tradable players in separate deals. Seeing a lot of returns where we are taking on larger sums for less players, that only debatably improve us . That seems counter intuitive to wanting a playoff roster. If Fox and filler say (Thompson etc) and maybe a pick aren’t enough for Sabonis or Simmons I think you have to look at the 2nd tier guys like Turner and Grant. I don’t see the point of swinging Barnes in a consolidating trade with another tradable asset. Make separate deals in my opinion. Turner or Grant for filler Mitchell and a pick I think adds to the collective oppose to just changing it. And leaves room for additional deals.
My direction would be trading the likes of Barnes, Hield for flyers or draft equity but that doesn’t seem to be the Kings calculus. If it’s a playoff push they are going for, they should be adding to the collective with plus starter grade additions rather than narrowing returns. Unfortunately with picks as probably the main currency but whats the goal?
On the Hollinger Duncan pod they thought you could fetch 2 first for Barnes. Or a first and low end prospect. Maybe the Kings can look that direction add a younger player they like, and then attach that new first in any new deal? Thats just a proxy example of saying I favor trading for multiple parts, that are maybe moveable than merging all the trade assets for a single return or deal.
I’m pretty much “meh” over this latest round of rumors. Holmes can stay or go, neither one really moves the needle much in terms of furthering the team’s shot at the playoffs. Same with Fox, Buddy, Barnes. Just hoping that whenever whoever is traded, we get some sort of assets (not albatrosses) in return.
How about Holmes (maybe a future pick) for Wiseman? Golden State needs a reliable center who can score, can work off pick and rolls with Green and Curry and will hustle. Looney can still play rim protector. I just don’t see Wiseman in their future.
I wonder about a Holmes for Wiseman trade. They have similar contracts, and Wiseman isn’t exactly a difference maker for the Dubs who only have a few years left with their core and Holmes gets to play for something while contributing on a playoff team. Kings get a big man with upside.
Or trade him to Boston for Horford. Horford isn’t the long term help for us, but he’s a massive expiring contract next year which would have value. To make cash work you probably have to include Hield and or Barnes but you would get some picks out of it. Then again, that’s long term thinking, and we only think in the short term here…
Can’t the team just draft better and develop their own players? I’ve heard this strategy has some success.
Who’s going to develop them?
The last couple of picks have been bangers, but I’m not sure the organization has successfully developed a draft pick since Kevin Martin.
There have been some good picks, like Cousins and Evans, but both were good players when they got here. Cousins added a three-point shot, but I doubt that it was for any reason other than he wanted to add another facet to his game. I can’t think of any development on their part that is attributable to the organization.
And most of the rest of the selections speak for themselves.
Just out of curiosity how do you go about determining which improvements were purely due to the player vs. which one are purely attributable to the organization? Even if a player came in with a particular skill that skill can be targeted by the organization and developed by the organization in specific or general ways.
Basically, no meaningful, impact trade will happen. None of those guys will bring net us a Simmons/Sabonis type player. The only way the Kings become competitive is through trades and great drafts. Petrie swung for the fences and traded for Webber; traded a fan gave like J-Will for Bibby; etc.
I disagree.Sabonis can be had and not for a bundle.
Truth.
This is a contradicting comment no? “No trades will ever happen that help, we are the kings… here are two examples of trades that helped the kings get better”
🤷♂️
This team stinks, everyone should be available. cough Except Tyrese cough
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