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Patience is a virtue, inaction is a failure

Monte McNair may be patient, but Kings fans won’t be.

It’s widely expected that the Sacramento Kings will make a big roster move this summer. After all, Kings GM Monte McNair hitched his wagon to Luke Walton. If McNair isn’t changing the coach, but is expecting the Kings to take a step forward, it stands to reason that he would try to improve the roster.

But with that expectation comes new opportunity for disappointment. In his latest mailbag for The Athletic, Jason Jones suggests that a big move may not actually be coming this summer:

I think it’s fair to expect McNair to take a big swing — most likely via trade — this offseason. But I wouldn’t be shocked if it didn’t happen. Not keeping Bogdanovic was about maintaining financial flexibility, but McNair also wants to be prudent and smart about when he makes a move. The deal the Kings make might not happen this summer, so fans should be prepared for that. A big deal could happen during the season, too.

Seeing this kind of preemptive moving goal post makes me nervous. It’s pushing back a deadline that’s already been pushed many times. First it was that it was ok for the Kings to not make a big move last summer because McNair was new and didn’t need to rush into a move. Then we were told that we should be patient when the Kings didn’t make a big move at the trade deadline. Now it’s being suggested that we shouldn’t be overly eager for a move this summer.

It is, of course, important that McNair not make moves for the sake of making moves. Kings fans will be just as mad at a bad trade as they will be over no trades at all. But at a certain point McNair will no longer be patient, he’ll be Danny Ainge but without any blockbusters or titles. He’ll just be the guy who almost made big moves.

Perhaps this is all an overreaction to nothing, it may have just been Jones speculating. But Kings fans have been down this road too many times before, where the excuses for the action (or in this case, inaction) come in advance.

Monte McNair may have endless patience, but he’s a fool if he thinks Kings fans will.

 

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SMF-PDXConnection
June 12, 2021 8:18 am

I think they’ll keep preaching patience and moving goal posts as long as there are still people who will buy tickets and merch regardless the state of the team, and if my anecdotal viewing is any indication, that crowd still outnumbers the angry and the apathetic.

LaBradfordsCreditCard
June 12, 2021 3:38 pm

Agreed 100 percent. Some owners want to win. Some owners want to make money. There are some in both camps, but not many.

PissedOffGorilla
June 13, 2021 6:40 pm

Profit sharing allows owners to get paid regardless of team success.

Ellis5
June 13, 2021 10:00 pm

What?

BasketballHella
June 12, 2021 8:24 am

I’m getting more and more of the feeling that monte is stuck and Vivek is now running this fully via Dumars. Monte is just the next fall guy.

I think that after what we saw at the trade deadline it’s one of the only things that makes sense.

Also it’s the fact that Monte may be new but what’s honestly changed? All these moves or lack of them have the Vivek stink on them. It can’t be said that Mullen, D’Alessandro, Vlade and now McNair all do the same stupid shit over and over?

Mark my words the “big move” will get sold as resigning Holmes if and it’s a big if they resign him. But there was no doubt that Vivek thinks this team is just fine, remember all we have to do is go 2-7 twice instead of 0-9 and we would have been in.

June 12, 2021 8:36 am

I think it’s a little more nuanced than that. I don’t think Vivek and Dumars have much say in whether the Kings chase a Terrance Davis for limited assets trade or if they resign him as long as Monte stays under the tax.

Conversely, if Monte is giving Vivek a heads up that Dallas offered Portzings for a deal centered around Buddy and he’s not talking it … and Vivek is intrigued by the offer or Dumars wants to have a meeting to talk it out … Monte cannot stop that process or it potentially leading to a bad move that he fundamentally disagrees with.

Thus “total control” about 90% of the time, but also no control over the key aspects of the job and his best assets. Like the other 3 GMs under Vivek, where it all funnels to a bad owner with horrible instincts

BasketballHella
June 12, 2021 8:42 am
Reply to  4on5

That’s also my point though if that 10% is the most critical of the job what does the other 90% matter. I think this is why the moving the deck chairs analogy has lasted as a theme for so long under this ownership group.

I can’t believe I’m even saying this now but at least with the Maloofs you knew it was financial ruin for decisions outside of basketball that led to bad decisions or money only decisions. This is worse this is consistent ego and bravado that everyone else around him is wrong he just needs the right people to enact his “vision”.

June 12, 2021 8:53 am

Agreed. The Kings are a poorly run, cash strapped, small market team. Which is why the stories above are always selling that maybe THIS IS THE YEAR that they draw an inside straight (despite the math)

LaBradfordsCreditCard
June 12, 2021 3:42 pm
Reply to  4on5

“All Bagley and Buddy trades have to be approved by me, because I still believe Bagley is better than Luka and Buddy is our Steph Curry … Shakas.”

LaBradfordsCreditCard
June 12, 2021 3:40 pm

Hard part is, they extended Pervis Bagley so they don’t have the money to re-sign Holmes at market value.

AnybodyButBagley
June 12, 2021 10:32 pm

Throwing more money at a player who was injured at the time and has been injured for his entire career was awesome.

Almost as amazing as drafting him.

Falconsfury
June 13, 2021 6:52 pm

You forgot Matina

June 12, 2021 8:26 am

I get why many Kings fans and the local media (who are seeing Kings rating and interest among the general public in town evaporate) desire a big move. But, it’s unclear to me why it’s logical to expect it THIS summer. The cap is really screwed up. Because they chased 10th past the point of reason, the draft pick probably isn’t going to be great. They aren’t moving Fox or Hailburton. They just let the next best asset walk for nothing. Kings fans over value the remaining assets, who have issues other teams will factor into trades when deciding what to send back.

Any big move is going to be hard to execute. A safe big one is almost off the table. So, you’re expecting a second year GM to push many of his remaining chips into the middle with bad cards? If the Kings make a “big move” it’s probably another Vivek special because he still thinks he’s smart enough to circumvent how 25 other teams would play it.

RikSmits
June 13, 2021 4:58 am
Reply to  4on5

Oh, it’s difficult? Let’s just give our FO a mulligan for two seasons, then.

I mean, Monte knew what kind of situation he was signing up for. He gets paid to do the difficult things, not to maintain the status quo (which is entirely shitty) for two whole seasons because big moves are going to be hard to execute.

There are no such things as safe moves, by the way.

In the meantime, other teams are improving, retooling, amassing assets and making deals.

As Jerry Renolds said (paraphrasing): a 4 year plan is not a plan, it’s an excuse to sit on you butt cheeks and get your pay checks.

Kingme18
June 12, 2021 8:57 am

Can we just throw a bunch of money at CP3?

TheGrantNapear
June 12, 2021 2:28 pm
Reply to  Kingme18

When you think about it, signing or trading for CP3 worked for Hou, Phx and even Okc. If CP3 were to stay healthy it would likely equate to an 8th seed.
The problem is fit with Fox and Hali, plus we don’t have the money to sign him anyways.

Kingme18
June 14, 2021 6:33 am
Reply to  TheGrantNapear

Don’t see that as a problem at all. He’s a stud that all of our young guys can learn from. He won everywhere. The ultimate leader and pro and winner. We need a winning culture.

BestHyperboleEver
June 14, 2021 11:01 am
Reply to  Kingme18

Assuming the Kings should go after Paul (which I’m not at all convinced of unless other MAJOR moves are also in the works), I have a hard time imagining why Paul would consider signing with the Kings.

Otis
June 14, 2021 2:43 pm

I have a hard time imagining why Paul would consider signing with the Kings.

Ring chasing, amirite? Hello? Is this thing on?

LaBradfordsCreditCard
June 12, 2021 3:43 pm
Reply to  Kingme18

I would assume that if Phoenix doesn’t win it, CP3 will start the ring chasing portion of his career and sign with Golden State or the Lakers for the MLE or even the vet minimum.

TheGrantNapear
June 12, 2021 4:17 pm

Paul has a $44 million player option for next season. Why would he opt out to sign for the vet minimum lol. It’s already been reported he plans to opt out for one last major contract. Given the way he’s playing, he’ll get it.

LaBradfordsCreditCard
June 13, 2021 1:10 pm
Reply to  TheGrantNapear

Let’s try again, using reading comprehension this time. I’ll type slower for you.

I didn’t say he’d try to leave after this year. Also, Golden State, for example, has nowhere near that kind of money to give him if/when he’s available, unless they unloaded several pieces specifically to acquire him.

Ergo, if he wanted to go to a team like Golden State that’s at or maxed past the salary cap, he would, indeed, for a fact, have to settle for a ring-chasing deal more like the MLE or vet minimum.

Does that make more sense?

TheGrantNapear
June 13, 2021 8:55 pm

No. Your first comment made no sense and you saved no face with this one by trying to spin your comment. It’s okay you didn’t know Paul has a $44 million player option for next season. You seriously thought he is a vet minimum player. Well, he’s in the WCF after dropping 37 in a closeout. I’m sure in your world he’ll be opting out for the mid level this off season.
As you were.

RikSmits
June 13, 2021 4:58 am
Reply to  Kingme18

We’d probably miss.

June 12, 2021 9:14 am

You’re wrong, Greg. The new front office needs time to assess, re-assess, and assess their re-assessment. That’s at least three years right there.

BasketballHella
June 12, 2021 10:05 am

Wait so we are now 3 years away from being 3 years away from being 3 years away?

rockbottom
June 12, 2021 10:29 am

Must remember the Suns, Knicks and Hawks only improved by 20 + games with little if any draft help ! It is done yearly , just not in Kangz land !

TheGrantNapear
June 12, 2021 2:29 pm
Reply to  rockbottom

Great point. It’s not like going from no playoffs to an 8th seed is all that difficult, it just is for the franchise.

Klam
Nostradumbass 18
Nostradumbass 19
Nostradumbass 18
Nostradumbass 19
June 12, 2021 9:18 am

Lol, trying to tell a fanbase who has dealt with suckitude for 15 years (and likely going on for longer) to be patient is a hard sell.

BabalooMagoo
June 12, 2021 1:19 pm
Reply to  Klam

15 years??? Try 25+ out of the last 35. Patience my ass.

TheGrantNapear
June 12, 2021 2:30 pm
Reply to  BabalooMagoo

My favorite factoid about our playoff drought is we haven’t been to the playoffs since the advent of the iPhone. Just astonishing!

LaBradfordsCreditCard
June 12, 2021 3:45 pm
Reply to  BabalooMagoo

To be specific, 7 winning seasons in 36 years. And those seven seasons were in succession, so really 29 straight losing seasons not counting the Webber era.

LaBradfordsCreditCard
June 13, 2021 1:13 pm

LOL, I love the thumb down on this comment … it’s actually just a fact, I’m not making it up.

HongKongKingsFan
June 12, 2021 9:34 am

First of all, does “BIG” roster move means trading away Hield and Bagley ?
If so, then McNair should definitely do it.
If not, then I think we should not make “BIG” roster move

In case of not able to trade away Hield, Bagley..

then just re-sign Davis, Harkless….and maybe Holmes….keep most of the same roster…and calls it an end of the off-season.

As we are retaining Luke Walton as the head coach, and he had experience at coaching this roster……and I don’t prefer/want Walton spending extra time to “work-out” the starter and the 2nd unit againwe need consistency !!!!

PG: Fox, Wright
SG: Tyrese, Davis
SF: Cade Cunningham/ Kuminga, Harkless
PF: Barnes, Metu
C: D. Jones

p.s. I really have faith that we are landing Cunningham/ Kuminga…….just cannot wait for the draft lottery !!!

TheGrantNapear
June 12, 2021 2:31 pm

Your plan makes sense if we land in the top 3; otherwise, picking at 9 likely isn’t changing anything anytime soon.

eddie41
June 12, 2021 9:42 am

it’s usually better to be a smart hitter.

Carl
June 12, 2021 12:31 pm
Reply to  eddie41

You can’t hit the ball if you refuse to swing the bat.

eddie41
June 12, 2021 12:56 pm
Reply to  Carl

He got some clean hits with Wright, Harkless and TD. Haliburton is looking like a stand-up double. Drew a lot of walks not swinging at the garbage offered for Barnes.

Last edited 1 month ago by eddie41
RikSmits
June 13, 2021 5:03 am
Reply to  eddie41

Too bad that these singles came in the 9th, and the Kings down 8 runs and with no bullpen to write home about.

eddie41
June 13, 2021 9:04 am
Reply to  RikSmits

it was a counterpoint to Carl’s comment implying McNair never swung the bat. He did swing and get some nice hits. So again … my initial comment was a truism … it’s usually better to be a smart hitter. If you argue with it, you’ll probably whiff at a splitter in the dirt.

Carl
June 13, 2021 10:20 am
Reply to  eddie41

I see your point, and appreciate your perspective. I would counter that we saw 31 wins McNair’s first season as GM. Same as the season before. Drafting Haliburton was good but lucky. Wright looks like a rotation player for $6 million next season, so competent. I don’t see the rest affecting wins one way or another. It’s not even close to enough improvement.

eddie41
June 13, 2021 10:09 am
Reply to  RikSmits

And to counter your comment that last year was the 9th inning, McNair said his goal is to build a sustained playoff team. Therefore in this baseball analogy, last year was the first inning, or if you go off Fox’s career, it would have been the 4th inning.

rockbottom
June 13, 2021 8:27 am
Reply to  eddie41

What garbage ? Just cover for not making any major trade ! Facts please, not leaked Kings excuses !

eddie41
June 13, 2021 9:09 am
Reply to  rockbottom

James Naismith was the founder of basketball. Aaron Nesmith was advertised as the 6’6” monster with a 6’11” wingspan that the game has evolved into. But his name is not Naismith, it’s Nesmith, and he’s about 6’3” and did not win a single SEC game.

Last edited 1 month ago by eddie41
Falconsfury
June 13, 2021 6:53 pm
Reply to  Carl

lawyerballed

Kingme18
June 12, 2021 10:01 am

The “star”/ “stud” that the Kings get will probably come in the draft. Any trades unless you find another idiot GM/owner for the Kings will probably end up reshuffling the chair on the titanic.

Who has the Kings gotten in the past decade + has result in the Kings getting a bona-fide star. Our best players have always come in the draft (Tyreke, Cousins, Fox etc.)

Maybe the Kings should look for that potential 2nd/3rd best player in a trade.

HongKongKingsFan
June 12, 2021 10:10 am
Reply to  Kingme18

the Kings should look for that potential 2nd/3rd best player in a trade.

which would be the realistic available target ?

I only know KP, Sexton would be on the trading block (and maybe CJ McCollom and A. Gordon too)

but I would rather not trading for one of the above, just keep the flexibility, as the above mentioned players cannot really move the needle.

rockbottom
June 12, 2021 10:31 am
Reply to  Kingme18

Actually not . Richmond and Webber came via trade !

June 12, 2021 10:46 am
Reply to  rockbottom

But they got Richmond because they had the third pick in the draft (and Billy Owens was unsigned on opening night because we were, like now NBA Siberia, and then Warriors mistakenly undervalued Richmond and traded him for a lesser prospect with size.) While the Kings got Webber and Nets pulled Kidd as distressed asset that were obligated to report to bad and undesirable teams around the same time … 20 years later, high end star players often with shorter contacts and more agency can often avoid the 10 worst situations in the NBA.

BasketballHella
June 12, 2021 11:09 am
Reply to  4on5

Couldn’t agree more about the last part. I in no way shape or form see a Webber situation playing out the same way again.

Meaning trade goes down, player says he would rather retire than play here, 2021 Webber gets his forced trade out of hell.

Last edited 1 month ago by BasketballHella
PretendGhost
June 12, 2021 2:46 pm

The last two CP3 trades make me think otherwise. Get a dude locked into a contract and there’s honestly not much he can do if he’s not willing to retire. Being a diva will land you without a job no matter how big your name is — see Melo pre-Portland.

A disappointing season from the right championship hopeful will open up some opportunities. If the Clips and Bucks both go down in the 2nd round, Middleton and/or George might become available due to long term high dollar contracts. Other key players from teams who fail to win the championship may become suddenly available — Ben Simmons, Tobias Harris, Aaron Gordon, Montezl Harrell, Marcus Smart, Jaylen Brown, Bradley Beal, Pascal Siakham all stand out as guys who might be available for the right package.

BasketballHella
June 12, 2021 6:55 pm
Reply to  PretendGhost

Well I agree with that it’s more who is on a contract that is long and is worth the price to acquire that star? I mean to get CP3 in a trade like Phoenix did they got lucky. Paul George? He would take what they gave up. Which is youth and picks. So let’s say it takes fox and a couple picks for George. Are we really better with him?

We don’t really have any assets that are going to help get those guys. Unless it’s all our assets combined.

The reason why I think a disgruntled “star” being traded here isn’t gonna just go quietly along with it is because anyone who has talent isn’t going to want to be the one and only here like Mitch was back in the day. You heard his podcast interview on what happened when he was traded. That was 30 years ago. Paul George or anyone else with talent isn’t gonna just take a trade here. Unless they are on the downward slide and aren’t worth the contract anymore.

LaBradfordsCreditCard
June 12, 2021 3:46 pm
Reply to  rockbottom

For each other!

ForKingsandCountry
June 12, 2021 10:19 am

Do something, don’t do something, I’m not sure it matters as long as Vivek is the owner. He clearly has no interest in building a winning organization. On the plus side, the missed playoff streak is going to be so long that it will NEVER be broken again. I just hope we get a banner when we break the record. It will be the most impressive thing this organization has ever accomplished.

SMF-PDXConnection
June 12, 2021 2:08 pm

If they won’t put up a banner, I’m sure some fans will at the G1C entrance for the last game of next season.

SMF-PDXConnection
June 12, 2021 4:45 pm

comment image

ForKingsandCountry
June 12, 2021 8:14 pm

A handmade banner outside the arena would be awesome. Very fitting.

Adamsite
Nostradumbass 14
Nostradumbass 14
June 13, 2021 3:45 pm

I’d be there to partake. I’ll bring a camping chair and park it next to the ugly Piglet statue I’ll bring a sign that reads something like: “NBA record playoff drought…nice arena though.”

Last edited 1 month ago by Adamsite
ForKingsandCountry
June 13, 2021 10:59 pm
Reply to  Adamsite

Seriously this is the thing I’d show up for at this point. I just feel like this level of ineptitude should be “celebrated”.

Amonk81
June 12, 2021 6:11 pm

Vivek’s ego is and has been running the show. He’s a real piece of shit owner.

It’s the same shit over and over and over. Rehiring Luke. Drafting Bags. Tying up too much money in Buddy and Barnes. Hiring a GM and not letting him do his thing.

This organization is a fucking joke. I’m worried they will barely get into the playin and declare success and keep doing this shit.

The only way out is to bottom
out to a point where fans stop going to games or buying shit.

I am barely paying attention to this team anymore. It’s run by assholes and idiots.

ForKingsandCountry
June 12, 2021 8:16 pm
Reply to  Amonk81

Yeah I mean I really like watching Haliburton and Fox but I really have very little attachment to this team anymore. I was a diehard as they come but now when they lose I just sort of chuckle and move on.

SMF-PDXConnection
June 13, 2021 8:36 am

Honestly, I’ve even soured on Fox a bit because of his Walton support and the losing streak comments just rubbing me the wrong way.

kingsforaday
June 13, 2021 1:57 pm

Plus his suspect hamburger preferences.

Kingsguru21
June 13, 2021 2:13 pm
Reply to  kingsforaday

So much this. I don’t understand why anyone would ever eat at Whataburger OR In N Out. Both are incredibly and ridiculously overrated.

Ellis5
June 13, 2021 9:45 pm
Reply to  Kingsguru21

So everything I read on The Kings Herald related to food is garbage… great….

Last edited 1 month ago by Ellis5
ForKingsandCountry
June 13, 2021 11:01 pm
Reply to  Kingsguru21

I agree with this take. There are so many local places around in most cities that are so much better. They aren’t hard to find either.

BestHyperboleEver
June 14, 2021 11:04 am
Reply to  Kingsguru21

Because they may be the best option you can see from the freeway while driving to get somewhere else?

Kingsguru21
June 14, 2021 11:07 am

That’s not an argument in favor. That’s why fast food is so widespread in American culture.

BestHyperboleEver
June 14, 2021 1:08 pm
Reply to  Kingsguru21

It’s an argument in favor within the context.

Carl
June 14, 2021 8:04 pm
Reply to  Kingsguru21

In-N-Out is good for fast food, but not good compared to real food.

Kingsguru21
June 15, 2021 8:31 am
Reply to  Carl

If that’s the case, Carl, In N Out still sucks as fast food. If it’s any consolation, Whataburger is worse because they have more items on the menu.

TheFifthMookie
June 14, 2021 10:26 am
Reply to  Amonk81

I cannot be a heavy fan of the Kings as long as Walton is the coach. The team has chosen to hitch its wagon to a poorly performing, low character coach. It’s incredibly disappointing.

rockbottom
June 12, 2021 10:23 am

Totally agree and McNair is not to blame for 15 years os suckitude but neither are the ticket buying public ( among leagues highest ) ! This franchise has to show marked improvement or massive defections will occur ! Thousands have already ! Trotting out basically the same roster with a 19 year old draftee and Walton is not patience but failure !😡

WizsSox
June 12, 2021 3:00 pm
Reply to  rockbottom

Will fans really defect? This team has been shitty for the last 15 years and basically were for their first 15. The Kings ranked middle of the pack in pct of arena filled in 2019, last normal season, on the heels of a 13 year playoff drought. I think people will want to get out following pandemic and attendance will probably be decent this year.

It’s a one team town…you put out even a halfway OK product and sales will be alright. Some may not like it, but this area has shown to support pretty much any Kings team as long as there isn’t a cloud of the team moving hanging over them. Only real time attendance figures were down.

Last edited 1 month ago by WizsSox
Carl
June 13, 2021 10:23 am
Reply to  WizsSox

Yep. This nails it!

TheFifthMookie
June 14, 2021 10:28 am
Reply to  WizsSox

I have defected.

Check my comment history here and see that gap. I’m only here today because Greg shared this article on Twitter.

I still proudly sponsor The Kings Herald, I just no longer can tolerate supporting the Kangs until they change their identity and performance.

OG_Aggie
June 12, 2021 10:33 am

Thankfully King’s fans don’t pay his salary.

WillyTrill
June 12, 2021 10:36 am

“In order to lead the orchestra, you must first turn your back to the crowd.”

Monty McNair should do what he thinks is best for the team, regardless of what desperate fans (like me) say or think.

Marty
June 12, 2021 10:59 am

I’m an extremely impatient individual and none of it is going to replace Vivek and Matina, nor will it end the era of Superstar Collusion that we’re watching from the outside in.

They had their chance last year to flip everything of value for picks, including Fox, do it again next year, and tell the fans their box full of firsts is the way to rebuild.

But I’m sure we’ll have a few social justice campaigns and playground dedications this year to distract us from the reality that our owner is likely just waiting to flip his incredible city-provided real estate deal.

RikSmits
June 12, 2021 11:35 am

One the one hand, this is a bit thin, evidence-wise, to reach this conclusion, IMO.

On the other hand, I understand it since it would not surprise me at all.

Carl
June 12, 2021 12:38 pm

Agree that the article is pretty thin. If indeed no move is made this offseason, how long do we have to sit around and wait for this guy to actually do his job?

If we end up with two offseasons and a trade deadline of doing nothing meaningful to improve a .431 team that’s 12th in its conference, that’s negligence, not patience.

June 12, 2021 1:01 pm
Reply to  Carl

Vivek knows where the blame will fall when his third GM flames out. The local media pulled their punches after Vlade’s hire and obvious gaffes. McNair could disembowel Slamson as the halftime show and possibly keep his job. Which is why he took both a bad GM job and a good one.

June 12, 2021 1:04 pm
Reply to  4on5

After the last 15 years, you should assume that Slamson yells “FREEDOM!” as the halftime comes to a close in the hypothetical above

Amonk81
June 12, 2021 6:17 pm
Reply to  4on5

The Sac media will never be real and blame Vivek. This should have happened 3/4 years ago. They just write tepid nothing. They preach patience. He should
be getting eviscerated every day as it is. Fuck Vivek.

WizsSox
June 12, 2021 1:53 pm

Many of us are pretty long time fans…there is plenty of reason to be impatient. We just want a decent product.

That said, being patient and prudent feels like the most likely way to actually get what everyone wants…to improve the team and create a fairly consistent playoff run. Kings have three real assets I see at the moment. Fox, Hali and the pick, likely 9/10.

If moving Hali, are you getting a player that will be appreciably better for the next 2-3 years, considering we don’t know what his trajectory or ceiling is yet? And if they are, do they justify losing Hali on a rookie contract, which is where his value really lies for the next 3 years? How bloated is the contract you get back? He seems part of what you need for future success. Probably not moving him soon.

9th pick? What is that getting you? Even if you package it with Barnes, Buddy, Bagley (take your pick) and even a future pick, doesn’t seem like enough to beat out teams with real assets for a star. (OKC etc)

That leaves you Fox…which unless just dumping him for picks (which some want and while I don’t agree, I understand the point of view) I don’t see getting a player back that is equal to his quality. If they are in the same range of caliber, probably just reshuffling deck chairs. Seems really unlikely he brings you back someone better than him.

There just doesn’t seem to be an obvious move given current cap situation (Barnes, Buddy contracts) and missed top pick (Bagley) to create the “Big move”, that is somehow going to guarantee a playoff berth. Assets aren’t there without just ending up back where you started by trading the few assets you have.

It’s been 15 years of mediocrity, so no we don’t want to hear about process. But Petrie took over in 1994. There were 4 years of mediocre (sub .500) basketball before he pulled his “big move” and traded for Webber. 4 years before he made a splashy free agency grab in Vlade. 4 years until he hired Adelman and the coach that would lead the team to success. He inherited a sub .500 coach and kept St. Jean for 2.5 more years.

All of this led to the only successful era of Kings basketball any of us have ever seen.

Does a turnaround have to take 4 years? Of course not. Taking time also doesn’t guarantee success. But I would rather Monte make moves that he think have value rather than feeling pushed into making moves for the sake of appearing active and defending his job security to fans and ownership by the time next summer rolls around.

Consistency seems to be the major item this team has lacked since the Adelman and Petrie days…I don’t like Walton. But I personally feel encouraged by what Monte has done (or not done) over the past 9 months. I can’t say right now whether Monte is good at his job or not …it’s early. But I’m in the camp of riding him out for a few more years and see what he does. Been 15 years of this shit…there isn’t probably a quick fix.

Last edited 1 month ago by WizsSox
Otis
June 12, 2021 2:54 pm
Reply to  WizsSox

I just believe there are more latitudes outside of “extreme patience” and “recklessness”. I think you have to be aggressive to get better, especially in the Western Conference. The rest of the league isn’t waiting around for us.

It doesn’t take nearly as long to turn a team around in the NBA as it used to, but it does take some intestinal fortitude.

If the Kings swing for the fences, what’s the worst that can happen…they’ll keep missing the playoffs?

WizsSox
June 12, 2021 3:43 pm
Reply to  Otis

Fair…there definitely is an in between area, which I imagine is the path Monte prefers to drive down. I personally think they are a little closer with Fox and Hali as cornerstones to being consistently respectable, than others on here may feel. So I’m not real down to trade one of the few assets they have for a player on a 1-2 year remaining contract to try and make playoffs now.

Just doesn’t seem like there’s an obvious transaction (Based on current cap space and draft pick assets) to really move the needle, but I guess that’s why Monte gets paid. We shall see.

Last edited 1 month ago by WizsSox
Otis
June 12, 2021 4:04 pm
Reply to  WizsSox

True, he will have constraints from an asset/cap standpoint. I think the possibility of a bigger move could be in conjunction with our future first rounders, maybe combined with Barnes.

rockbottom
June 13, 2021 8:36 am
Reply to  WizsSox

One less asset than last season (Bogi ) and likely another when Holmes leaves ! Good franchises use assets and bad lose them !

RikSmits
June 13, 2021 5:10 am
Reply to  WizsSox

We just want a decent product.

Please define what a decent product is.
Because I fear that this FO believes that reaching the 7th of 8th spot and first-round exits can be viewed as a decent product.
And much to my dismay, a big chunk of this fanbase agrees.

WizsSox
June 13, 2021 9:51 am
Reply to  RikSmits

I mean if you could give me a Portland situation of the last 8 years where they made the playoffs every year, even though getting bounced in the first round 5 times, I would sign up right now. They are a decent team, year in and year out. It’s been sustainable.

Comes with it’s own set of frustrations, but I would find entertainment and joy more frequently than the team I currently watch. In the end it’s entertainment and getting consistent playoff games without lifting the trophy at the end, isn’t necessarily a mark of shame.

Now if it’s all in on a one time 7th seed, then yeah I’m out.

Last edited 1 month ago by WizsSox
WizsSox
June 13, 2021 10:18 am
Reply to  WizsSox

In writing that it made me think…Portland currently is almost identical to the “Glory Days” Kings playoff wise. 8 Playoffs each…Kings made it past first round one more time. Each one conference final team.

Those Kings teams were better and more of a threat to win title, but the end playoff results are nearly identical. I don’t know any Blazer fans, but while frustrated at the moment, I would think in 5-10 years they will look back at the Dame era fondly, even though it never resulted in consistent playoff success.

Last edited 1 month ago by WizsSox
RikSmits
June 13, 2021 11:43 am
Reply to  WizsSox

Well, one could argue that this franchise does enough to entertain its fans.

It is interesting how on the one hand (many) Americans are obsessed with winning and being the best etc., but on the other hand see sports more as an entertainment industry than a competition where winning is paramount.

WizsSox
June 13, 2021 3:12 pm
Reply to  RikSmits

They are entertaining in a twisted way. Can’t argue that!

I think attitudes about entertainment/winning probably largely go to your involvement in said activity. I think my attitude about entertainment vs winning would change if I was working out 6 hours a day like players or my livelihood depended on improvement and winning. It’s not, so I take it for what I use it for. A fun distraction for a couple hours here and there and luckily a fun community on here to talk about it.

Id love to see them win. Would be fun…doesn’t change my core daily life at all if they don’t. Others mileage probably varies.

Kingsguru21
June 14, 2021 7:55 am
Reply to  WizsSox

Id love to see them win. Would be fun…doesn’t change my core daily life at all if they don’t. Others mileage probably varies.

Yep. The A’s are consistently successful but aren’t so come playoff time.

But I still enjoy watching them day in day out.

Last edited 1 month ago by Kingsguru21
NinjaFetus
June 12, 2021 2:10 pm

Haven’t posted in a long while because….well, I just don’t care enough about this team/organization at this point. I DO check TKH, because I do want to see if anything is going on. It’s still the same discussions of the last several years though.

Will they/won’t they? Should’ve done this/that. As Kings fans we’ve been through it how many times by now? I do think McNair did what he could to upgrade the bench, but is that the first step down a path that makes the team relevant again or just what he was able or allowed to do by forces above? I’m expecting the latter, because that is par for the course with this team. Not good enough to actually, you know, WIN as a sports team and also not good enough to improve the only other way this team probably would through by the draft. But as of several months ago, this team won’t get another penny or viewership ratings from me until they commit to a path that actually shows they are improving the product on the floor. What that looks like, I’m not sure and frankly at this point don’t care. I’ll do that in nba2k.

TheGrantNapear
June 12, 2021 2:24 pm

TKH,
Just a suggestion, since King’s news is scant these days, it’d be nice to have an open playoff thread every few days.

LaBradfordsCreditCard
June 12, 2021 3:50 pm
Reply to  TheGrantNapear

What are … playoffs? I thought the NBA season was over like a month ago?

TheGrantNapear
June 12, 2021 4:19 pm

At least we’re familiar with the play-in since that’s what Vivek aims for every year.

TheFifthMookie
June 14, 2021 10:29 am
Reply to  TheGrantNapear

I’d log in to participate in playoff watching threads here!

TheGrantNapear
June 12, 2021 2:38 pm

My best guess is Vivek pushes Monte to make a win now move last offseason. Why? Because I’m sure Vivek sees these other teams that had quick turnarounds this offseason and are making a run these playoffs.
Look at Phx with CP3, look at the Knicks and their turn around. Atl is another example. I think Vivek’s fragile ego has turn around envy and will push Monte to trade for a star or a sign and trade for a star.
Heck, CP3 may even be a King next year.
Move Fox off the ball and make him more of a scorer instead of facilitator. And both Fox and Hali could learn from CP3, especially Hali, who reminds me a little of cP3. This has about a one percent chance of happening, and I am not advocating for it, but hey with Vivek, you never know.

Last edited 1 month ago by TheGrantNapear
cbrody
June 12, 2021 3:13 pm

I’ll believe it if I see it but I’m not optimist. It’s been a year and it’s the same coach and probably a worse team (if they are unable to sign Holmes).

the addition of g league level scrubs that played hard for next years contract don’t inspire me.

Convince me otherwise.

LaBradfordsCreditCard
June 12, 2021 3:37 pm

Shut your ass, Vlonty McDivac.

Some of us have been here since 1985 and have been patient enough.

Do something besides looking like the kind of guy who hands out towels at the front desk of the local gym.

LaBradfordsCreditCard
June 12, 2021 3:53 pm

Here’s where I’m stuck. I like about eight of our players. The ones I’m willing to get rid of don’t really have a market … ergo, they’re not tradeable.

This is hands down the most “hamster wheel” organization in sports.

TheGrantNapear
June 12, 2021 4:20 pm

I think we have tradeable players and contracts, problem is, they’re not worth much. And I think our FO thinks they’re worth much more than other FO’s.

Otis
June 12, 2021 4:33 pm
Reply to  TheGrantNapear

I think outside of Fox and Haliburton, they’d need to include future firsts to really pull something off.

June 12, 2021 5:28 pm
Reply to  Otis

The team leveraging future 1st(s) to chase the 8th seed, making it once, Fox pushing his way out and suffering the fall out for a long time would be so Kangz.

NorCalKingsFan
June 12, 2021 6:47 pm

Does anyone have an opinion on what it would take to get D. Hunter from ATL? IMO, he is a difference maker but it would probably be too expensive.

I think it would start with Barnes, Bagley and a first (I begin negotiations by offering the 2024 top 3 protected). It would probably mean we would also need to take back Gallinari’s salary and add other picks, I wouldn’t exceed 2nd rounders but I’d give up around 4 of them if it got the deal done.

Personally, I’d rather wait for the draft to see if we could knab S. Barnes but Hunter is a proven defender (who could be elite) and has a decent 3pt shot (36% in 19, 33% in 20). We’d be swapping Barnes for Hunter (who better fits the Kings timeline) and Bagley for Gallinari (who could be the team’s older hand & mentor) and giving ATL a 1st rd pick in the process. The Kings would take on more long-term salary in the trade but we would at least turn Bagley into something positive and get younger in the starting lineup with Hunter’s potential as a bona fide 3&D wing.

ATL gets a 1st rd pick, sheds some long-term salary, and receives a player in Barnes that offers positional flexibility, is healthier than both Gallinari and Hunter, and who better fits their timeline (which is now).

A starting lineup of:
Fox/Hali/Hunter/Metu/Holmes

2nd unit:
Wright/Hield (or James if Hield is traded)/Davis/Gallinari/Jones

ForKingsandCountry
June 12, 2021 8:18 pm
Reply to  NorCalKingsFan

I think it would take a ton. Before his injury this year he looked like a legitimate two way weapon. I think we’d have move to Haliburton or multiple first round picks to get a player of his caliber and at this point I still don’t know if Atlanta would do it.

NorCalKingsFan
June 12, 2021 9:52 pm

Yeah, I thought so too (in regards top ATL not really being interested). I really like that kid and I think he’d make the team immediately better. The only reason it would ever happen is if ATL were in need of a salary dump to resign Collins (Barnes is declining whereas Gallinari’s salary increases each year and Bagley would come off after one year or resigned much cheaper).

ForKingsandCountry
June 13, 2021 11:06 pm
Reply to  NorCalKingsFan

At this point I’m not sure they don’t value Hunter over Collins. But we’ll see this summer I suppose. If there were a way to get Hunter I’d be all over it.

Mike120
June 12, 2021 8:03 pm

Three factors out of the Kings control. First, it’s a small market team with limited marketing opportunities for players. Second, California is a very high income tax state. Third, big name players now have more control than ever before and a handful of them are recruiting/building super teams. Kings don’t have that superstar who can pull in other stars. For the Kings to improve its going to be thru the draft and player development. It may get better thru trades but only if we get lucky trading vets for youth that develop into stars. Having the right coach to develop the youth is key. I don’t think we have that now.

Last edited 1 month ago by Mike120
andy_sims
June 12, 2021 9:53 pm

“Inaction is a failure.”

You honestly can’t come up with a single example where doing nothing isn’t better than doing something stupid?

That bullshit trade with Philly was “doing something.” Signing Luke Walton the day after he was fired was “doing something.” Am I the only one that would have preferred that VD wait more than a few hours after landing on Luke Walton to possibly reconsider?

Christ, firing Mike Malone was “doing something.”

Bearing the cap situation in mind, the moves McNair has made since last summer have been solid, if predictably unspectacular. How has this front office’s spontaneity worked out over the past several years?

This is the kind of genius thinking that is going to end up with all of us suffering through three years of Porzingis doing his rehab in Sacramento instead of Dallas.

WizsSox
June 12, 2021 10:35 pm
Reply to  andy_sims

comment image

Otis
June 13, 2021 6:53 am
Reply to  andy_sims

Theoretically, “doing something” with a qualified GM is better than doing it with Vlade in charge.

Unless you assume similar moronic behavior from McNair?

andy_sims
June 14, 2021 8:56 am
Reply to  Otis

The article isn’t about VD, it’s about McNair, and the bold statement that doing nothing is tantamount to failure.

Last edited 1 month ago by andy_sims
Otis
June 14, 2021 2:46 pm
Reply to  andy_sims

You mentioned VD’s moves twice in the comment I replied to…LOL

RikSmits
June 13, 2021 7:39 am
Reply to  andy_sims

I read the article but saw nothing indicating that McNair should make a “spontaneous”move.

Unless you think that doing something significant in the first year is rash for a GM?

andy_sims
June 14, 2021 9:02 am
Reply to  RikSmits

Reread it. The headline itself reads “inaction is failure.” And if you want to get hung up on the word “spontaneity,” I suppose it would be all right if we looked at VD’s moves as studied, well-researched, and deliberate.

Carl
June 13, 2021 10:37 am
Reply to  andy_sims

You seem to always make this about doing nothing or doing something stupid. There is a third choice: McNair doing his job to improve the team. This cannot happen by doing nothing.

andy_sims
June 14, 2021 9:14 am
Reply to  Carl

Well, when you put it that way, duh. The headline is clear: Inaction is failure. It

I didn’t say that doing nothing was a way to improve the team, only that action for its own sake to please fans is a dumb way to run a team. See previous GM if you need a refresher.

Obviously, moves need to be made to make the team better. I never said that it wasn’t. I also didn’t say that doing nothing was better than doing something, as though it was a binary choice. Everything that I said stemmed from the headline, “inaction is failure.” If it was somehow unclear that I meant anything other than doing nothing may be preferable to doing anything, then I’ll work a little harder next time.

Would you be all right with trading for Porzingis? Would that be better than not doing anything?

Carl
June 14, 2021 11:24 am
Reply to  andy_sims

I don’t like Porzingis or his salary, but the team’s choices aren’t that or sit around for a year.

BestHyperboleEver
June 14, 2021 12:14 pm
Reply to  andy_sims

Depends on the details of the Porzingis trade and the duration of the “doing nothing.”

In general, since we’re talking in dichotomies, I’d prefer they fail while “daring greatly” rather than succeed in maintaining mediocrity. I personally don’t see a 35-win as meaningfully different than a 20-win season.

WizsSox
June 12, 2021 10:47 pm

Just gonna leave this here, when discussing inaction is failure. Fun walk down memory lane ; )

https://www.sactownroyalty.com/2015/7/1/8882233/analysis-the-philadelphia-trade-isnt-as-bad-as-it-may-seem

This isn’t to dig at the writer back on STR days, because I had a similar take. I rationalized it. I notice a few of us did. I know that personally, my ideas about team building have changed the last 5 years.

We can feel that inaction equals complacency, but I’d gladly take that over this type of action. Desperate people force desperate moves…which usually leads to poor outcomes.

Here’s to Monte not feeling desperate.

Last edited 1 month ago by WizsSox
Otis
June 13, 2021 6:54 am
Reply to  WizsSox

I’d hope McNair is smarter than Vlade, but we’ll need to see more first.

RikSmits
June 13, 2021 7:40 am
Reply to  Otis

Very low bar there, but yeah.

Otis