What is up with Kings players and thumb injuries? For the third straight year, a Kings player has been diagnosed with a bad thumb injury, this time as Keegan Murray will be out at least 4-6 weeks with a torn UCL in his left hand. Keegan’s the team’s only true wing player, and arguably the team’s best defender, often tasked with guarding the opposing team’s best player. An already thin position has now been made even thinner with the season just around the corner. With just two preseason games remaining, those games are more crucial than ever in deciding how the Kings navigate this early portion of the schedule without one of their most important players. As far as I see it, Doug Christie has limited options available to him.
Option A: The boring but safe route – Dario Saric
If this injury had happened last season, Trey Lyles almost certainly would have been elevated to the starting lineup, or if it was in the later part of the season, Jake LaRavia. Lyles and LaRavia are no longer on the team however, but the Kings do have another stretch 4 that has some veteran experience now in Dario Saric. Saric isn’t the exciting option, but he is a player who has plenty of NBA experience, will space the floor with his outside shooting (career 36% from three) and should at least provide a modicum of stability. Defensively he isn’t going to be bringing much, but there probably isn’t a great option on that end of the floor right now for the Kings anyway.
Option B: The less boring but less safe route – Isaac Jones
Isaac Jones is an ideal candidate to step into Murray’s role, as his athleticism is something the Kings frontcourt currently lacks. Jones is much more of a true 4 than Keegan however, and I do worry about the spacing while he’s on the floor. While he’s been incredibly efficient so far in his limited NBA action, 90+% of his FGA have come within 10 feet. Even at the G-League level, Jones never showed a ton of range, making just 26.3% of his attempts on that end of the floor on just 3.2 shots a game. A frontcourt of DeMar DeRozan, Isaac Jones and Domantas Sabonis would see the paint incredible crowded as opposing teams dare the Kings to shoot.
Option C: The start your best players route – Keon Ellis
This option is one that I don’t think will happen as the starting lineup but probably will happen throughout games. Ellis is the team’s most capable defender outside of Murray, and moving him into the starting lineup at least gives the Kings some strength on that end while not losing too much, if anything, offensively. The issue of course is moving LaVine up to SF and DeRozan up to PF which is fine on offense but will be incredibly demanding and likely ineffective on the other end. It might be worth it to just have our best players on the floor however.
Option D: The exciting and forward thinking route – Nique Clifford or Maxime Raynaud
Now if Coach Christie goes with Option D, I will be intrigued. Both A and B are safer routes, but putting one of the young guys in such an important position early might be the best for the team going forward. Let’s be honest: this team should be focused on developing the youth because this team is closer to a full rebuild than it is to contender status. Throwing these guys into the fire early might have some growing pains, but it’s at least building towards something and could pay off down the road as that experience will be invaluable. Also, look at the other options. What’s it really going to hurt by giving a chance to these young players instead? Clifford and Raynaud could be a real part of the future of this team, and giving them meaningful minutes now could pay dividends in the long run. It would also give the Kings some interesting new looks. Raynaud is 7’1 which paired with Sabonis would give the Kings some actual size up front. He’s also showcased some nice passing skills in summer league as well as blossoming ability to stretch the floor from distance. Clifford is a jack of all trades who has shown the ability to be a secondary playmaker while also offering some defensive length and intensity on defense as well. Yes, this would be a big jump in responsibility for either player, but what do the Kings have to lose by trying at this point? Plus, it’s not like they’ll be out there on their own as the Kings will be surrounding them with their best players. This is the exact type of environment that Keegan Murray thrived in during his rookie season.
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It’s clear which option I would choose, but I’m less optimistic the Kings will go that route despite some signs that Maxime Raynaud may get the nod given he was practicing with the starters the other day. We’ll know more following these next couple of preseason games, and I’d love to see the Kings use both games to test out different options, because what is preseason for if not for experimenting? I think it’d also be a good idea to get one of the young guys some starting experience now because come February, a couple of these starting roles might just open up if the Kings look to offload some of their veterans by the deadline and having some experience there already would make the transition easier. And when Keegan comes back, having these young guys involved early on could open up some more intriguing lineup options as well.
Option E –
Can Roy Al play a forward? His big head has some real perimeter defense possibilities.
Start Nique and lean in to the “speed” that I heard this team is planning on playing with.
Keegan got thrown in as a rookie after the KZ Okpala experiment died after a few games. He’s an older rookie that they drafted to play right away and contribute.
Kings are going to be bad either way, so see what the rookie has to offer.
Might be the way DC goes, he did start Nique in the 2nd half against POR. I don’t like the option of Raynaud that much, if by this point he’s struggling to beat out Eubanks as the backup 5.
has anyone seen Harry Giles?
Skal is still hanging around.
I would tune in to every game just to support him if they brought him back. He’s the best dude. Met him once.
I’m more interested in this team now that my favorite player is out 6 weeks.
how absolutely insane is that to say?!?!
F this management and ownership team
I can’t wait to the spin from the front office on this one. Carmichael Dave sounded defeated this morning on 1140, can’t wait to hear the spin from Kyle Draper this afternoon
I get that injuries happen, but the appalling roster construction makes this an own goal to me
I think playing the rookies, neither of whom were exactly lottery picks out of position is crazy
Lord knows what the front office will do now
They are still going to sign Russell Westbrook.
I’m figuring Vivek is still planning to go full-bore on trying to acquire Westbrook, despite this Keegan injury development. I’m curious to see how Perry spins it.
1320 will still blame Monte for the poor depth at the wing position. They blame him and Wes for everything.
Listened to the fellas in the afternoon and they were surprisingly optimistic about this roster last week, wonder what they will say today
that and the effusive praise of Perry when he’s done all of secured draft picks and wasted the contract that was Valenciunas. And whatever his role may or may not have been in the Fox for an albatross trade (no offense to Lavine but there is no team in the league besides this goofy front office that makes that trade.) Oh, and let’s not forget the massive overpay for Shcroeder, who so far has looked completely gassed after his stellar summer run.
But you know, great GM, def a players GM who knows how to talk to people. A real leader. Def not a smooth talking car salesman on a rich man’s teat or whatever that old saying is.
1320 is Kenny Caraway and Barling?
Barling is sometimes ok, I can’t listen to Caraway.
Yeah, those two have a show and then James Ham and Kyle Madson are on before them Kyle gets on my nerves at times, maybe its his youthful verbage/takes that bugs me.
They should make a move with DeRo, Carter & a 1st going out….let’s get a bigger, defensive SF or PF in here finally!!
We need another player that is 6869 and can play the three and four even if we had a healthy Keegan Murray, Nique is a small 3 and should not play the 4.. you can play a little it of Maxime and Sabonis Together, but they will get towards defensively if they have a quick forward on the other team. We already struggle with teams that have a bunch of 6’7”-6’9” guys.. I say we try to get a guy like Wade from Cleveland. If we can’t get Terry Eason or even a Jonathan Isaac, but Jonathan Isaac has obvious health issues.
Dariq Whitehead was just waived by the Nets. He had some injury history, so maybe he is a reclamation project as a 6’7 SF.
I saw that he was 6’6” I guess it would depend on how he has healed from his shin surgery, and it didn’t kill him on his athleticism. But he does have some good intangibles… here are some thoughts outside of Ben Simmons who could play 3/4 as long as we had shooters.. I could see a lineup of Lavine, Sabonis, Simmons, DeRozan, and then have Ellis or Nique on the floor. You have enough playmaking with Nique and Simmons
Top 5 Forwards to Monitor
I picked those based on mix of prior NBA exposure, size, positional fit, and the possibility that they could step in without being a total unknown.
Guys like John Collins, Cam Whitmore, Tari Eason, Jonathan Isaac, Cam Johnson, etc. were all discussed on this site as potential targets that would make sense for the Kings. The team decided to go in a different direction with Schroder and more “bigs” instead.
Not sure why certain deals won’t get done, but damn, the Kings are way behind the curve on having a modern day NBA roster with long, athletic wings/forwards.
Everyone of those guys would be great..heck had we traded for Collins instead of DDR we would look a lot different..
Apparently the word was that Mike Brown didn’t want him or else he likely would of been a King right now.
There is the other, other option: Eubanks!
Whoppee!
(and for those IFKYK: that would be in the butt, Bob)
Trade the other 4 starters, develop the youth and rebuild!
That’s what a competent organization would do, but not this franchise.
This might be a God sent in disquise. Let’s start getting rid of the old and bring in the new. Example trade Carter to the Nuggets and maybe a second for Peytyon Watson. A power forward who needs work on his offense but boy can he play defense. He is a shot blocking high moto
r rebounding young player just waiting to add more playing time.
Trade Keon Ellis tto the Rockets for Tari Eason. You might have to add a protected first but what you are getting is a starting power forward to replace Murray until he gets well then play them together. Can’t get better defenders and rebounders than that.
Next comes DDR and lastly Sabonis. But for now let’a shore up that PF position
This is the only answer.
With all due respect to the commenst that are dredging up uninspiring names from the pre-used NBA Bargain Bin, who cares if there might be someone who maybe can hold the fort for a little bit, just so we’ll have another uninspiring play-in run?
Play the youngsters, sign some other youngsters that may have a tiny chance to become something and hope that you can unload the veterans at some sort of return.
This team, with or without Keegan, is going nowhere. Just a bit faster without him, and in a even less interesting manner.
I only mentioned gap fillers because I doubt they have the courage to tear down and rebuild
The season is over before it has even begun. In all seriousness, the Kings just lost their best wing defender and lowest usage member of the core rotation for what will likely be 25% of the season. Why does his low usage matter? Whoever replace him will most likely not contribute like Keegan, on either end of the floor. This mens more shots and usage for guys like Monk, DDR, and LaVine. Get ready for a nauseating dose of ISO and ugly basketball. The Kings could easily have three 20PPG scorers on a pace for 30 wins, just like the DMC, Rudy, IT squad of 2013-14.
IMO, they are going to be close to 15 games below .500, regardless of who they play, by the time Keegan is ready to return and contribute. The die is cast.
Asking the age old question: How does one route for this team?
Steer clear.
I’ll be routing away from Golden One for the foreseeable future, that’s for sure.
Highway to basketball hell – AC/DC
Indeed. https://store.kingsherald.com/product-category/basketball-hell/
Dirty tees, done dirt cheap!
I stopped doing that awhile ago. What’s the point?
The route less-traveled
The Road to Perdition
The King should relocate to another city without Vivek
Why should the Kings leave, Vivek is the one who sucks. Ship him to a different city and let someone that is competent run the Kings.
BRB. Calling ICE.
On a side note, does anyone want to take over the fantasy basketball team that was managed by RORDOG (RIP legend!)?
In case folks are wondering its a TKH fantasy league that is free and very casual. Many of us commenters are in the league.
OMG, not sure how but I didn’t realize that league was managed by RorDog. damn.
I’d be fine with running it if no one else wants to but how? Did he have a second league manager that can pass the torch? I’d be fine to start another league if y’all want, too, whatever works but I sure was looking forward to the season so let me know!
On a side note, Damien Barling had a RorDog shoutout a couple of weeks back. He obviously knew the situation as well but apparently had met him on at least one occasion and had nothing but nice things to say on the show, shoutout to D-Lo.
You said “team”, not league, was just trying to be helpful, sorry!
In doing some very rough math, should Saric start in place of Keegan, the Kings would have the third oldest starting lineup in the league, third only to the Clippers and Warriors. Kings would have just one guy under 30 starting, and that is Sabonis who is 29.
Bad news for the Kings and Coach Doug Christie–who I’m really rooting for, despite the ugly roster imbalances.
I’ve personally had this injury (also known as a gamekeeper’s thumb) and Fox’s injury (PIP collateral ligament tear in pinky, the most vulnerable joint) from playing basketball. Both severely impact dribbling, passing, catching and shooting as well as playing defense, and require extensive rehab beyond the post-surgical period. Fortunately Keegan can remain conditioned while he recovers.
I like option D, but the glaring hole on the Defense is going to hurt no matter who fills the role. This was a vulnerability new GM Perry failed to address in the offseason–no disrespect to Saric, but we lost alot with Lyles’s and LaRavia’s departures.
OT: Howard Beck over at the Ringer has an article on each NBA team’s “clarity index,” meaning franchises with a clear plan and who know what they are doing. To no surprise he has Sac in the bottom tier. He even drops the “Kangz” moniker in the piece. He had the Kings ranked much higher in last year’s pre-season rankings.
Key take-away:
“(Prediction: The Kangz are gonna be in this tier for many years to come.)”
Yup.
But they don’t put butts in seats.
Honestly what is the best case for both of these guys, to me if they were a league average starter or bench player that would be great. Anything more than that is asking for two much
In any competent organization, Maxime, being the #42 pick, probably gets the lion’s share of minutes in Stockton and only dresses in Sac for emergencies or much later in the season. He’d get called up to the parent club to sit in street clothes for many of the home games, and probably doesn’t travel much.
Nique would likely be 9th to 11th in rotation. He’s a late first round pick that probably doesn’t get a lot of minutes on a team that normally picks late in the first round. Check out the dudes who were drafted right before and after him. Asa Newell and Jase Richardson. Heard of them? Neither are expected to be contributors on the Hawks and Magic.
I feel we need to temper our expectations of Nique and Maxime. If the Kings were gunning for lottery placement like Utah or Brooklyn then hell yeah, play the younglings. The problem is, Sac brass thinks this is a playoff team and are going to give 33+ minutes every night to LaVine, DDR, Sabonis, Dennis and Monk.
Does Dario Saric? Or literally anyone else on this roster? I also doubt winning 28 games will put butts in seats but we’ll see.
This is good.
Every option kinda sucks. They won’t lose every game while Keegan is out, but they will lose most of them (which isn’t necessarily a bad thing).
4-6 weeks before being evaluated again. That could be an even longer absence. He might not be back until sometime December. So like 25 or 30 games? Kings might go like 7-20 during that time.
Yeah, in James Ham’s blog, The Kings Beat, he alluded to the fact that 4-6 is just recovery and his next evaluation. It could then take Keegan another week or two to hit the court, baring any set backs. I’m thinking he’s out for at least the first 25%. What is the point of rushing him back if they are already a dozen games below .500 by then?
I know I’m in the pessimistic club on here, but 4-16 over the first 20 games is. very real possibility.
Even with Keegan I thought a start like that was reasonable. Now that he is out? Yikes.
You forgot Option Kangz: Start Monk at the 2. Yikes!
You beat me to it. I could totally see the Kings (as directed by Vivek) to just simply try and outscore their opponent every night, defense be damned. Dennis, Monk, LaVine, DDR, Sabonis is a lineup I’ll bet we see a lot of. Reno Bighorns Grinnell system for the win.
And Vivek’s cherry-picking dreams are realized. Leave Sabonis in the backcourt to “guard 94 feet”, then have the 4 guards rebound and outlet to him.
What could possibly go wrong?</s>
I think a modified Grinnell system might actually work in the regular season if the right kind of team tried it. It’s just asks questions that normal NBA defensive schemes have no answer for, in much the same way that the 2008 Miami Dolphins were able to confuse their regular season opponents by running a college wildcat offense.
Of course it will get killed in the playoffs when teams start game planning hard for it but it could be fun
This entire roster collectively isn’t worth a 1st round pick.
Maybe Blake Griffin is tired of making cringy commercials and could be brought on?
I doubt he’s in shape but that would be super fun. Monk and Blake Pizza Guys commercials would be amazing.
Okay don’t take this personally…
Kings fan: “We drafted Keegan to alter this franchise and he hasn’t.”
Also Kings fan: “OMG Keegan is out we are so screwed.”
????
“What King’s fans need to understand is…”
1) I don’t recall anyone claiming Keegan would alter the course of the franchise
2) Kings are screwed no just because they lost their best wing defender but arguably more because of the gaping hole behind him in the rotation.
That plus front office mismanagement.
Keegan sacrificed his own thumb so we can tank. Guy is playing chess while the franchise plays checkers.
More like, the Kings are playing chess while 29 other teams are playing basketball.
Lmao that’s a good one. Gonna have to use that again in the future.
I’ve long thought the solution to the Kings roster imbalance would be to acquire a true rim protecting 5, and move Sabonis to the 4. Preferably get a “unicorn” type 5 who can also shoot the deep ball a little bit.
Something along the lines of Mo Bamba or even Bol Bol… but both of those guys have been signed in the last month.
I think Sabonis was maximized when he was playing alongside Myles Turner in Indy.
Not sure who they could get… and I don’t feel like researching it, since they’re just gonna do the dumbest thing possible anyway.
“Keegan is down for 2 months, get Monte Morris’s agent on the phone. We need another PG.”
I imagine every team is looking for that unicorn rim protecting/three point shoot big in the mold of Chet and Wemby. Zinger probably could have been had and the Hawks didn’t give up much to get him, but Perry was too busy focusing on point guards. Johnathan Isaac might be available, but he too comes with some serious risk.
I’m not saying there’s no possibility this could work with the right player, but as a Pacers/Kings fan I can vouch that Sabonis was decidedly NOT optimized next to Miles Turner. Both players got better when they weren’t sharing the floor together.
Baylor Scheierman
Another SG?
Ok, so looking at the tiers of clarity from the Ringer (h/t Adamsite), the problem with the teams on the low tiers is that it’s hard for any of them to go up or down dramatically. For example, no one in those lower tiers can make a sensible trade for Lauri Markennen, Sabonis or Zion. Most teams at the bottom lack tradable picks or players except Utah, and who are they going to really cash in for?
In order for the Kings to turn their assets into anything without just getting cap space, they’d need a buyer on DDR (few teams interested, most with limited assets), Lavine (who has salary to trade for him where it makes sense?) or Monk (not happening as we’ve seen). Their one truly tank worthy chip is Sabonis, but who is trading for him that could really move up with keeping their core in place? OKC? The problem with the Kings trying to tank properly is that no one who could trade for Sabonis has the requisite contracts/picks/competitive team to make trading for him really move the needle. I think he’s with us for a while unless someone randomly thinks he’s going to push them to contender status.
However, after some digging, one trade that clarifies both situations would be Kings trying to retool properly and Suns trying to rebuild properly.
Kings Up, Suns Down in 3 way trade
Kings get Booker and small contracts
Suns get Monk, Carter, most of our picks/swaps, and Terry Rozier/Fontechio from Heat
Heat get DeMar DeRozen and Saric
This gives the Kings a huge investment in a starting lineup of Booker/Sabonis/Lavine/Murray/Schroder and a 3 year window with this team to try to make real noise. Suns clear the way to truly tank and open up a ton of cap space, and Heat get a direct upgrade in DDR.
Suns would have Monk and Carter on smaller deals, but would clear a ton of space and get some picks to try to rebuild with.
Call me crazy, but Miami getting DDR/Sarich for Rozier/Fontecchio seems like a win for them, too.
I’m not sure Phoenix is all that interested in tanking because their picks,
except for 2027, are heavily encumbered until 2032.Only getting one bite at the lottery apple may not be worthwhile for them unless that is projecting to be a banger of a class.https://basketball.realgm.com/nba/draft/future_drafts/team
Edit: Misread that mess of trades they did, they just flat out don’t control their pick until 2032
You make some very good points about potential markets for the Kings “stars” Rebuilding teams are going to want them and contenders can’t afford them. There are, I feel few teams in the East that may swing for guys like the because of how wide open things are over there. NY and the Cavs seems set with their teams and they are the likely contenders to win the conference, but teams like the Magic, Heat, Pistons, and Atlanta might come calling if their seasons go the right way.
I might be in the minority with this opinion, but I think Sabonis could be very good for Miami next to Bam. His playmaking could be a boon a lot of those players down there. Miami have the contracts, youth, and picks that could pull it off if they wanted.
ATL is very dark horse, but imagine if they could somehow pair Zinger with Sabonis. Would they part of with Risacher, Okongwu, and/or Jalen Johnson for an all in move?
As to DDR and/or Monk, I still feel they could be of great help to the Magic. Orlando’s offense leaves a lot to be desired so scoring minded pair of Monk or DDR could take them to the next level and into a deep playoff run. Having Monk behind Bane and Suggs could elevate him back to 6th man levels.
LaVine is the tricky one, but man he could be lethal in between Cade and Ausar on the wings in Detroit. Getting the contracts would be difficult, but if they included Tobias Harris and some youth (Ivey, Holland II?), they could get it there.
These are all totally hypothetical, but I do feel those middling playoff teams in the East may make a big swing to go all in with the Celtics and Indy taking a gap year.
OT: The Rockets are the anti-Kangz
I’d rather have a team that is too big than one that is too small.
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….that’s what she said.
When they go tall, we go small!
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