The Sacramento Kings announced their preseason schedule on Thursday. The Kings will begin preseason on October 4th against the Phoenix Suns and finish October 14th against the Los Angeles Lakers.
The full preseason schedule:
Oct 4 vs Suns
Oct 6 at Clippers
Oct 11 at Trail Blazers
Oct 14 vs Lakers
Tickets go on sale on Monday, August 23rd.
I like it, no pushovers in the bunch. Hard to say how much stars will play in the exhibitions, but I’m looking forward to seeing what the defense looks like with the newer additions.
That’s a good take, maybe the defense will take hold. And who knows, maybe our main guys come into camp in the best shape of their lives, and really worked on improving their game.
I think pre-season defense may be an oxymoron.
Great choice for a cover pic!
About six weeks left to not run the same core roster back again this season. Anyone have an idea how often trades happen from this point in the offseason until training camp?
In a normal offseason I would say not many. But this offseason is only 3 weeks old and only really going to be here for 8 weeks or so. Most offseasons last closer to 16 weeks.
Yeah, I don’t expect much. Simmons may be the last domino that could affect the Kings, but I’m really not seeing how much could change between now and preseason.
I still think Simmons gets traded before the start of camp, but I think it will be right before. Philly will hold out as long as they can before lowering the price.
I don’t think there is any way the Sixers can go into the season with Simmons on the roster – both their coach and super-max center have expressed a profound lack of confidence in him. Once it becomes apparent that Dame isn’t going anywhere then Morey will have to start looking at the other offers. Until then, everybody is on hold for the Dame dream though.
Only way the Kings get Simmons is if they include Fox. I don’t how to feel about that.
I like Fox, but if defense and ball movement are truly going to be the identity of this team, then the answer is obvious.
Right now, yes – Fox would absolutely be a requirement. If Simmons is untraded going into training camp and the Blazers are a hard “no” on Dame, though, that calculus has to change – Morey will be forced to choose the best offer he can get because I don’t think starting the season with Simmons on the roster is a viable option for the Sixers
Except Morey may just be enough of a “players = assets, not people” type of thinker to disregard the personal impact of keeping Simmons on the team.
Morey might feel that way but Doc Rivers sure doesn’t. My only question is can the Kings get a deal done without Davion Mitchell. I’m thinking yes.
Morey won’t come down off his price or he’ll get Dame. Or the pressure will necessitate a move and that’s what ultimately pushes this across the finish line.
I’m going to note I think Barnes, Baglet and 2 lightly protected FRPs gets this done.
The 76ers don’t want rookies or picks, unless they are routed to another team like Was so that Philly ends up Beal.
The problem is Morey is being completely unreasonable with his demands. The idea he can get Harden-like deal is just stupid. Hou was rebuilding, so young players and draft assets worked.
Morey wants a better package (an Allstar level player and mult FRPs) for a player who isn’t even on the same level as Harden.
Fuck Morey, let him bring Simmons back, if he’ll even report to training camp.
Morey isn’t the only part of this equation. There’s Rivers and Embiid, too. Ownership as well. The Sixers are about 5 million over ther luxury tax line. There’s alot of things to consider here.
I don’t think FRPs are out of the question here due to the financial and asset factor. Simmons has a 15% trade kicker, that means were he to be traded his contract is worth a tick under 38 million this season assuming his trade kicker isn’t waived by Simmons.
But, there’s also the next 3 years and that makes his remaining deal 4 years for 166,486,520$$ with his 15% trade kicker included. I suppose you could hope Simmons waives his bonus, but I wouldn’t bet on it. That’s alot of cheddar.
Point is, Morey is asking for whatever he can get. But he’s not getting a James Harden like return because Ben Simmons isn’t worth that type of return.
You are right. Harden can shoot and this is basketball where shooting matters.
I agree completely.
I calculated the trade kicker wrong. It’s around 19 million or so, not 16 million.
So if you think Ben Simmons is worth 4/170, okay, more power to you I guess. But I don’t think he is. That extra salary makes it tougher, not easier, to trade Simmons.
I still would rather have Siakam.
Agree. Morey might not care about Simmonds if he does not get HIS trade but Doc has to deal with the locker room. Embiid takes up a lot of psychological space. IMO Fox is better than Simmonds- more functional at a critical position. So hard no on that. I know Simmonds passes, runs, rebounds and plays D but he can’t shoot. A 5 man group can have one of those but that one is complimentary. Philly has not won anything with him and a far better cast of teamates than the Kings.
I suspect that Morey holds out for an unrealistic deal but gets burned when the rest of the team quits on Doc.
We don’t need Simmons to shoot. He takes the Draymond Green role. And Simmons can more than likely play the roll at a more superior rate. Excellent passing, rebounding, he’ll get a dunk in here and there…his defense. He’s the difference maker that puts us at a 5 or 6 seed, ESPECIALLY if we buy into team defense. Simmons is first team All Defense. Bring Metu and others in for scoring. Simmons also helps us the speed up our game. We can lock opponents down and run them off the floor at the same time. Davion Mitchell said something to the nature of “we’re not trying to outscore them, we’re trying to stop them from scoring”. I know it’s misquoted. Someone will correct me.
Monte REALLY needs to make this move. Stop being scared. A trade for Simmons is this generation’s Chris Webber trade. CWebb is a HoFer now. We can’t blow this opportunity.
Baglet! Nice!
Execs across the league have already confirmed that Fox is worth more than Simmons. There zero chance Fox is traded, unless it were for someone considerably better like Dame
F that. Fox stays.
Kings would be stupid drunk to trade for Simmons, but I guarantee they are thinking about offering up a boatload of first rounders. Fox should be off the table, but I fear he’s included in any offer.
Last season’s issues were less about the core than it was about depth and defense. Remember the Kings posted two top 5 lineups last year. The defense should be better and the depth improved. Although I question how much better the defense has improved with Bags and Hield still on the roster. Wondering if the other guys can cover them up enough.
Yeah, I see in the net rating that those lineups are supposedly “better” than the Suns starting lineup, and almost as good as the Bucks, in spite of multiple players in that lineup being neutral or negative overall players. Color me extremely skeptical.
Skepticism is fair. It’s surprising by eye test for me too. But 400 mins is 400 mins for both lineups and it’s a pretty damn good sample. One of the larger ones in the league if we are to make anything of that net rating data. Which I think says something. 80-90% of the 5 man teams in the approx top 20 of those net ratings are playoff teams (if remembering correctly). Kings have 2 of those line ups.
The only net negative ON/OFF player in the Bagley starting 5 from last year, was Fox. Ayton was negative for Phoenix. Barnes, Hield, Holmes all +6! Now maybe that speaks more to how horrible the bench was to have such a ON/OFF differential for them as a 5 and that may speak to the Hali line up too.
But they also had to play some minutes with those bench guys too and that counts in their BPM, ON/OFF as well. Which for 2/3’s the season we know was a dumpster fire. I’m sure NBA teams parse through all that data and break it down even more specifically.
Obviously I don’t think they are as good as the Suns or Bucks starting 5. Eye test and overall results tell me that much. But I think they are a middle of the pack 5 or slightly above, if they play like they did last year. Can a average bench = average team? Dunno.
Upon digging deeper…the Hali starting/closing 5 was +16 net rating before the All Star Break. They were only +2 after the A.S. break. Roughly similar sample.
I don’t know what to make of that, except maybe league not as surprised by/gameplan Hali. Just thought it was interesting.
The Bagley 5 had almost no minutes after the break, so that number just is what it is I guess.
And yet, none of the other player encompassing stats – ESPN’s RPM, 538’s RAPTOR, Net Rating, Box Plus Minus, VORP, etc., not to mention the win column, sees these players as a collective of massively plus players.
The overall plus/minus (versus opponents) of these players looks like this (via BBRef)
Bagley: -3.2
Barnes: -1.1
Hield: -1.6
Fox: -4.5
Holmes: +0.5
The Kings were 6.9 points better with Hield on the floor than off, but they’re 1.6 points worse than their opponents with him playing. That holds true for pretty much every other individual player in the starting five lineup we’ve been discussing.
Does this mean the players outside those six (including Halliburton) were so terrible that they destroyed a conference finals level lineup?
The Kings starters overall were -1.3 per 100 possessions versus their opponents, which is 21st in the league. The Kings bench was -3.2 versus their opponents, which is 25th in the league. This doesn’t make it look like the bench was dragging the starters down to the degree that they took a lineup that’s better than the Suns to finishing 21st in the league in the standings.
Is there also a possibility that Walton pulled these lineups off the floor any time the other team got on a run, and then never put them back, instead subbing in other players, or letting the bench get skunked by the other team’s starters? I don’t know the answer, but the Kings were +8.6 in wins and -13.0 in losses.
I’ll grant the the team’s behavior (tinkering with the bench) makes it seem like they believe it’s true that they have a hidden, championship level roster on the team. If these lineups are really that good, we should see similar plus/minus data immediately (same players, after all) and we should immediately see the team play well above .500 basketball. We should also see a very short rotation, since if the lineup data is true, you’ve got six players in two combinations who are clearly better than the Suns starters and almost as good as the Bucks.
Suffice it to say, I’m not putting my money on any of that being true.
I don’t take issue with some of that and like some of the stats. But…
No one insinuated that , I even directly said they obviously weren’t as good and called them average, so that’s not really the discussion.
To your point, in my mind, part of the explanation for Buddy’s -1.6 overall on court are minutes he played with guys like Joseph and Whiteside, who were his personal two worst 2 man combinations by far.
Examples:
Hield, Fox, Barnes, Hali, Holmes = +7 per 100 (400 minutes)
Hield, Fox, Barnes, Bagley, Holmes = +7 (400 mins)
Hield, Fox, Barnes, Holmes, Joseph = -17
Hield, Fox, Barnes, Hali, Bagley (center!) = -25
Hield, Fox, Barnes, Hali, Whiteside = -25
Now some of these are limited minutes (40-50), but they all are positive groups in 5 man line ups, without the bolded player as their 5th. Every single one of Buddy’s 4 man line ups are positive except, wait for it…ones with Joseph and Whiteside. And it’s not like they were -4 in 50 mins…they got flippin’ destroyed with those guys and lineups.
Actually just looked and all of Fox’s 4 man line ups are positive except…you guessed it, the ones with Joseph and Whiteside. Wait, what about Barnes 4 man line ups…amazingly exactly the same. It’s almost comical. Might be similar stories for some of the others, haven’t looked. My eye test personally didn’t tell me Joseph/Whiteside were that bad, even though I knew it wasn’t good. I must have been a sucker for Cory dribbling for 14 seconds straight and then diving on the floor after he lost his dribble…looked like he was doing something 🙂
No one is trying to say this is a Top 4 seed in the West and it was only the bench holding them back. But I do think it’s possible this was a .500 team and 8 seed in the West and the bench held them back a few games from that. That’s all.
The easy way to summarize is:
1) The starting and closing line-ups were great
2) Any line-up that had Joseph or GR3 on the floor was terrible
3) Any line-up that didn’t have Holmes at center was terrible
4) Line-ups that combined 2 & 3 were extra super terrible
5) All other line-ups ranged from somewhat bad to somewhat good
Lots of parsing of data to make inferences, some with limited data sets. Nonetheless, it may be that the FO believes in the core starting lineups, and they may be correct. The analysis points to the fact that the primary issues were bench and backup bigs (any lineup without Holmes was horrible). You have to think that one of TT or Len at C will be more serviceable than Whiteside and that some combo of Mitchell, Davis, and Harkless will be a better replacement than Joseph or GRIII. In that sense, while I’d love to see some return for malcontents Hield and Bagley, going into the season with the current roster leaves some room for optimism (development of Fox and Hali along with improved big and bench depth). This is probably why McNair isn’t dumping either of them without any ROI and simply doesn’t believe in addition by subtraction.
I’d be cool with keeping Buddy. I’d do whatever possible to move Bagley for a small forward who can play some D.
That’s all nice, but when will we defend our crown?
Next summer.
And one more day until the NBA schedule for this upcoming season gets released (12pm PDT), if I recall correctly.
“Starting from a South Georgia small city, Hinesville, that nobody knows about it. When people ask me, I say I’m from Savannah.
https://www.slamonline.com/the-magazine/baylor-davion-mitchell-is-proving-that-greatness-comes-out-of-hinesville-ga/
…
“I’m from Sacramento.”
“Where?”
“…San Francisco.”
I see Lady Bird or Greta Gerwig pictures, I upvote immediately
102-0 starts here!
Nice to see some TKH positivity lately. Let’s hope for the best
Yes, this is good
It’s the offseason. It is THE time for optimism in Sacramento.
Once the regular season will be on its way the shit will hit the Kings fan.
Yes we’ll see the “turn the corner” comments during a win streak, only to realize they are driving in circles back into wildfire basketball hell. It is at this time I optimistically expect Monte to pull the trigger and get rid of Lose Walton 🙂
The next few weeks will be so boring.
Ben Simmons or bust!
Fox
Hali
Barnes
Simmons
Holmes
That lineup is legit.
So going for bust = giving up our busts in a deal for a star? I thought it meant something else.
Exactly
https://www.phlsportsnation.com/2021/08/17/morey-moves-philly-sacramento-charlotte-trade-possibility/?fbclid=IwAR316q0cqJs4ZefkUY8Jlfh_QLT0yuNDo_wG3DI2sXjVXxR5ikq1MSD461I
I like this idea!
I like it but I guess I’m not sure why Charlotte would agree?
I mean, Charlotte just gave Rozier 4 years at $97M…
Badge Legend