Welcome back to Chainmail, where the turkey is defr….hold on one sec. WILL! Get the turkey out of the freezer and see if it’ll fit in the microwave…sorry about that. Welcome back to Chainmail, where the turkey is defrosting very, very quickly, eleven pans of green bean casserole are being prepared because it is the best dish of the day, and yogurt pie is served for a delectable, high-class treat.
This past week or so has brought both joy and devastation to the Kingdom, similar to Aunt Terry who blesses you with delicious stuffing and then curses you with green (throws up in mouth but swallows it) jello (throws up and doesn’t swallow it) salad. The Kings enjoyed a fantastic draft, selecting Tyrese Haliburton, a top-5 talent, 12th overall, and then followed that up by taking two potential late first rounders in the low forties with Robert Woodard and Jahmi’us Ramsey.
As with all things Kings-related in this universe, that delightful day was followed by some consternation and confusion. We’re now six days into free agency, and Monte McNair has yet to pull the trigger on a single signing, and he also allowed Bogdan Bogdanovic to bounce to Atlanta for no compensation after a pretty attractive deal with the Milwaukee Bucks fell apart. It’s been a confusing little while for the fan base.
So let’s talk about how your feeling! Who do you think the Kings should pursue in free agency? Do you believe Will or I would have handled the Bogi situation differently? What would be our player or role comps for our new draftees? Does Will own all of Twitter after Tuesday night’s beautiful performance and his winning mindset?
Before we get to our questions, we also want to thank our sponsor for the mailbag, Carter Imports! Carter Imports is a Sacramento-based company that imports some of the very best Extra Virgin Olive Oil and Cretan Thyme Honey available in the world today. There has never been a better time to support one of our own than right now!
Now get to asking, so we can get to answering!
Now what?
It will work out. Even Rocky the owl got released from the evil chopped down Christmas tree Debacle.
The Herald is brave for opening up chainmail the day after the Bogi situation…here comes the flood of questions!
I’m curious to know how you guys were able to land Jerry Reynolds to become part of the Kings Herald family. Was it easier/harder than you thought it was going to be? Were there other people you had in mind if Jerry didn’t work out?
Kilo after kilo of raw, uncut coke.
Are we tanking or aren’t we tanking?
See, I define tanking in the traditional sense, which is not intentionally losing. It’s going young to grow something better, collecting assets, and maintaining financial flexibility – all of which are likely result in additional losses in the short term and potentially more valuable draft assets as a result.
So yes, or at least I sincerely hope that is what we are doing.
I’d have to see a couple more data points to really say either way.
For sure. Small sample size so far suggests he is going to emphasis growth in the young core and de-emphasis older and more expensive veterans.
Of course, he could go out and sign Whiteside for a bunch of money and we would be right back at square one.
Kinda. I mean, we basically have two data points so far:
Ultimately, it’s also reasonable that he simply didn’t see either of them as significant moves in either direction.
We also have the Fox deal, but I think that one was just a given regardless of overall direction of the franchise. The extension was inevitable and could reasonably be considered part of either path.
I think Giles wanted no part of Sacramento.
This is kinda my assumption as well, honestly. And really, unless they were going to offer him A LOT more money, why would he?
Why are you saying that the failure to retain Giles by Divac provides any indication as to McNair’s strategy?
I’m not saying that definitively. And you’re right that because of Divac’s choice, Monte didn’t really decide to retain or not retain Giles. He decided not to pursue a particular free agent. Ultimately, as I said, I don’t think we really have any definitively clues to McNair’s overall vision yet.
I think not matching on Bobo sends a pretty clear signal, even if it’s only to serve notice that he’s not going to automatically do what Vlade Divac would have done in the same situation. Hell, were he still in charge, he’d have somehow managed to pay Bogdan even more money.
More data points:
I think both of those are pretty clear indicators of the front office’s priorities. The Giles situation…that one definitely seems to go counter to the narrative to me.
We’ll see if the Whiteside rumors are true, as well.
You mean something we should have done two years ago. Sign me up.
Above average players (Barnes, Bogi, Hield) work great with superstars, we lack superstars at this juncture. Possibly Fox, wishing upon a star, he becomes a superstar and selling my soul Bagley does also, but draft is where we can cash in for the future and or trade for an up and coming star with high draft amo
Given how McNair has handled the draft and free agency, what further moves or strategy would qualify McNair as successful in his first year as GM(in your opinion)?
I think this is a really interesting question. He has instant good will for just not being Vlade, but that could change quickly if the team is enduring multiple long losing streaks (which I think is likely).
Well, fuck me. I just saw the Whiteside notification so I think we all know the answer before I even asked the question. I should be asking: who is actually running the Kings and why do they keep repeating the same mistakes?
Has to be his ability to dump the albatross contracts for draft picks and/or young players, right?
We all know what launched the warriors dynasty: them signing Steph to a highly undervalued contract in 2013 due to his bum ankles.
I have this fantasy / delusion about Marvin Bagley’s injuries being a blessing in disguise. If the Kings can sign him long term at a low rate due to his prolific injury history, and he can then stay on the court and fulfill his potential like Steph did – together with the kings tanking this season for a high 2021 draft pick, that pick being a stud, fox taking a leap, some other lucky breaks here and there – I feel like that’s our best shot at realizing enough upside to become a championship contender.
So the question is – what are the chances Bagley’s injuries turn out to be a blessing in disguise?
Is this VIvek?
Thoughts on Jeremy Lin on a slightly above minimum contract to mentor Haliburton?
What’s your thoughts on Buddy Hield liking this tweet? I’ll be honest, it’s the last straw for me with this ð¤¡
He is going to get his chance to start and prove himself, and this is how he responds to the challenge?
At this point, you have to wonder if he’s wading into full locker room cancer territory. Fighting with the coach, trashing the org publicly, vocal about not even wanting to play for the team.
Exactly my fear, and while I was OK letting Bogi walk, this sort of behavior reminds me of why it was a risky move.
It also begs the question, how is Buddy going to perform? Is he going to sulk, and further tank his value, while requesting Monte to trade him?
If he’s being played properly, he’s likely to have success, in which case, his attitude will be fine.
I should clarify that I don’t think that situational good vibes are nearly enough for a professional to muster. He’s got to grow up in that regard, and at twenty-eight, you generally don’t find big personality adjustments. It may be that he is who we think he is.
He’s a small minded narcissist who can’t dribble
I think the message to Buddy should be something like this…
“Look, we know you want to be traded and we are willing to accommodate that desire. What we need from you is to play hard and stay positive so that it will make you more desirable to other teams. Continuing to play poorly, pout, make negative comments to the media only lowers the likelihood that we can trade you.”
To me, it’s clear that he already has that reputation around the league, which is why he may not have the trade value that a shooter of his caliber should have.
This is why I hate the idea of adding Whiteside to this locker room. 3 young draft picks don’t need to see Buddy and Hassan giggling in the corner of the locker room after a loss, posting dumb GIFs to Twitter.
just Wow. what a piece of shit.
fuck Buddy Hield.
I love that this was edited.
Buddy sucks too much on the court to also suck this much off the court imo
Who gets traded first: Buddy Hield or Harrison Barnes?
You haven’t heard? Buddy Hield is the only player in the NBA that is untradable.
well… him and John Wall. Sorry.
[Giant Bong Rip]
Wall for Hield, Barnes and (maybe) Cash Considerations.
[checks NBA Trade Machine]
Furk.
That Cash Considerations dude is a tough MF’er to move.
What does Walton have to do to keep his job this season?
Not be Walton for about 70 games or so.
Stay away, except to bring breakfast burritos once a week.
What potential trades do you see for guys like Buddy, Barnes, CoJo, Bjelica?
How do you plan to cope through the painful part of a proper team building endeavor? Do you have any advice to Kings fans who have grown attached to some the players from the Vlade era?
Who’s left in free agency that you would sign?
I am available. Six figure salary is fine, I don’t even need a seventh digit!
I would gladly be the token “end of the bench white guy waving a towel and giving high-fives” on an NBA roster. And I would even do it for less than the league minimum!
I’d do it for nothing, if I would get free breakfasts.
Breakfasts, you say?
We already hired that guy to be head coach.
Who do we have under contract?
Perimeter
Fox
Joseph
Hield
James
Haliburton (presumedly)
Woodard (presumedly)
Jeffries (presumedly)
Ramsey (Presumedly)
Big
Barnes
Bjelica
Bagley
Parker
Holmes
So that’s 13. Room for 5 more including two-way slots. With some desperate need at C and SF, IMO.
So I’d say:
O’Quinn
Korkmaz
Patton (2-way)
Lamine Diane (2-way)
And one of Bates-Diop, Zhaire Smith, MKG, RHJ, Iwundu, N’Doye
And/or obviously sit back and see who shakes loose from other rosters.
Kings attempted to sign Iwundu, but he signed with the Mavericks instead. I would look at Zhaire and Korkmaz. Younger guys with some potential.
Beat me to it.
Who is “Perimeter” and can he play center or SF?
Also, have we gotten Cash Considerations this year yet? He seems to always be in the King’s offseason plans.
No, this year we go with Cap Flexibility.
well, Considerations wasn’t helping in the win column. Maybe Flexibility can contribute moving forward.
Just posted on Kings site 2nd rounder and cash considerations for the draft rights to KMart Jr
Cash Considerations retired to The Palms a few years back:
Meter is only a little over 3ft. So don’t count on Peri contributing at the 4/5
METRIC SYSTEM HUMOR.
AND 1!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
𤣠𤣠𤣠ð¤£
I’d get behind korkmaz and zhaire, but iwundu is off the table.
What are you thankful for in 2020, after everything that’s happened and is still happening?
Following this team is like attending a vegan thanksgiving. Your thoughts?
My daughter went vegan a few years back. Tomorrow, we will attempt to make the Trader Joe’s version of Tofurky for her.
I have been vegan for a few years. Had that Tofurkey thing from Trader Joe’s and it was good.
Thanks Hobby – I’ve tried some of her vegan stuff (tofu dumplings, beyond burgers, etc), they’ve really upped their game.
I stick more of a conventional vegan diet. Fruit, veggies, nuts. There are some good Chickpea or Lentil noodles out there. I tend to avoid the fake meat type products, generally, due to all the added ingredients that I can not pronounce.
Honestly, I don’t really get the fake meat thing. If I’m making a vegan meal, which I do pretty regularly for family members and friends, I don’t really feel the need to include things pretending to be meat.
Defeats the purpose, imo
I suppose it depends on your rational for being Vegan. I mean, if you LOVE the meat experience, but HATE the ethical issues. Then I guess I can kinda see it.
But if you’re vegan primarily for health benefits, then it makes zero sense at all.
Again, I’d just as soon let non-meat things be non-meat things. A good pumpkin curry is as good or better than anything meat based anyway.
Agree on that.
*rationale.
Goldernit!
Depends on how much work you like to do. When my wife (who actually knows how to cook) makes dinner, she works it most of the time to make any meat separately and add it just to ours, or we do the vegan thing as well.
If I have to make her dinner, the kid’s getting something out of a box or a bag.
That’s just science, bro.
Thumbs up for repoing science!
I have no doubt this kid will get there eventually. She’s stuck with the vegan lifestyle since she was 15, I thought for sure she’d give it up.
Despite being a meat-eater, I have to say I’ve been part of a couple extremely delicious Thanksgiving/Friendsgiving meals. So hopefully, it ends up being a lot like those in terms of “making something high-quality and enjoyable despite working with limited resources.”
Yea we’ve had some good Friendsgiving memories as well, not having family around.
I’m on day 12 of a flooring, bathroom x2, and whole house paint remodel, displaced in our freezing garage. I could definitely do an epic run-on sentence for sure, so anything my wife is able to pull off tomorrow will be nothing short of a miracle.
That is an epic remodel, indeed.
Two part question:
A.) What is the exact amount of cap space that was secured by not matching Bogi’s offer?
B.) What do you see as possible uses of that cap space (i.e. bad contract with pick/prospect; free agent haha).
And Bonus third part:
C.) Are any of those possible scenarios in using the cap space more beneficial to the Kings than Bogi’s value as a trade asset?
C. Yes. Cap flexibility allows you to absorb crappy deals like the Nic Batums of the world if you can extract significant cap assets from him.
For example, Bogi may not have been worth a 1st by himself, but you could get a 1st and more if you take on Batum with that same cap space.
That’s why some of us have been screaming for more cap flexibility for a while now. It allows you to pounce when an opportunity presents itself.
this fact makes me even more angry about the bad choice of Buddy over Bogi or the bad choice of not retaining Bogi to simply trade him later for assets.
Buddy should have been traded on draft night.
They would have more cap space to take on bad contracts had they traded Buddy and kept Bogi instead.
Why is there this belief that teams can just magically force trades in the NBA? This is not a video game. Other teams have to actually agree to the trade offers from other teams. None of us know what deals may or may not have been out there as a return for Buddy or any other player on the roster. If the offers for Buddy was were bad and McNair accepted them , then there would be outrage that he got swindled. Damned if he does, damned if he doesn’t.
I am confident that Monty has been exploring Buddy trades.
Yeah, I suspect Buddy’s market may take some time to develop, and that he’s actually a better candidate to move closer to the deadline.
Monty is going to shed all of Buddy, Bogi, Barnes and CoJo. However, they are all different assets. Bogi was a RFA, which made the process different than trading Buddy.
Monty tried to trade Bogi. Bogi’s people blew it up (understandably so, mind you) and so Monty was left with a choice between two things that have risk.
We shall see if we can get value for the rest of the bad assets (based on contract/production value) that Monty inherited.
You could say (if you were so inclined) that Bogi’s people outplayed him.
Or more to the point, they fucked McNair after agreeing in principle to the Milwaukee deal. Two organizations don’t get that close to completing a transaction like that without the player acceding to it. McNair might be new, but he wasn’t born yesterday.
I read that there was discussion of swapping Bledsoe for Bogdan (among other picks, etc) but the Kings were insistent on have DiVicenzo in the deal, which might have thrown a wrench in the deal. Then the Jrue Holiday deal materialized, which made things even more complicated.
I don’t think we will ever know the full story.
Sounds like a potential learning experience then.
Mainly, don’t deal with the clients of that agent.
I guess that’s A way of handling it.
Any thoughts that Bucks taking potential PT away with Jrue deal, was part of the cause for Bogi to pull out?
If he’s under the impression that he’s a starting player on a legit title contender, he is mistaken. So, the Holiday deal may definitely be a factor.
I read that a podcast on The Ringer said that Bledsoe was originally supposed to be part of the BB8 deal. When Bledsoe was traded to NO, the Bucks were no longer able to pay BB8 the amount they promised to pay him. Apparently that’s what caused him to kill the deal.
I read that a podcast on The Ringer said that Bledsoe was originally supposed to be part of the BB8 deal. When Bledsoe was traded to NO, the Bucks were no longer able to pay BB8 the amount they promised to pay him. Apparently that’s what caused him to kill the deal.
For the thousandth time, Bobo signing elsewhere and Hield not being traded have almost nothing to do with one another. Had Hield been traded, I’d assume you match for Bogdan, but you keep insisting that the front office had some sort of great offer for Hield, and passed on it, just to let Bogi walk.
In the absence of even an iota of proof of this ridiculous assertion, it boggles the mind as to why you keep pushing this turd up a steep hill.
Almost as mind boggling as people who say with certainty that we’re tanking.
I don’t recall saying that in the comment to which you responded, but my guess is that this season will be about player development, so the result will be a poor record, whether deliberate or otherwise.
Obviously it depends on the amount of cap space. Others have discussed that the non-match of Bogi in itself yielded around $8m in cap space. I was hoping to get clarification on that number.
And has also been discussed, the drawback to taking on bad contracts is that typically they are for multiple years. And if they are coming packaged with a first, they will be sizable.
Bogi by comparison, as evidenced by the MIL deal, was worth a young rotation player plus a lesser prospect plus an expiring.
So obviously we may differ on this, but I lean toward the Bogi return. Based on the fact we get the youth with no long- term albatross coming back.
Charlotte’s gonna stretch Batum. Additionally, I don’t think the Kings would’ve had enough cap space to trade for him w/o sending Hield or Barnes to Charlotte. Trading Barnes would’ve defeated the purpose of the trade & I’m not sure what Charlotte’s FO thinks of Hield.
We have a traded player exception from Dedmon trade. Why not use it to put waiver claim on just waived young center Justin Patton? Low risk move.
Why?
We need center depth and Patton ( 16th pick a couple of years ago, but injured a lot) is a better option than paying more for the likes of Whiteside.
Monty has made several bad decisions in my estimation. Most notably letting 2 players that were the collective fan favorites walk for absolutely nothing. What hurts some of us even more is they were both easy contracts to keep on the roster and retain quality assets. They’re both outstanding teammates, high IQ, high character guys that could have both potentially been starters on this team as soon as game 1, December 2020 and they returned zero compensation with their departure. Can you find us any silver lining in these decisions that could help us keep the faith in Monty?
Because of Vlade’s incompetence, retaining Giles would have been an overpay. He may still be open to returning after his season in Portland, which I hope sees him healthy.
How much do you think the Kings would have had to offer him?
My recollection is that due to the declined option, the Kings would necessarily have been required to pay him more than any other club, but I’m not aware of the actual minimum amount.
But anytime that you can put your team in a worse position than every other team, VD jumped on it.
I ask because I find it hard to believe it would have been a meaningful overpay. Even if they gave him the same amount as the option, we’re still just talking about paying couple million more than Portland over 1 year.
Team had no control over Giles. I don’t thing overpaying would solve his general distaste for the franchise, and Lose’s inability to maximize his future value. Bogi was duplicitous. As it isn’t my money I would have Dumped Buddy for a late 1st or better and resigned Bogi. But that wouldn’t move the needle really.
Why are people so upset at Monte McNair for Harry Giles departure?
I’m guessing because the previous FO made sure to hype him as savior and now folks are butt hurt.
It wasn’t just the previous FO, the local media was pretty complicit in the Giles hype. “Potential All-Star” was being dished out a few offseasons ago.
I wouldn’t say I’m upset. But he’s a low-risk, young big with uncommon offensive skills and some reason (length and BBIQ) to believe he could become a decent defender. I don’t really see the justification for a team in the Kings position (desperate for cheap young talent with playmaking upside) not to take a chance on a player like him. Though I blame Monte less than Vlade, as I think not picking up the option (and thus retaining low-risk team control over his next couple years) is a bigger sin than letting him walk as an UFA.
Sidenote: If we’re interested in adding a Giles-esque (good passer with offensive skills, needs to bulk up to defend the post, major health concerns) option on the league minimum, Justin Patton is available.
I like his potential coming out of college, then the foot injuries occurred and he never really had a chance to play.
We could get that Bagley guy for most of this.
Only if he suddenly discovers some previously dormant interest in creating for others. Or moving the ball at all.
In my defense I said most!
What happened to Patton? I liked him coming out of college but then he got hurt and was basically never heard from again. Just seems odd for a guy who was a mid first round pick. Never seemed like he even got a shot to play.
The old recurring injuries story.
Yeah all things considered I would have preferred to have Giles around for another season I just don’t get the impression from anything I’ve seen or read that he wanted to be back after Vlade failed to pick up his option. I guess that’s why I’m confused about people being upset at Monte McNair specifically for Giles leaving.
When will the NBA schedule be released?
What should I do with my Bogdan jersey?
Burn it because he signed a contract designed so the Kings wouldn’t match?
Wear it with pride to make sure Kings fans know what could have been when BB8 shares a league Co-MVP trophy with Luka Doncic?
Retire it and hang it next to my Gerald Wallace, IT, and Doncic jerseys?
Or something else?
Could probably get at least a dozen face mask filters out of it.
Haha! Good call.
which Doncic jersey do you have?
Custom Kings Doncic jersey of course. From before the draft.
That’s a shame. Al that needed for it to become a reality was for VD to be aware of the sky’s blueness, and some understanding that water is wet.
Whether it’s a bear or the pope that craps in the woods is still hotly debated.
I also have a custom Doncic Kings jersey. From after the draft. For troll reasons.
sounds like you, and anyone else should stick to Retired guys or 6th man Jerseys.
What would you say are the chances that Fox’s level of play will be worth his max contract? What would he and the team have to accomplish to feel that his contract is justified?
How would you define a successful season for the Sacramento kings? Not thinking about win/loss numbers and thinking more about players and systems. How would you define a successful season for the front office?
If you see the young guys make positive strides, and you enter the offseason with a ton of cap space, that would seem like a good result. If any of Hield, Barnes, Bjelica or CoJo can be flipped for picks and/or expiring contracts, then you’re getting into A+ territory.
Bjelly & Joseph are on expiring contracts, so I wouldn’t trade them for expiring contracts.
Hence “any of” and “and/or.”
The irritation with the Bogi decision is primarily based on losing an asset for nothing. What do you think the Kings could have gotten for Bogi by the trade deadline this year?
Between teams wanting to hold onto cap space for next year, either to compete in a loaded free agent class or just to save money due to declining profits, and teams valuing young players/ draft picks over 28 year old contributors- I can’t think of a team willing to trade useful assets this year.
Other than Fox or the draft, the Kings have been bystanders so far this offseason. Are there rumors out there on potential trades for Holmes, Cojo, or Bjelica or any interest in free agents not named Whiteside?
What would be the ideal season for the Kings? For me, the ideal season would be the following:
That is a lot, but as a Kings’ fan you have to keep dreaming most seasons.
9- Luke Walton replaced by Kenny Atkinson
10 – Ramsey = Westbrook 2.0
If even a majority of your list can be checked off, that’s a tremendous year. Kudos to our man Meads for the addendum.
Can you please explain THIS?
https://twitter.com/wojespn/status/1331731440225177600
It’s not OK, we have Whiteside.
Do you buy this narrative that Luke Walton is just a young coach and have room to grow to become a decent coach?
I’ve got two questions:
Have you guys looked into the ’21 draft?
It reminds me of the Fox draft where I would be comfortable anywhere in the top 5 (preferably 1). I like Cunningham, Boston, Green, Kuminga, Zaire Williams+…
2. Who would you like the Kings to go after next free agency?
I would offer the Bogi contract to Kelly Oubre Jr.
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